Ghostface >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Biggie

keon

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:wtf:

He did that shyt on 1 album, and that was the entire point of the album. And even then he didn't do it on every song. If you can't understand "Child's Play", "Malcolm" or "Cherchez La Ghost" off the same album something is wrong off your ears.

You're playing yourself saying Ghost doesn't make sense 95% of the time. He makes sense 95% of the time and people take literally a handful of songs from 13 years ago and stretch it across his entire career.

Fred.

well i wouldn't say it doesn't make sense,exactly, but more like the bolded

gib·ber·ish (jbr-sh)
n.
1. Unintelligible or nonsensical talk or writing.
2.
a. Highly technical or esoteric language.
b. Unnecessarily pretentious or vague language.

and even still, he doesn't have any true, stand out type verses, imo...same with rae..they got classic songs, but i can't recall being wowed by anything they ever spit..inspectah deck's "triumph" verse is more memorable then anything ghost ever spit
 

Rapmastermind

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Ghostface says he apologized to Biggie in L.A. about "Shark Biters" Says he was just "Young" back then. Calls Biggie a Genius:

GHOSTFACE KILLAH x MONTREALITY /// In-Depth Interview - YouTube!

Around 9:20

It's all good. Big got the last word on "Kick in the Door". Meth said they were the only two that had a problem with Big. Meth was on "Ready To Die". RZA and Capadonna were on the original "Long Kiss Goodnight" which RZA produced on "Life After Death". Ol Dirty B@stard use to do live shows with Big. Big shouted out Wu on serveral tracks. Because of Ghostface and Reakwon we were robbed of more Biggie/Wu Collaborations.
 

mobbinfms

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You can't be serious thinking that Everyday Struggle, Miss U, and Sky's the Limit are super deep introspective records. Did you listen to the lyrics or just the beats? Just because the beat of those songs were mellow don't make it deep. His actually lyrical content was not deep. Take a song like Miss U, it's supposed to be some deep farewell tribute song yet the entire song is just Big bragging bout selling coke and a few of his friends dying in the process. On most songs, Big does little more than brag about selling coke, growing up from being poor to being a boss, having money, and pimping hoes. Nothing else, nothing more. He rode mellow beats but offered no introspective rhymes over them.

The majority of his content consist of myopic self-driven records, he was completely incapable of rhyming outside of his own vintage point. I like Biggie's music, but the only message I get from him is pimping bytches, slanging dope, etc. Ghost's subject matter and lyrical content is on another level from Biggie. Listening to Ghost is like going to an art museum and seeing a wall full of collage paintings that make you stare and think. Each one unique, none like the last. Listening to Biggie is like going to a preschool art class and looking at crayon drawings of children pretending to have deeper than they actually are capable of. Hell, I don't know why I even bother with someone with Big in his avatar who keeps talking bout "reaching people". Well so did Nelly. Nelly gotta be on another tier by your logic.

Great troll post about BIG. Especially the part claiming that his introspective records like Everyday Struggle weren't introspective. Also the part about him not being able to write outside of his vantage point, you know, given that he ghost wrote for Kim.

Also - you clearly didn't actually listen to Miss U. And to say this his only message is pimping bytches and slanging dope shows a very limited familiarity with his music.
 

mobbinfms

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Dig this, just because a song has a slow and mellow beat with a woman or male group singing on the hook like Juicy or Miss U, doesn’t make it an introspective record. Introspective records require a COMBINaTION of a sad melancholy beat PLUS deep soul searching lyrics. Sorry, but that shyt just doesn’t exist with Biggie. He had the beats but not the lyrics required for deep songs, and a vast majority of Biggie songs that people claim are deep were manufactured records that Diddy made him do anyway. Diddy picked the bet, got somebody to sing the hooks, then Biggie comes on and offers his standard mob boss rhymes. That’s how those songs work out, the mere process of the way those songs were even created negates its introspective nature. There’s nothing genuine about some guy picking beats and forcing some other dude to rap on them I.E. Juicy.

90% of Biggie music catalogue consist of songs bragging about hustling, robbing people, killing people, being the boss don of his crew, fukking bytches, and having money. He was stuck in a mafioso mind frame. Compare that to Ghost and Raekwon who made Mafioso records like Only Built 4 Cuban Linx, BUT STILL had the range to escape that niche. Biggie was still rhyming as a mob boss even on songs like Miss U and Sky’s The Limit. Jay-Z is routinely criticized for the same weaknesses but there really is no difference between him and Biggie in this regard. Let's not even compare Biggie to Ghost's creativity, versatility, or subject matter. Nas is a better challenge in this regard to Ghost than Biggie.

