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Black Thought and Redman: A Lyrical Summit Between Two Legendary MCs
Redman and Black Thought of the Roots talk about the art of lyricism, early hip-hop inspiration, skydiving, wellness, and more in this new interview
www.rollingstone.com
Within minutes of arriving at the studio for their Musicians on Musicians shoot, Redman and Black Thought are exchanging daps and catching up like old friends — because they are. The two voluble MCs, who took parallel paths to fame in the Nineties, laugh and swap stories in the dressing room while the cameras are getting positioned a few feet away. When it’s time for the filmed conversation to start, they simply walk over to the set and keep talking — about how they’ve inspired each other to step up their lyrical techniques; about close friends gone too soon; about how much they’ve enjoyed their recent collaborations at Roots Picnic events in L.A. and Philadelphia. Redman, 55, is feeling creatively energized after the 2024 release of Muddy Waters Too, a sequel to his classic 1996 album, Muddy Waters, and Black Thought, 52, shares that the Roots are almost done with their first album since 2014. When they reach the end of the time allotted for this conversation, nearly two hours after it starts, these microphone masters don’t want to stop. “One more question!” Redman insists. “We want to do another hour,” Black Thought adds, with a laugh.
Redman: When did our paths first cross? I know my path started from the Roots album [1996’s Illadelph Halflife]. You all was in my CD player. You all was part of my growth of dopeness and the caliber of how I should be spitting — especially you, bro, especially songs like “[Concerto of the] Desperado.” You held the high bar of what an MC should be.
Black Thought: Wow. Me and Malik , who, rest in peace, was the other MC earlier on in the Roots — in college, all we used to listen to was your shyt! I had a suspicion that you were a Roots fan. But when you dropped that line, “I love to burn to the roots” [on LL Cool J’s 1997 song “4, 3, 2, 1”], that was it. “I told you! You heard, he said it!” That was validating for me as an MC, and for the Roots. Because when we came out, we had the live instrumentation, but we had to approximate the sample sound. We were always concerned about how that was going to be received. I felt like me and Malik almost had to rap harder. We had to overcompensate as writers, as lyricists, as performers to make folks comfortable with the fact that we were playing with a big upright bass.
Redman: I can honestly say, bro, on the Muddy Waters album, when me and [Method Man] did this song called “Do What Ya Feel,” that whole round was inspired from you. If you listen to it, you’ll hear how I caught your flow a little bit. Especially then, I was deep in the Roots. Every time I go overseas, Roots is my first CD I’m popping in for that excitement, for that hype I need to get before stage.
Black Thought: That means so much, bro. [Questlove] is going to lose it when I tell him.
Redman: Plus, I always admire it, too, like, “How the fukk do you remember all these rhymes, bro?” Your brain is crazy! I got to spend two months with the headphones on in the gym trying to go over songs and remember them. You, bro, when you do the Picnic or the show we just did out in L.A. — the rhymes onstage, you wasn’t even using the prompter. It was there, but you wasn’t even using it. I’m like, “Damn, man, how the fukk he writing rhymes to our beat?”
Black Thought: I think there’s something to be said about the level of professionalism that MCs from our graduating class have in our flexibility, the way that we keep it malleable. We expect to have to improvise.… I’m a little bit younger than you. I was born in ’73 in October, a couple months after they say hip-hop came along after the party up at Sedgwick [Avenue in the Bronx]. You were three or four years old, though, right? Do you remember as a young person what it felt like when hip-hop came? I have no memories of a time when it didn’t exist.
Redman: Yeah, it was Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Five. When I first heard “The Adventures of Grandmaster Flash,” I was like, “Wow, what is this?” And then it moved on to Run-D.M.C. When I first seen them — not just heard them, but when I seen them with the black leather and the Adidas — I was like, “I got to be a part of this music.” It was something that changed my life, meaning I don’t care about the money, I don’t care about the fame, I just want to do this the rest of my life, for the love of it.… Who was your inspiration artist that helped mold you?
