Tortured Reasoning

DEAD7

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Critics and defenders of the harsh interrogation methods applied to captured terrorists can argue forever over whether those methods were "torture." But any serious discussion of a serious issue — and surely terrorism qualifies as serious — has to move beyond semantics and confront the ultimate question: "Compared to what alternative?"

If you knew that there was a hidden nuclear time bomb planted somewhere in New York City — set to go off today — and you had a captured terrorist who knew where and when, would you not do anything whatever to make him tell you where and when? Would you pause to look up the definition of "torture"? Would you even care what the definition of "torture" was, when the alternative was seeing millions of innocent people murdered?

Senator Dianne Feinstein's recent release of a massive report on the CIA's severe interrogation methods, used against captured Islamic terrorists, has set off a firestorm of controversy. It is hard to see what benefit the United States of America gains from releasing that report. But it is painfully obvious what lasting damage has been done to the security of Americans.

One of the most obscene acts of the Obama administration, when it first took office, was to launch a criminal investigation of CIA agents who had used harsh interrogation methods against captured terrorists in the wake of the devastating September 11, 2001 aerial attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

Right after those terrorist attacks, when there were desperate fears of what might be coming next, these CIA agents were trying to spare fellow Americans another attack that could take thousands more lives, or perhaps millions more. To turn on these agents, years later, after they did what they were urged to do, as a patriotic duty in a time of crisis, is both a betrayal of those who acted in the past and a disincentive to those in the future who are charged with safeguarding the nation.

Other nations, whose cooperation we need, in order to disrupt international terrorist networks, see how their involvement has now been revealed to the whole world — including terrorists — because supposedly responsible American officials, in the Congress of the United States, cannot keep their mouths shut.

The public's "right to know" has often been invoked to justify publicizing confidential information. But is there any evidence that the American public was clamoring to learn state secrets, which every government has? I don't know where our nuclear weapons are located and I don't want to know, certainly not at the cost of letting our enemies know.

The ease with which politicians are willing to pull the rug out from under people whose job is to safeguard our lives — whether they are CIA agents, the police or the military — is not only a betrayal of those people but a danger to us all.


When people who volunteer to put their lives on the line in the military to defend this country, at home and abroad, see their buddies killed on the battlefield, and sometimes themselves come back minus an arm or a leg, or with severe physical and mental damage that they may never get over — and then see some headstrong politician in the White House throw away everything they fought for, and see enemy forces take back places for which Americans shed their blood, that can be galling to them and a deterrent to others who might otherwise take their place in the future.

If we cannot see beyond the moment today, we will pay dearly tomorrow and in many more tomorrows.

-Thomas Sowell
 

Brown_Pride

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...oh god where to start. I'm short on time so i'll hit the bigger points.
1. The right for the people to know is pretty fukin crucial.
But is there any evidence that the American public was clamoring to learn state secrets
wtf kind of apologetic BS is this? This is like the ultimate in allowing the government to do what's best for you. The ironic part is people who champion this line of thinking tend to be the same people who champion small hands off my government check type government

2. The ticking time bomb. IF we're goign to talk logic and torture than given this oft used scenario would it also then be reasonable to go door by door searching and asking every person AND also torturing them? Ultimately we would discover the bomb by process of elimination. If in a city of 1 million we find the bomb as late as the 999,999th person, LOGICALLY the sparing of that 1 person the humility of torture while most assuredly applying torture weights better than the prospect of all 1 million people being blown up? Point is, if we're going to go all hypothetical then let's go all hypothetical.

3.
When people who volunteer to put their lives on the line in the military to defend this country, at home and abroad, see their buddies killed on the battlefield, and sometimes themselves come back minus an arm or a leg, or with severe physical and mental damage that they may never get over — and then see some headstrong politician in the White House throw away everything they fought for, and see enemy forces take back places for which Americans shed their blood, that can be galling to them and a deterrent to others who might otherwise take their place in the future.
False dichotomy at its finest. what about when crooked ass people send them to fight in places they shouldn't be. SHould we not get upset then? What did going to Iraq have to do with anything in this quote?

4.
If we cannot see beyond the moment today, we will pay dearly tomorrow and in many more tomorrows.
and yet we were quick to get involved in a ideological war by playing into the ideological stereo types being used against us.

This entire piece is garbage, apologetic drivel.
 

JahFocus CS

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Another :trash: piece by Sowell. :shaq2:

Why not address the root causes of what is actually putting the lives of citizens at risk? All this "protecting" wouldn't even be necessary if such dirt wasn't being done around the world.
 

ORDER_66

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Instead if going after the CIA foot soldiers who did it, why not after the higher ups who sanctioned this shyt, cheny and bush and the rest of thew white pasty as bosses! :dahell: he talks about not throwing the CIA under the bus, fine dont start with the soldiers, you start with the man who gave the orders to the soldeiers!
 

CHL

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Big Gummit is the devil, exzept when der torturing people! stoopud libruls gedoff my medicare
 
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DEAD7

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@DEAD7, you should create an official Thomas Sowell's opinions thread instead of creating a thread each time he writes a piece.
:damn:
First you molest my post, now you're telling he how to post.
You'll merge them soon I suspect. :wow:






The dawn of the 'police board' is upon us :mjcry:
2015 is gonna be the coldest year on record.
 

Liu Kang

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:damn:
First you molest my post, now you're telling me how to post.
You'll merge them soon I suspect. :wow:






The dawn of the 'police board' is upon us :mjcry:
2015 is gonna be the coldest year on record.
:lolbron:
First, I'm not telling you how to post because I used "should" which should be seen more as an advice.
Second, it's just that I noticed that you have posted plenty of Sowell pieces lately and you don't even seem to agree with him. So I think it'd be better to have a all in one type of thread so all his articles could be shot on sight.
 

DEAD7

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:lolbron:
First, I'm not telling you how to post because I used "should" which should be seen more as an advice.
Second, it's just that I noticed that you have posted plenty of Sowell pieces lately and you don't even seem to agree with him. So I think it'd be better to have a all in one type of thread so all his articles could be shot on sight.
"should"... I know how this works... its just friendly advice, til I don't listen to it. :mjcry:


... and I'm always in it for the conversation. :manny:
 

ghostwriterx

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If you knew that there was a hidden nuclear time bomb planted somewhere in New York City — set to go off today — and you had a captured terrorist who knew where and when (How could you possibly KNOW all of these things without already knowing where the bomb was?:mindblown:), would you not do anything whatever to make him tell you where and when? Would you pause to look up the definition of "torture"? Would you even care what the definition of "torture" was, when the alternative was seeing millions of innocent people murdered?


-Thomas Sowell

I bet Scalia and Sowell actually see this when they're thinking about these ridiculous scenarios.
hqdefault.jpg

:snoop:

Derive your logic and reason from fictional tv shows brehs.:merchant:
 
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