I don't think you understand what introspection is. Suicidal Thoughts is one of he most introspective songs ever recorded.
 

mobbinfms

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On this date, April 4, 2013, I find it hard to believe that any avid hip hop listener can name 20 MC's with a better MC career better than Ghostface. I'm sorry. Unless your criteria for great MC's is albums sold and other stuff independent to actual MC'ing, than I find it ridiculous. Ghost is easily a Top 10 MC. At least Top 10. He's too talented. For example...RZA had a lil toy project he wanted to do with Black Dynamite composer Adrian Younge. He (or his Soul Temple partner Bob Perry) asked Ghost as a favor just to lay down some verses that reads like a story for the project. In his sleep Ghost knocked out some conceptual bars that will be the most salient aspect of what is going to be one of the best albums of the year. He did it just for fun. Ghost is MC elite. 20 MC's better than him career wise is laughable.

Playing devils advocate (I don't necessarily believe all of these rappers are better than ghost - but I think an argument could be made). In no particular order.

Rakim
Nas
Pac
Biggie
Prodigy
KRS
Big Daddy Kane
Jay
Common
Black Thought
Scarface
LL
Cube
Eminem
Andre 3000
Kook g rap
Guru
Redman

That's the best I can do off the top of my head. Again - I don't necessarily think all of these guys are better than Ghost - but I think you could argue all of them.
 

Mike Otherz

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ready to die aint even top down that dope to me. Biggie to me is someone who had amazing moments on both albums, but there are songs on both albums i dont fux with.
 

Mike Otherz

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biggies whole legacy comes from puffy and ny hip hop media campaigning on his behalf. "King Of NY" or "Best Rapper Alive" is just like any other political title like President or Governor. you need to campaign, you need to politic, you need to leverage media. the same sh!tsz camel and his media cronies do now, that same isht was going on with Big. The public didnt crown BIG. the industry did. just shows you the politics of the music business.

damn, if you read hip hop media outside of NY, Big wasnt even that respected. and he wasnt even that respected after he died. he was still gettiing sh!tted on. ny media plus revisionist hipsters, thats who crowned Big.
 

mobbinfms

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:snoop:

Here we go with this shyt again.

The west wasn't running shyt. Dre, Snoop, and Warren G? That's one camp.

Damn near every rapper from the east was going gold, plat, or multi-plat before, during, and after BIG. This whole "BIG saved the east from obscurity, the west was on top" is a fallacy. One camp from the west was on top, and yes they were selling a shyt ton of records, but one BIG album going 4x plat on the east was hardly enough to shift the balance.

Hell, BONE was selling around the same amount as BIG, you don't hear anyone claiming Ohio was on top.

And "36 Chambers" and "Illmatic" both went plat. :snoop: at trying to figure out when an album actually went gold/plat based on the date on RIAA. That's when the cert was requested, not when it gold/plat. You could sell 20 million records and RIAA ain't gonna certify it until the label pays. That's when it'll say it was certified.

Fred.

Illmatic didn't go plat until after It Was Written dropped. That's not a label issue with requesting certification, the album just wasn't commercially successful.
My recollection is that 36 sold well in the year after its release. Especially after CREAM dropped.

Who from the East went multi plat post 1990 but before BIG did?
 

mobbinfms

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biggies whole legacy comes from puffy and ny hip hop media campaigning on his behalf. "King Of NY" or "Best Rapper Alive" is just like any other political title like President or Governor. you need to campaign, you need to politic, you need to leverage media. the same sh!tsz camel and his media cronies do now, that same isht was going on with Big. The public didnt crown BIG. the industry did. just shows you the politics of the music business.

damn, if you read hip hop media outside of NY, Big wasnt even that respected. and he wasnt even that respected after he died. he was still gettiing sh!tted on. ny media plus revisionist hipsters, thats who crowned Big.

Canibus was the first to proclaim BIG the GOAT.
 

mobbinfms

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NaS singles just didn't connect mainstream wise but Hip Hop heads was feeling them. NaS had 5 singles on "ILLmatic" and "It ain't hard to tell" was his biggest hit. "CREAM" had the streets on lock man and "Can it all be so simple" was just too classic. So again I would never take away what "36 Chambers" and "ILLmatic" did for the Eastcoast Renaissance but if "Ready To Die" didn't make that shift, the West would of still been in power.

Ready To Die (Blueprint for Commercial/Street formula) Multi-Plat by 95
36 Chamber (Blueprint for Hardcore Production) Plat by 95
ILLmatic (Blueprint for Lyricism/multiple big name production) Gold by 96


Also I have to show love to Black Moon and Smif and Wesson for dropping amazing East Coast albums in 93 and 94.

