When did Vince McMahon lose "touch" with fans to you?

[R=G]

Was it when Cena got rejected hard at Taboo Tuesday 05 and they kept pushing him hard? Was it the Bret screwed Bret mantra he kept selling as truth? The botched WCW VS WWF angle post WM 17? The odd usage of the Nwo in 2002? Was it when he had Cripple H run roughshed over Raw from Sept 2002 to the huge Batista push in 05? Was it when he didn't push Punk all the way in 2011? Was it when he held Bryan back in Team Hell No post WM 28 when fans cheered him nonstop? Or is it simply...things haven't been the same since Rock went to Hollywood and Austin had to retire?

When did he stop being the innovative Vince that was on fire creatively from 99-2001 in particular?

 

[WMG the 2nd]

When they brought Kevin Nash and triple h out of retirement to beat cm punk and hen put them back in retirement
Vince in 97 would have never done something so stupid

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

I think the better question is when was Vince ever in touch. During the 80s Vince was at least young enough to kinda see how rock n' wrestling could work and he definitely made the right choices far as cable and nationwide distribution goes. So, you could say during the 80s Vince was definitely in touch.

In the 90s he was way outta touch. Anything good that came out of the first half of the 90s was by mistake. Probably ideas from Gorilla or Pat Patterson or someone else with a nose for the business. Their best shyt came from people who came up in the territories.

Vince would have gotten killed in the late 90s if he hadn't allowed Russo and the younger wrestlers to have creative freedoms.

 

[Mike the Executioner]

I think the better question is when was Vince ever in touch. During the 80s Vince was at least young enough to kinda see how rock n' wrestling could work and he definitely made the right choices far as cable and nationwide distribution goes. So, you could say during the 80s Vince was definitely in touch.

In the 90s he was way outta touch. Anything good that came out of the first half of the 90s was by mistake. Probably ideas from Gorilla or Pat Patterson or someone else with a nose for the business. Their best shyt came from people who came up in the territories.

Vince would have gotten killed in the late 90s if he hadn't allowed Russo and the younger wrestlers to have creative freedoms.

This could actually be a great spinoff thread: Was Vince ever in touch with the business, much less things in general?

I mean, he didn't even know what a burrito was but he ate it every day.

 

[Playaz Eyez]

Mid 01 when he brought in a lot of the WCW and ECW wrestlers only to embarrass them and treat them second rate. Vince had a clear money machine and he pissed it away due to ego and pettiness.

 

[RammerJammer]

Triple H reign of terror?

 

[Ill Lou Malnati]

Not sure how much he's ever really been in touch, but it seems like 2001 is a great starting point for a noticeable decline in cognizance.

 

[R=G]

I think the better question is when was Vince ever in touch. During the 80s Vince was at least young enough to kinda see how rock n' wrestling could work and he definitely made the right choices far as cable and nationwide distribution goes. So, you could say during the 80s Vince was definitely in touch.

In the 90s he was way outta touch. Anything good that came out of the first half of the 90s was by mistake. Probably ideas from Gorilla or Pat Patterson or someone else with a nose for the business. Their best shyt came from people who came up in the territories.

Vince would have gotten killed in the late 90s if he hadn't allowed Russo and the younger wrestlers to have creative freedoms.

Here's the thing..we've heard several interviews and shoots...Austin...Hogan..Nash..Bret...Vince definitely had a vision and a look desired for several talents..he treated Survivor Series big time...he had Taker go undefeated for a year..he pulled the trigger and had IC Champion and red hot Warrior pin Hogan...he put Bret over the Luger push in 94 after fans chose Bret at Rumble..he built up Summerslam and the Royal Rumble...McMahon had a vision for marketing and how things needed to be presenting excluding the racist sterotype shyt like Slick, Simba, that Farooq gimmick, Akeem The Dream, Mr. Fuji, Hakushi, Yokozuna, etc. But he had a vision and picture in his head how he wanted several gimmicks to work.

 

[MushroomX]

Buying WCW, it basically made Vince the Don, and not giving a shyt about rivals.

 

[WMG the 2nd]

Mid 01 when he brought in a lot of the WCW and ECW wrestlers only to embarrass them and treat them second rate. Vince had a clear money machine and he pissed it away due to ego and pettiness.

To be fair a lot of those guys weren't shyt in the grand scheme of things
Maybe five-seven of the guys that got buried from wcw/ecw invasion angle were valuable
Booker t
Tazz
Raven
DDP
Perry Saturn
And rvd

Rvd and booker t survived and had amazing careers and were over no matter what Vince did and adapted
Raven Saturn and ddp were treated like shyt and left when they could
Tazz had injuries and had to become a commentator to extent his on screen career

Plus he wwf had former wcw guys like Benoit who was hurt who could have been impact players. I do think making it mainly about he McMahon and Austin was awful plus how weak they made invaders look having to sneak and double team one guy whereas the rock could just beat three guys damn near dolo

 

[Cartier Murphy]

Technically he was in the mid 90's but competition forced his hand. I'd say once WCW died

 

[Berniewood Hogan]

Vince the Don

"A limousine explosion and HE'S STILL ALIVE!"

 

[Mr. Brown]

To be fair a lot of those guys weren't shyt in the grand scheme of things
Maybe five-seven of the guys that got buried from wcw/ecw invasion angle were valuable
Booker t
Tazz
Raven
DDP
Perry Saturn
And rvd

Rvd and booker t survived and had amazing careers and were over no matter what Vince did and adapted
Raven Saturn and ddp were treated like shyt and left when they could
Tazz had injuries and had to become a commentator to extent his on screen career

Plus he wwf had former wcw guys like Benoit who was hurt who could have been impact players. I do think making it mainly about he McMahon and Austin was awful plus how weak they made invaders look having to sneak and double team one guy whereas the rock could just beat three guys damn near dolo

DDP and Raven were 2 of my favorites growing up. It's a shame they had the runs they had in WWE

 

[WMG the 2nd]

DDP and Raven were 2 of my favorites growing up. It's a shame they had the runs they had in WWE

I agree
Raven was creatively one of the most gifted wrestlers in his prime and if they could have just filtered his dumb ideas and mine for his smart ones he'd have been a solid worker for maybe another 7 years. Raven with a prime Sean ohaire would have been amazing versus when they paired Sean with piper. Raven vs undertaker wih a strongly built up raven and a new flock could have been money.

DDP on the other hand was money as fukk before he came to wwe and they made him this weird stalker heel. Then some motivational guru and it was just awful
I know they marketed rock as people's champ but DDP was a people champ, fans made his old ass a star in the 90s.

 

[GoddamnyamanProf]

He never left the 80s