TheProfessor
Pro
Mike McCallum WAS a great fighter (BTW Julian Jackson was incredibly overrated) but since he didn't accomplish as much as Hagler...he's not as good as Hagler. Simple. Losing to greater fighters doesn't make you as good.
HBO Legendary Nights: "Sugar" Ray Leonard vs. "Marvelous" Marvin Hagler
- Thread starter SuikodenII
- Start date
explain the bolded breh
TheProfessor
Pro
He certainly doesn't belong in the same sentence as James Toney. Jackson was a talented fighter with frightening power but he was also weak-chinned and was flattened early by the best boxers he faced.
Amare's Right Hook
Southeast World Champion
I don't know man, the Hawk could punch. Who were the best he faced anyway ?
TheProfessor
Pro
Gerald McClellan laid him out early twice and McCallum pulled it off in two rounds.
His 2 signature wins are against Terry Norris and Herol Graham..both of which he flattened; he also fought mike mccallum and you forget @TheProfessor he had Mike in trouble in that first round before Mike stopped him. He's also known for his 2 fights with Gerald McClellan. He warred with McClellan for 5 rounds in the first round before he was stopped. That wasn't early. The second fight he was taken out in the first though. He prolly played a part in McClellan's eventual undoing even though he was ko'ed in both of those fights
As for SRL/Hagler, I always felt Leonard won that fight in a 7 rds to 5 type of way. Hagler losing those early rounds came back to bite him in the ass. People like to act like Ray waited for Hagler to get old, but he got older as well and had a career threatening eye injury that led to a long lay off. All things consider I think they were equal with each other in terms of ring age, but Ray was just the better fighter that night plain and simple.
That fight was also a good example of ring generalship winning a boxing match. Leonard boxed when he needed to, fought when he had to, and stole close rounds with flurries when the time came.
That fight was also a good example of ring generalship winning a boxing match. Leonard boxed when he needed to, fought when he had to, and stole close rounds with flurries when the time came.
TheProfessor
Pro
Jackson was a damn good fighter - especially at 154 but was it a surprise he KO'ed a young Norris? Norris' chin was weaker than his, if possible. And Graham was a good, not great fighter. The other fights you mention underline my point - he was KO'ed in 2 by McCallum and then KO'ed twice by McClellan, both times early. When I say early I mean before we reached the halfway point...and in the rematch he didn't last 3 minutes.
King P
Legends Never Die
The whole thing about Julian Jackson having a glass jaw is an overstatement IMO. He could be hit/stunned, but he wasn't outright put out.
I actually watched his bout with Thomas Tate recently, and he took some hard shots from Tate in the fight.
McCallum was the only guy to stop Jackson in his prime, and Mike was a heavy hitter. And Jackson was still on his feet when the fight was stopped. I also don't put too much stock in the McClellan knockouts because
A) G-Man had one hitter quitter power
B) By the time Julian got him, he was having alot of problems with his vision due to his retina damage, and was on the downside of his career anyway after 50+ fight.
By the 2nd fight, he was basically a spent fighter with a deteriorated chin. Counting that is like counting SLR's KO to Camacho.
Basically, I'm not saying Jackson had an iron chin, but it wasn't glass like everybody has made it out to be.
I actually watched his bout with Thomas Tate recently, and he took some hard shots from Tate in the fight.
McCallum was the only guy to stop Jackson in his prime, and Mike was a heavy hitter. And Jackson was still on his feet when the fight was stopped. I also don't put too much stock in the McClellan knockouts because
A) G-Man had one hitter quitter power
B) By the time Julian got him, he was having alot of problems with his vision due to his retina damage, and was on the downside of his career anyway after 50+ fight.
By the 2nd fight, he was basically a spent fighter with a deteriorated chin. Counting that is like counting SLR's KO to Camacho.
Basically, I'm not saying Jackson had an iron chin, but it wasn't glass like everybody has made it out to be.
TheProfessor
Pro
He had suspect whiskers. Taking shots from Thomas Tate proves little BTW. Tate had solid power, at best. But anyway, my argument wasn't over his whiskers but just how good a fighter he was. And the idea that Hagler never faced anyone as dangerous as him is just ridiculous IMO.