The Mobb going gold with the Infamous was considered a big deal at the time as well.
Remember - Rae's stated goal on 36 was to go gold.
 

bigbadbossup2012

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why bother, you'd just say it wasnt ill because you hate that nikkas think ghost is better.
Lol @ you thinking i'm really tripping like that. I DO think it's pathetic and hate that nikkas pull sucka shyt out the sky to boost up their favorite underachievers,but i also know ya'll ghost fans that think he's better are a minority and will remain one. You cant link one cause he doesnt have one. He has good lyrics over ill samples. He wasnt the vocal performer Big was and that's the main reason he never blew.
 

bigbadbossup2012

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biggies whole legacy comes from puffy and ny hip hop media campaigning on his behalf. "King Of NY" or "Best Rapper Alive" is just like any other political title like President or Governor. you need to campaign, you need to politic, you need to leverage media. the same sh!tsz camel and his media cronies do now, that same isht was going on with Big. The public didnt crown BIG. the industry did. just shows you the politics of the music business.

damn, if you read hip hop media outside of NY, Big wasnt even that respected. and he wasnt even that respected after he died. he was still gettiing sh!tted on. ny media plus revisionist hipsters, thats who crowned Big.
Puffy was the major reason behinds big's commercial success,as far as him instructing BIG to "make them dance" and just being a great overall Executive Producer. However we cant pretend that biggie didnt deliver. His songs hit hard PERIOD. You couldnt go places and not hear people saying:


"I made the change from a common thief
To up close and personal with Robin Leach
And I'm far from cheap, I smoke skunk with my peeps all day
Spread love, it's the Brooklyn way
The Moet and Alize keep me pissy
Girls used to diss me
Now they write letters 'cause they miss me
I never thought it could happen, this rappin' stuff
I was too used to packin' gats and stuff
Now honies play me close like butter played toast
From the Mississippi down to the east coast
Condos in Queens, indo for weeks
Sold out seats to hear Biggie Smalls speak
Livin' life without fear
Puttin' 5 karats in my baby girl's ears
Lunches, brunches, interviews by the pool
Considered a fool 'cause I dropped out of high school
Stereotypes of a black male misunderstood
And it's still all good "


"Straight up honey really I'm askin
Most of these nikkaz think they be mackin but they be actin
Who they attractin with that line, "What's your name what's your sign?"
Soon as he buy that wine I just creep up from behind
And ask what your interests are, who you be with
Things to make you smile, what numbers to dial
You gon' be here for a while, I'm gon' go call my crew
You go call your crew
We can rendezvous at the bar around two
Plans to leave, throw the keys to Lil Cease
Pull the truck up, front, and roll up the next blunt
So we can steam on the way to the telly go fill my belly
A t-bone steak, cheese eggs and Welch's grape
Conversate for a few, cause in a few, we gon' do
What we came to do, ain't that right boo [truuuueee]
Forget the telly we just go to the crib
and watch a movie in the jacuzzi smoke l's while you do me
"


"
[Notorious B.I.G.]
Who the fukk is this? Pagin me at 5:46
in the mornin, crack of dawn an' {*dialing phone*}
now I'm yawnin - wipe the cold out my eye {*ring*}
See who's this pagin me - and why
It's my nikka Pop from the barbershop
Told me he was in the gamblin spot, and heard the intricate plot
of nikkaz wanna stick me like flypaper neighbor
Slow down love, please chill, drop the caper
Remember them nikkaz from the hill up in Brownsville?
That you rolled dice wit, smoked the blunts and got nice wit
Yeah my nikka Fame up in Prospect
Nah they're my nikkaz nah love wouldn't disrespect
I didn't say them, they schooled me to some nikkaz
that you knew from back when, when you was clockin minor figures
Now they heard you blowin up like nitro
And they wanna stick the knife through your windpipe slow
So - thank Fame for warnin me cause now I'm warnin you
I got the mac nikka tell me what you gonna do

[Chorus]
Damn! nikkaz wanna stick me for my paper
Damn! nikkaz wanna stick me for my paper
Damn! nikkaz wanna stick me for my paper
Damn! nikkaz wanna stick me for my paper"


"[Verse Three]
So, what's it gonna be? Him or me?
We can cruise the world with pearls, gator boots for girls
The envy of all women, crushed linen
Cartier wrist-wear with diamonds in 'em
The finest women I love with a passion
Ya man's a wimp, I give that ass a good thrashin
High fashion - flyin into all states
Sexin me while ya man masturbates
Isn't this great? Your flight leaves at eight
Her flight lands at nine, my game just rewinds
Lyrically I'm supposed to represent
I'm not only the client, I'm the player president
"


These and every other verse on the songs they're from are classic and i heard with my own ears being recited by many people. Let's not pretend that biggie's buzz was manufactured like these current rappers.
:ufdup: Also Ghost doesnt have one verse that is known coast to coast. Just wasnt that good
 
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