When did Jay Z become a legacy artist? And how did Beyonce escape legacy artdom?

[Piff Perkins]

If you read the OP, he's talking about legacy artists, not LEGACY ACTS. As in they can still have hits, successful tours and the possibility of new material without adhering to trends or the typical timelines for artists to stay relevant with the youth.

A legacy act is somebody who's career is in statis and people only tune into them for what is held within their legacy, little to no expectation of new material. I feel like ya'll are aguing against the latter when I don't think that's the argument that's being made.

I agree with most of your definition, I just don't think legacy artist regularly have hits the way Jay did during that period. Can legacy acts get late career hits? Sure. Aretha Franklin had a #1 hit song in 1991 for instance. But if you have multiple hits, sell a lot of records and are generally viewed as a relevant artist by fans/media/etc you aren't a legacy artist. Jay had way too much juice during WTT and BP3 for me to say he was a legacy artist.

 

[SunZoo]

that mold don’t fit Jay. Jay z fanbase always was more older than young. A lot of artists with younger fanbases get left behind when kids grow up. jay had young fans no doubt but it his base was always older. Jay fanbase was set it stone for the most part. i really believe that’s the biggest reason he ain’t fall off. So this dont apply to him imo. Because if he drop an album. It’s gonna be a big deal. I really big deal (trump voice)

fun fact: solo jay z, the last time he sold under 400k first week was 1998. Ironically enough that album is his highest selling album to date

You just said yourself that he's always had an older base of fans set in stone that show up for him well past his peak, that's what the OP is describing, not a fall off into legacy act, Wayne Newton, Sir mix-a-lot type shyt lol

 

[bigde09]

When he got with Beyonce, faked retirement, and spent the 2nd half of his career rewriting history

 

[Cladyclad]

You just said yourself that he's always had an older base of fans set in stone that show up for him well past his peak, that's what the OP is describing, not a fall off into legacy act, Wayne Newton, Sir mix-a-lot type shyt lol

jay Been a legacy act since 1996 lol

 

[Canada Goose]

After MCHG became old.


Young people in 2009 was listening to BP3 songs. I was in High School when that album came out. In my one of my classes one of my classmates back then was a huge Jay Z stan who was a teenager in 2009.


MCHG had popular mainstream songs so in 2013 he was still as relevant as someone like Drake was for example.

 

[SunZoo]

I agree with most of your definition, I just don't think legacy artist regularly have hits the way Jay did during that period. Can legacy acts get late career hits? Sure. Aretha Franklin had a #1 hit song in 1991 for instance. But if you have multiple hits, sell a lot of records and are generally viewed as a relevant artist by fans/media/etc you aren't a legacy artist. Jay had way too much juice during WTT and BP3 for me to say he was a legacy artist.

Hip Hip is so young and unique it's hard to compare, like I said the window for a successful, active rap career is relatively short and Jay is definitely one of the main people responsible for making that window longer.

I mean especially once you hit BP3 and MCHG, all the Sinatra references, he was a 'made' man by that point. People weren't showing up for Jay in that era for trends, hot producers or anything BUT the fact that Jay-Z had something to say. They'll do the same in 2025 and it all will stem from his legacy as an MC.

jay Been a legacy act since 1996 lol

Nah, since he pump faked retirement.

To the point where people try to use his output since then as a way to knock his placement which is BS but still.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

that mold don’t fit Jay. Jay z fanbase always was more older than young. A lot of artists with younger fanbases get left behind when kids grow up. jay had young fans no doubt but his base was always older. Jay fanbase was set it stone for the most part. i really believe that’s the biggest reason he ain’t fall off. So this dont apply to him imo. Because if he drop an album. It’s gonna be a big deal. I really big deal (trump voice)

fun fact: solo jay z, the last time he sold under 400k first week was 1998. Ironically enough that album is his highest selling album to date

Hov was older than his “rap-peers” and I always forget that.

 

[Piff Perkins]

that mold don’t fit Jay. Jay z fanbase always was more older than young. A lot of artists with younger fanbases get left behind when kids grow up. jay had young fans no doubt but his base was always older. Jay fanbase was set it stone for the most part. i really believe that’s the biggest reason he ain’t fall off. So this dont apply to him imo. Because if he drop an album. It’s gonna be a big deal. I really big deal (trump voice)

fun fact: solo jay z, the last time he sold under 400k first week was 1998. Ironically enough that album is his highest selling album to date

I actually disagree to an extent. Yes Jay had older fans but the main reason Jay retained popularity was that he constantly had hit records and constantly made good career decisions. Hard Knock Life took his career to another level but could have easily been a commercial peak; in fact I'd say it would be for most rappers. Instead he came back with Blueprint a couple years later for multiple hits. We clown BP2 but it had a hit record. Then you get multiple hits again on Black Album. Fast forward to 2009 and you get BP3 with multiple smash hits and then WTT with...well we know lol. That 09-11 period is where he probably gained more young fans than ever. That's when the arena tours started too, not a coincidence. Then you get MCHG which had a hit as well, sold well, big tour etc.

