The State of Masculinity

Dusty Bake Activate

Fukk your corny debates
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1) I should have been more clear. Men do not have a biological imperative to secure resources and safety during mate selection. Men lean towards attractiveness and the appearance of good health.

This is just a poor, distorted, grossly generalized and decontextualized attempt to rationalize a preconceived ideological bias through biological determinism while ignoring the role of centuries of sociological factors.

Men lean toward attractiveness in who we want to fukk. So do many women. Most men do take into account secure resources and safety when it comes to a long-term pairing. Most men who are highly productive are not going to marry a bum ass uneducated high school dropout just because she looks good.

You're just speaking in generalities, failing to accurately define this supposed "biological imperative," or explain how it translates into the male-run state inexplicably oppressing men.

2) The right to vote in most western nations was not exclusively a gender issue. It was a class issue.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9d25esQeBoU

Like i have said before, feminists distort the facts to push an agenda, they do this across many different issues, blaming feminism for this is completely just and accurate.

Women had essentially no rights for most of this nation's history. And women weren't secured the right to vote until 87 years. That's a fact. You cannot argue against that.

Most of the first women brought over here from Britain were literally servants and sex slaves. They couldn't vote. They got charged with crimes if they got pregnant out of wedlock, many of these pregnancies caused by rape. And that's just white women.

Even after the Revolution, New Jersey was the only state that granted women the right to vote and they rescinded that.

They were often denied education. Only 40% of women were literate in 1750.

Womens' role defined in society were to pious, cheerful, compliant, submissive, obedient, uneducated, sexually pure, and servile.

Feminism was a response to that. If you do not like some of the forms feminism is taking today you can make that case, but denouncing feminism as a whole, you are putting yourself in the untenable position of essentially defending everything I stated above and more. Or is that just how it should be based on some abstraction of biology?

3) I agree that both sexes shame each other, and both sexes have gender roles that society expects them to follow, however, the female imperative is always the PC socially accepted point of view.

man who doesn't want kids = scum
woman who doesn't want kids = empowered

No, it's not. What you're saying doesn't make any sense because you're acting like men are not half the population not to mention at most levers of power in society.

That example you used about kids is not the dominant narrative in society. That's just what some extremists of feminist persuasion might say and you're pretending as if that's what the whole of society thinks.

4) "Biased domestic violence campaigns? Women are by far the greater recipients of domestic violence than men, and are generally more susceptible to it because they tend to be the physically weaker of the two sexes"

100% false.

Most countries show parity in domestic violence:

http://www.avoiceformen.com/updates/news-updates/news-release-dv-is-not-men-only/

If you look at violence in society as a whole, men are more susceptible to violence than women.

No it is not. You're wrong. Again, we're talking about the U. S., again please provide a more unbiased source than "www.avoiceformen.com"

Women are by far more victims of domestic violence, and more likely to be seriously injured by it for obvious biological reasons: they tend to be physically weaker. So are you going to ignore biological differences of the much more concrete, empirical variety now?

Women are abused domestically more, and far more likely to be hospitalized and killed from domestic violence.

http://www.nij.gov/topics/crime/intimate-partner-violence/measuring.htm

5) "The notion that the state is oppressing men is pretty ridiculous" Maybe oppression is a bit strong. However, the state does support women's issues at the expense of men.

http://www.avoiceformen.com/feminis...who-pays-the-piper-calls-the-tune-or-does-he/

Yeah, the male dominated state in which laws are created by men mostly are actively working against men for some reason. :rudy:

That's just as absurd as when white racists claim that the the predominantly white government is oppressing white people because of affirmative action and civil rights legislation. The government makes attempts to try and iron out inherent inequalities in society. If there are overreaches and poorly designed policy with drawbacks, that doesn't mean that there's a conspiracy to destroy the dominant class, inexplicably implemented by the dominant class.

This causes major, major issues that affect the lives of men. Why is breast cancer funded 700% more than prostate cancer?

More effective lobbying and media campaigning for breast cancer. :yeshrug: Again, you nitpick anecdotal inequalities in order to create some grand conspiracy of tyranny that doesn't exist.

Why do men pay more taxes but have less access to services?

It should be the way. There's that pesky biology again. Women have way more medical issues and preventative care unique to their gender they have to deal with then men.

"vast majority of elected office-holders, lawyers, judges, and academics are all men. I don't think they're actively conspiring against their own sex."

There is nothing stopping women from presuing these careers & positions. Women are not represented in those positions because they choose not to do so. Evil boogie men are stopping women from becoming lawyers.

You're wrong, first of all. No one is stopping women from pursuing fields of study and getting hired, but once they're in the door he glass ceiling is real. Women generally do not move up to the highest levels of society. How many female CEOs and executive at large corporations are female? How many Senators? Or the most obvious example, we've had 44 presidents and not one of them is a woman. Is that because in 2 and a quarter centuries there was never a woman who qualified or desired to be president but didn't have those opportunities granted, or are women just not competent enough to be president?

But the point was it's absolute absurdity to claim that the men who are at the levers of power in legislation, academia, private business, and lobbying are actively conspiring against their own sex.
 
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1) Women commit spousal abuse just as much as men. Men do more damage but women abuse just as much . I knew the voice for men website would not be satisfactory even if they link to non bias or slanted links

http://pubpages.unh.edu/~mas2/V74-gender-symmetry-with-gramham-Kevan-Method 8-.pdf

2) When have the elite men in power ever cared about the majority of men's lives? Feminist lobby groups do have the dominate voice in government and that's why things like cancer and mental health for women get funded more so than men's issues


3) "It should be the way" I thought feminism was about equality? Men paying more for less service being equality sounds like doublespeak to me. Men commit suicide at a much higher rate then women, yet, men's mental health issues are notoriously underfunded compared to women's. Men are paying higher taxes to the determinate of issues that affect them.

listen, i recognize how this sounds like a logic fallacy, i understand your point on this:

If P then q
p
therefore q.

I get it. But you are admitting the problem in your own post

A) Men pay more taxes (you admit and support this)
B) Feminism has better lobby groups then men (admitted)
C) Men don't have lobby groups so their issues go unnoticed. (Feminism wants it this way because men are 'privileged')
D) Therefore, men are giving more to the state, which supports female issues over men's even if men need the services more than women (suicide)

Maybe i am being stupid, i just don't know what other conclusion i am supposed to come to.
 

ltheghost

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I'll just throw this out here. The state of masculinity is the same as it always has been. The only change is that now you have an upper class that wants to destroy middle to lower class families in order to create a permanent underclass. One that doesn't follow the rules of manhood and is subject to fixed chaos. This fixed chaos class is easily manipulated by social media and other flashy things. Instead of building wealth for the next generation they would rather spend millions on what they can get now. Instead of focusing on being successful like conquerors of old they are hung up on their emotions. "I need to work to live" vs "You work to feed me" mentality. So of course today it is okay for men to acknowledge their weaker emotions. Hug on to their mother's, shyt emulate them, all the way down to wearing heels..Yes you are accepted. Only because in the end you pose no threat to the real rulers of America. Gather together in your social cliques, teach each other your values, as long as it doesn't go against the program it's okay. Men move in silence, observing what is going on, then adjust accordingly for the victory.
 
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