Wind Power Is Cheaper Than Coal, Leaked Report Shows

[Yuzo]

In the future, you'll have a point. Right now, you don't. Coal infrastructure has been around for 100+ years. The mines are out of sight and out of mind.

Wind technology is relatively new for mainstream adoption. There are still patents on the technology, so you have to license it from whomever owns it. Then you need to find a location to put them. You need VAST amounts of land for effective wind energy production. You need to jump through hoops to establish a location. The one in my state took 5+ years to start. Environmentalists are NOT sold on the technology. They believe it will fukk up the ecosystem and that birds will die flying into the propellors. The regulatory barriers of entry for wind tech are huge. Its very hard to get it going anywhere.

Check out this article: http://www.aweo.org/problemwithwind.html

Wind is the future and much better than coal but right now its not economically feasible to take over.

of course it costs money to build. the question was not how much it costs to build, it was about how much it costs to run. im not sure why you keep missing that.

 

[ill]

of course it costs money to build. the question was not how much it costs to build, it was about how much it costs to run. im not sure why you keep missing that.

You're missing the larger point in that it really doesn't matter as all of the other costs and barriers to entry make the operational costs negligent in the discussion about feasibility of wind power taking over.

To answer your question, operational costs are very minimal. High up-front capital expenditure and low cost-of-ownership (maintenance) in the long term. Wind farms typical life cycle is 20 years so every 20 years you need to spend a shytload on cap ex.

http://www.awea.org/Resources/Content.aspx?ItemNumber=5547

 

[ill]

of course it costs money to build. the question was not how much it costs to build, it was about how much it costs to run. im not sure why you keep missing that.

In Denmark, maintenance of the turbines costs 3% of the original purchase price per year. With newer technology being better quality and having more efficiency, those costs have come down to 1.5-2% of original purchase price.

http://www.windmeasurementinternational.com/wind-turbines/om-turbines.php

 

[Yuzo]

You're missing the larger point in that it really doesn't matter as all of the other costs and barriers to entry make the operational costs negligent in the discussion about feasibility of wind power taking over.

To answer your question, operational costs are very minimal. High up-front capital expenditure and low cost-of-ownership (maintenance) in the long term. Wind farms typical life cycle is 20 years so every 20 years you need to spend a shytload on cap ex.

http://www.awea.org/Resources/Content.aspx?ItemNumber=5547

are you saying in a roundabout way that a sizable portion of the cost of wind power has to be dedicated to returning back its startup costs? in other words, to return a profit on it? once this cost is paid back then what? just keep on including it into the price of wind anyway?

would it be more efficient for it to be handled by government?

 

[DEAD7]

would it be more efficient for it to be handled by government?

 

[Yuzo]

think about it. if the majority of cost is being eaten up by land taxes and the need to return profit then government operated wind would logically have a much lower price tag.

 

[Consigliere]

would it be more efficient for it to be handled by government?

Only in the sense that government will be subsidizing it while making it more expensive for consumers. You could cut out the middle man.

The biggest impediment to green anything is that the status quo is already in place and doesn't have any additional capital requirements. The most that private companies are willing to do in the green sphere is change light bulbs, install low flush toilets, and update MEP systems, but only if there's immediate (within 7 years) ROI.

It's a shame too because interest rates are at historic lows. Money might never be this cheap again in our lifetimes and none of its been used to make capital improvements. Too many wars to fight.

We're going to have to wait for T Boone Pickens to die and leave his fortune to wind farmers to get green energy on a competitive scale with fossil fuels in this country.

 

[Yuzo]

Only in the sense that government will be subsidizing it while making it more expensive for consumers. You could cut out the middle man.

my point is that the true cost of wind is probably much much lower that what it is being reported as being given the need for electric companies to have to pay for the land theyre using and also to have to return a profit. so the actual figure might be quite manageable for government subsidization to the extent that it ought to be provided to us and paying a private distributor is simply more wasteful as a whole.

hypothetically, at least, there must come a point somewhere along the line that electricity becomes so cheap the government would step in and take over the process.

 

[Consigliere]

my point is that the true cost of wind is probably much much lower that what it is being reported as being given the need for electric companies to have to pay for the land theyre using and also to have to return a profit. so the actual figure might be quite manageable for government subsidization to the extent that it ought to be provided to us and paying a private distributor is simply more wasteful as a whole.

hypothetically, at least, there must come a point somewhere along the line that electricity becomes so cheap the government would step in and take over the process.

I do think wind is cheaper in the long run and that the government hypothetically could subsidize the land and infrastructure needed to get it up and running. However, once you take it out of private hands the process becomes bogged down by bad contracts (think Halliburton selling the army cans of sodas at 1000% markup) and a lack of upkeep (the State & Federal government haven't made capital improvements in this country since the 50's). we can't even afford to repair bridges and tunnels. We haven't even modernized our existing electrical grid. The government as it currently exists is like a slum lord. Best bet might be to force them to sell and bring in a new landlord.