Basically my argument is that his fan base wasn't enough to get him 3+ plat, he needed casual fans to get there. The question is simply how long can you keep the attention of casual fans while also bringing in new fans. And I'd argue the sales/facts suggest he kept that into 2017/2018 at the very least. BTW this is not a Jay specific argument. Every noteworthy artist eventually needs casual fans in order to do big boy sales numbers.

 

[Cladyclad]

Hip Hip is so young and unique it's hard to compare, like I said the window for a successful, active rap career is relatively short and Jay is definitely one of the main people responsible for making that window longer.

I mean especially once you hit BP3 and MCHG, all the Sinatra references, he was a 'made' man by that point. People weren't showing up for Jay in that era for trends, hot producers or anything BUT the fact that Jay-Z had something to say. They'll do the same in 2025 and it all will stem from his legacy as an MC.





Nah, since he pump faked retirement.

To the point where people try to use his output since then as a way to knock his placement which is BS but still.

Jay z been retiring since his debut

then vol2


then vol 3

then officially did it with the black album

but after he said he will never say that again.

 

[SunZoo]

Jay z been retiring since his debut

then vol2


then vol 3

then officially did it with the black album

but after he said he will never say that again.

Yeah but TBA was somewhat believable lol, like fr akin to that shot MJ hit on Russell


I been waiting to see him with a haircut

 

[Cladyclad]

I actually disagree to an extent. Yes Jay had older fans but the main reason Jay retained popularity was that he constantly had hit records and constantly made good career decisions. Hard Knock Life took his career to another level but could have easily been a commercial peak; in fact I'd say it would be for most rappers. Instead he came back with Blueprint a couple years later for multiple hits. We clown BP2 but it had a hit record. Then you get multiple hits again on Black Album. Fast forward to 2009 and you get BP3 with multiple smash hits and then WTT with...well we know lol. That 09-11 period is where he probably gained more young fans than ever. That's when the arena tours started too, not a coincidence. Then you get MCHG which had a hit as well, sold well, big tour etc.

Basically my argument is that his fan base wasn't enough to get him 3+ plat, he needed casual fans to get there. The question is simply how long can you keep the attention of casual fans while also bringing in new fans. And I'd argue the sales/facts suggest he kept that into 2017/2018 at the very least. BTW this is not a Jay specific argument. Every noteworthy artist eventually needs casual fans in order to do big boy sales numbers.

Yes, but hard knock life single came out after vol 2 was popping. The shyt was the 4th but first official single. Vol 2 went number 1 for 2 weeks because of

can I get a
its alright
money ain’t a thing

its a reason why on the internet you hear we wasn’t listening to jay z like that. They wasn’t his fanbase. i Was like the only jay “Stan” in my high school. My boy to this day deny he said Fab debut was better than the blueprint. No nikka u said that shyt lol

 

[Piff Perkins]

Yes, but hard knock life single came out after vol 2 was popping. The shyt was the 4th but first official single. Vol 2 went number 1 for 2 weeks because of

can I get a
its alright
money ain’t a thing

its a reason why on the internet you hear we wasn’t listening to jay z like that. They wasn’t his fanbase. i Was like the only jay “Stan” in my high school. My boy to this day deny he said Fab debut was better than the blueprint. No nikka u said that shyt lol

Those were rap hits but there's a difference between those and Hard Knock Life getting white kids to buy your album in droves. That's the difference between 1-2x plat and 4-5x plat. That's my point though, and I think you'll agree: he's been incredibly consistent with hit records that sell albums, maintain old fans, create new fans, and entertain casual fans. The white kids who bought Vol 2 for Hard Knock Life got multiple songs they could bop to (Can I Get A, Money Ain't A Thing, etc). Those kids prob didn't care about Reservoir Dogs but guess who did...his old fans, rap fans, etc. So he was constantly satisfying everyone.

 

[Double Burger With Cheese]

Beyoncé was just in Atlanta this past weekend and it seems like every woman I know was at that concert. I know a few chicks who went 2 days. The MLB all star game was here too but Beyoncé was the main attraction that weekend.

 

[Cladyclad]

Those were rap hits but there's a difference between those and Hard Knock Life getting white kids to buy your album in droves. That's the difference between 1-2x plat and 4-5x plat. That's my point though, and I think you'll agree: he's been incredibly consistent with hit records that sell albums, maintain old fans, create new fans, and entertain casual fans. The white kids who bought Vol 2 for Hard Knock Life got multiple songs they could bop to (Can I Get A, Money Ain't A Thing, etc). Those kids prob didn't care about Reservoir Dogs but guess who did...his old fans, rap fans, etc. So he was constantly satisfying everyone.

but those songs are the reason the album went number 1. HKL was released after the album dropped. HKL was the 4th single lol

 

[Piff Perkins]

but those songs are the reason the album went number 1. HKL was released after the album dropped. HKL was the 4th single lol

You're missing the point. It was a successful album without HKL. What took it to the stratosphere was HKL. This has never been disputed nor is it a knock on Jay. He prob goes 2x plat without it, like I said. Instead he went 5x plat.