Blacks, Whites, Lefties & righties watch this out

[David_TheMan]

Thomas Sowell is no doubt a smart economist, but the key is how you gather the data. He points out that while both he and the questioner both looked into employment statistics, they gathered the data differently (single women vs never married, etc.). Also, in that short clip we don't dive deeper into why there are so many differences in the lives of people. For instance, he says that very few black 2-parent households have two college educated parents. Why though? Why do blacks and whites, living in the same city, get exposed to two different lives and take two different paths? I think when we're talking about wage/employment discrepancies we aren't looking at hiring practices and such, but rather the root causes that lead to different people making such consistently different decisions.


Also, that hair

He actually does go into that in his books, or atleast posits his ideas as to why. I posted a zippyshare link to one of his books that covers it Black Rednecks and White Liberals.
I think this convo was just specifically targeted at this white feminist.
Dr. Curry also loves to debunk white femnists trying to claim gender/pay disparity. He points out white women on average make more than black and hispanic men. black men make around 40c to 1 dollar a white man makes black women make around 38c to 1 dollar a white man makes. The deeper you go the more you realize what game these white liberals are trying to run.

 

[Maschine_Man]

He actually does go into that in his books, or atleast posits his ideas as to why. I posted a zippyshare link to one of his books that covers it Black Rednecks and White Liberals.
I think this convo was just specifically targeted at this white feminist.
Dr. Curry also loves to debunk white femnists trying to claim gender/pay disparity. He points out white women on average make more than black and hispanic men. black men make around 40c to 1 dollar a white man makes black women make around 38c to 1 dollar a white man makes. The deeper you go the more you realize what game these white liberals are trying to run.

in 2017??

I don't think so.

 

[David_TheMan]

in 2017??

I don't think so.

I was wrong
black men 65-65 per 1 dollar of white men.
black women 61-62 per 1 dollar of white men

 

[Maschine_Man]

I was wrong
black men 65-65 per 1 dollar of white men.
black women 61-62 per 1 dollar of white men

I didn't watch the video(doesn't show up at work).

but are they getting those numbers the same way these feminists get their numbers?

or are they comparing same position, same job, same education, etc.?

 

[David_TheMan]

I didn't watch the video(doesn't show up at work).

but are they getting those numbers the same way these feminists get their numbers?

or are they comparing same position, same job, same education, etc.?

bureau of labor and statistics
Impossible to do job for job comparisons, even though smaller studies do show that black men will make less than white men in same position in certain career fields.

 

[Maschine_Man]

bureau of labor and statistics
Impossible to do job for job comparisons, even though smaller studies do show that black men will make less than white men in same position in certain career fields.

Oh, I am not disagreeing that, I'm just saying, it's easy to skew the stats to fit a certain narrative without actually looking at the numbers holistically.

IN reality the numbers are a lot closer than most would like to admit (for the most part). but that doesn't sound as polarizing as when you create these big gaps and push a certain narrative.

 

[David_TheMan]

Oh, I am not disagreeing that, I'm just saying, it's easy to skew the stats to fit a certain narrative without actually looking at the numbers holistically.

IN reality the numbers are a lot closer than most would like to admit (for the most part). but that doesn't sound as polarizing as when you create these big gaps and push a certain narrative.

Seems you want to go out of your way to justify there being a difference than simply admitting that racism exists and is practiced and black people are usually the ones getting the negative end of it, black men and women at the expense of white men and white women.

 

[Maschine_Man]

Seems you want to go out of your way to justify there being a difference than simply admitting that racism exists and is practiced and black people are usually the ones getting the negative end of it, black men and women at the expense of white men and white women.

yes that's what I'm doing.

How about people argue with actual facts and numbers and not just pick and choose stats to push clear agenda driven narratives?

It's hard to fight for justice when no one wants to fight for honesty.

 

[David_TheMan]

yes that's what I'm doing.

How about people argue with actual facts and numbers and not just pick and choose stats to push clear agenda driven narratives?

It's hard to fight for justice when no one wants to fight for honesty.

You aren't really fighting for honesty, because you can't make a honest claim or present facts on your own that what I've posted what Curry has researched is incorrect of dishonest.
You literally seem to just want to either minimize and excuse the clear and easy to read discrimination and it is interesting to me as to why.
I don't have a problem with facts and figures, none at all, but please if you think I'm wrong present the data and facts and figures.

 

[Maschine_Man]

You aren't really fighting for honesty, because you can't make a honest claim or present facts on your own that what I've posted what Curry has researched is incorrect of dishonest.
You literally seem to just want to either minimize and excuse the clear and easy to read discrimination and it is interesting to me as to why.
I don't have a problem with facts and figures, none at all, but please if you think I'm wrong present the data and facts and figures.

comparing all wages by race(or gender) then making a statement that "so and so" makes a percentage of what a white man makes is not an empirical study by any means.
its lazy and only proves that white men have more money as a group than those other groups, it doesn't prove discrimination at all.

how does that really show the problems or provide any solutions to the problem? I am NOT denying that discrimination or a wage gap exists. I'm saying that studies like these are only used to further push along an agenda and stirring up dissent.

instead, we should be looking at root causes for individuals, not groups. we should be looking at real cases of discrimination. we should also look at context and other variables when we are looking at why this wage gap exists.


for example.

A black dude at an employer is offered a job making $60,000. as this is his first job out of school, and possibly the first person in his family to make it in to this sector, he is just ecstatic that he got that job, which was more than he was hoping for and walks away knowing that he can finally take her of himself and live a good life.

