dantheman9758
All Star
I've now accumulated concrete measurement data for all 5 of the top 5 1960's decade players and the pattern I noticed a few years back continues to remain consistent. Height information back then is essentially just their barefoot height data with "inflation" being rare and never actually exceeding a fraction of an inch. In fact, based on the players I've researched (even outside the top 5) it appears more likely a player would SUBTRACT any of the additional fractions of an inch (even if mathematically they SHOULD have rounded up) there by often undervaluing their height info back then. Weight info from all these players tends to originate from their NCAA/draft/rookie list info, as most of these players put on weight almost immediately from the NCAA with the exception of Elgin Baylor whom after knee surgery "slimmed" down to 214 in 1966 for 1 season temporarily to see if it would aid his quickness. For w/e reason Wilt's weight info is the odd one out (for any player back then, not just the top 5 guys) because 275lbs wasn't his list info until after his 3rd season. As a rookie, Wilt was listed 250 - though even that is a shaved number that was 8lbs under what he actually tipped the scale at as a rookie according to a detailed story on him 1 month before his NBA debut.
Oscar Robertson Listed: 6-5 205
Actual:
6-4.75 w/o shoes
205-220lbs
Jerry West Listed: 6-2 175
Actual:
6-2.75 w/o shoes
6-9 wingspan
175-188lbs
Elgin Baylor Listed: 6-5 225
Actual:
6-5 w/o shoes
214-236lbs
Bill Russell Listed 6-9 215
Actual:
6-9.63 w/o shoes
7-4 wingspan
215-240lbs
Wilt Chamberlain Listed 7-1 275
Actual:
7-1.06 w/o shoes
7-8 wingspan
258-320lbs
These are just the top 5 guys from back then. I have uncovered miscellaneous height w/o shoes/weight/wingspan info of many other players back then and the trend remains the same up until what appears to be some time in the 1970's to early 1980's. That's when the really ridiculous list info started to pop up like "7-4 Ralph Sampson" and "6-9 Magic Johnson"... Sampson being only 7-1 w/o shoes (with a 7-4 wingspan) and Magic being only 6-7.5 w/o shoes respectively. At that early of a time, shoes can't even be attributed to the difference in list info because shoes were still not being manufactured with the incredibly thick padding of modern shoes (which began in the mid 1980's). Quite literally, agents/teams/players/promoters or whomever, were simply fudging list info. It wasn't until the early 90's that players/draft agents started referring to their height as "in shoes" as a means to justify boosted height values. I believe this was an excuse, rather than the actual underlying reason list info was inflated. Because the inflating pre-dated the thick shoes that were eventually being manufactured and even today players will still inflate their list info even beyond the thickness of their shoes.
Reason I bring all this up is because in recent weeks I saw a poster or two on here try to say Bill Russell was "Tmac's size" which isn't even close. Take everything u see on bball reference or NBA.com with a grain of Salt. The entire basketball system today from High School to NCAA/NBA massively inflates player size today - and based on the few dozen players I've found measurement data from back then the same wasn't true of players from the Bill Russell/Wilt Chamberlain era.
Now - go ahead and check out www.draftexpress.com/measurements and comparie the data of the top 5 guys from the 1960's to their modern counterparts - u be surprised how well those guys stack up.
Oscar Robertson Listed: 6-5 205
Actual:
6-4.75 w/o shoes
205-220lbs
Jerry West Listed: 6-2 175
Actual:
6-2.75 w/o shoes
6-9 wingspan
175-188lbs
Elgin Baylor Listed: 6-5 225
Actual:
6-5 w/o shoes
214-236lbs
Bill Russell Listed 6-9 215
Actual:
6-9.63 w/o shoes
7-4 wingspan
215-240lbs
Wilt Chamberlain Listed 7-1 275
Actual:
7-1.06 w/o shoes
7-8 wingspan
258-320lbs
These are just the top 5 guys from back then. I have uncovered miscellaneous height w/o shoes/weight/wingspan info of many other players back then and the trend remains the same up until what appears to be some time in the 1970's to early 1980's. That's when the really ridiculous list info started to pop up like "7-4 Ralph Sampson" and "6-9 Magic Johnson"... Sampson being only 7-1 w/o shoes (with a 7-4 wingspan) and Magic being only 6-7.5 w/o shoes respectively. At that early of a time, shoes can't even be attributed to the difference in list info because shoes were still not being manufactured with the incredibly thick padding of modern shoes (which began in the mid 1980's). Quite literally, agents/teams/players/promoters or whomever, were simply fudging list info. It wasn't until the early 90's that players/draft agents started referring to their height as "in shoes" as a means to justify boosted height values. I believe this was an excuse, rather than the actual underlying reason list info was inflated. Because the inflating pre-dated the thick shoes that were eventually being manufactured and even today players will still inflate their list info even beyond the thickness of their shoes.
Reason I bring all this up is because in recent weeks I saw a poster or two on here try to say Bill Russell was "Tmac's size" which isn't even close. Take everything u see on bball reference or NBA.com with a grain of Salt. The entire basketball system today from High School to NCAA/NBA massively inflates player size today - and based on the few dozen players I've found measurement data from back then the same wasn't true of players from the Bill Russell/Wilt Chamberlain era.
Now - go ahead and check out www.draftexpress.com/measurements and comparie the data of the top 5 guys from the 1960's to their modern counterparts - u be surprised how well those guys stack up.
so u try to sneak a 1 star on the thread ratings? 