A white dude at the same employer is offered $60,000 at his first job. Went to the same school as the black dude, and graduated with the same grades and all that. except he was expecting $75,000 cuz his friend works in the same sector and he's making that, and his dad is some big whig at a company across town and he's making a lot of money so he wants to prove to his dad he can pull the big bucks too. And since he has a solid family background, and relative financial security he's thinking that he can try to fight for a little bit more money. So he asks for 75K. Now the employer surely doesn't accept that but decides he'll meet him part way and offers him 68K.

now that shows that the white dude is making more money, but did that show discrimination?

or perhaps there are more psychosocial factors involved here? I've seen that above example happen many times, and not just with black/white men, but with ppl in those types of situations.

where is the context in these numbers?

 

[David_TheMan]

comparing all wages by race(or gender) than making a statement that "so and so" makes a percentage of what a white man is not an empirical study by any means.
its lazy and only proves that white men have more money as a group than those other groups, it doesn't prove discrimination at all.

how does that really show the problems or provide any solutions to the problem? I am NOT denying that discrimination or a wage gap exists. I'm saying that studies like these are only used to further push along an agenda and stirring up dissent.

instead, we should be looking at root causes for individuals, not groups. we should be looking at real cases of discrimination. we should also look at context and other variables when we are looking at why this wage gap exists.


for example.

A black dude at an employer is offered a job making $60,000. as this is his first job out of school, and possibly the first person in his family to make it in to this sector, he is just ecstatic that he got that job, which was more than he was hoping for and walks away knowing that he can finally take her of himself and live a good life.

A white dude at the same employer is offered $60,000 at his first job. Went to the same school as the black dude, and graduated with the same grades and all that. except he was expecting $75,000 cuz his friend works in the same sector and he's making that, and his dad is some big whig at a company across town and he's making a lot of money so he wants to prove to his dad he can pull the big bucks too. And since he has a solid family background, and relative financial security he's thinking that he can try to fight for a little bit more money. So he asks for 75K. Now the employer surely doesn't accept that but decides he'll meet him part way and offers him 68K.

now that shows that the white dude is making more money, but did that show discrimination?

or perhaps there are more psychosocial factors involved here? I've seen that above example happen many times, and not just with black/white men, but with ppl in those types of situations.

where is the context in these numbers?

I know what you think you are trying to do, and I"m saying if you have anything, any studies that actually prove a point you think I"m missing post it.
But trying to go around minimizing racial discrimination in the US by saying its not that bad, isn't really addressing a point, if you aren't posting any thing factual. What its actually doing is simply minimizing racial discimination.

 

[Maschine_Man]

You aren't really fighting for honesty, because you can't make a honest claim or present facts on your own that what I've posted what Curry has researched is incorrect of dishonest.
You literally seem to just want to either minimize and excuse the clear and easy to read discrimination and it is interesting to me as to why.
I don't have a problem with facts and figures, none at all, but please if you think I'm wrong present the data and facts and figures.

Is there no discrimination with Asian men? I mean surely they can't be making more than white men right?
but they do, but quite a bit more. why?

so surely there must be some more reasoning for that. CONTEXT. people completely take out any background info and post these numbers. and it's lazy.

 

[Maschine_Man]

I know what you think you are trying to do, and I"m saying if you have anything, any studies that actually prove a point you think I"m missing post it.
But trying to go around minimizing racial discrimination in the US by saying its not that bad, isn't really addressing a point, if you aren't posting any thing factual. What its actually doing is simply minimizing racial discimination.

no one is trying to minimize anything. just because no one wants to listen to lazy stats doesn't mean anyone is minimizing a thing.


I've acknowledged that discrimination does in fact exist. but to what degree, and in what form? how do we solve it with those lazy ass generalizations?

why are Asian men making more than everyone? surely there must be a reason for it. discrimination?

no. social, cultural, personal, so many factors go in to why these gaps exist. Discrimination is one, but I wouldn't even say its in the top 3 reasons why this gap exists.

 

[David_TheMan]

Is there no discrimination with Asian men? I mean surely they can't be making more than white men right?
but they do, but quite a bit more. why?

so surely there must be some more reasoning for that. CONTEXT. people completely take out any background info and post these numbers. and it's lazy.

Yes there is economic discrimination with asians as well. There are studies about it, they aren't highly published because a great deal of white publications liberal and conservative need to keep the lie/myth of model minority established.

One being that asians live primarily in areas with higher costs of living, so while they have high rates of income, it doesn't equate to wealth. Also asian families tend to live in bigger groups, giving them higher household averages, yet not showing true economic power of asian americans. On top of that asian wealth is far more concentrated than even white americans, which means they are a great deal more asians who live in poverty than white and in lower incomes who aren't easily recognized when looking at data as a whole. (Wealth Inequality Among Asian Americans Greater Than Among Whites - Center for American Progress)

See that is how you can present an argument with naunce right? not simply saying I'm sure some asians doing bad and some are doing good but it isn't that bad. Right?

Its completely intellectually lazy to not actually make or defend a point, and seek to minimize or dismiss argumetns because it doesn't fit what you want.

no one is trying to minimize anything. just because no one wants to listen to lazy stats doesn't mean anyone is minimizing a thing.


I've acknowledged that discrimination does in fact exist. but to what degree, and in what form? how do we solve it with those lazy ass generalizations?

why are Asian men making more than everyone? surely there must be a reason for it. discrimination?

You my not think you are, but you are though.
Lazy stats is taking apple to apple a comparisons. I got you.
Acknowledging that discrimination exists isn't an accomplishment.
Again you want to say what degree, post and actually present something, instead of seeking to minimize and derail. Post something, anything that actually supports what you are saing right?