AlainLocke
Banned
Especially if you are Native US DOS...you are born out of the chapel of the Devil...
Yes, Black people, we should read Marx.
- Thread starter AlainLocke
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David_TheMan
Veteran
Yes do read Marx, read his personal letters to engels that detail how both thought about blacks.
Read Das Kapital and notice how they champion the spread of white supremacy against indiginous populations .
Read Das Kapital and notice how they champion the spread of white supremacy against indiginous populations .
AlainLocke
Banned
Why not follow the ideals of the only man to inspire 4 successful revolutions...on 3 different continents
China
Cuba
Russia
Cape Verde/Guinea-Bassu
While at the same time...inspiring the only successful radical mass movement on USA soil Black Panther Party that united all the races together under the leadership of Black people...
And inspired the most successful revolutionary Black men to ever live in Huey P. Newton, Amil Cabral and Thomas Sankara
His ideals are about creating a truly free society where human beings live in harmony with each other......who wouldn't want that...
Either way...it's gonna happen whether people want it to or not...
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KyokushinKarateMan
Train hard, fight easy
Digable Planets BEEN trying to tell yall since Reachin’ 
....And now I would like to take this opportunity and further desecrate today’s hip hop scene by highlighting the difference in topics and substance between 90s hh and today’s hh; as we see here with DP’s reference to kids in the hood reading Marx.
Nobody from today’s era would have such a line in one of their songs.
....And now I would like to take this opportunity and further desecrate today’s hip hop scene by highlighting the difference in topics and substance between 90s hh and today’s hh; as we see here with DP’s reference to kids in the hood reading Marx.
Nobody from today’s era would have such a line in one of their songs.
Because I prefer capitalism as a means of influence.
I’d rather black folks focus individually on wealth generation and increasing GDP.
AlainLocke
Banned
How are you gonna increase GDP and Wealth when you are descendants of slaves and been colonized and don't control the means of production in any meaningful way....
You don't own land, you don't own machines...and White people got it all....
What are you gonna do...
Most people aren't capitalists...most people are wage workers...they sell their labor...
White people are apex capitalists and capitalism is a zero sum game...if someone is rich...it means someone else is poor...we are the ones that are poor
Marx says...if you don't have a capital since it's a finite resource...you take it by force from those that have it and give distribute so you can build the human capital and material wealth of the majority of people...who are working class poor...
Which is why revolutionaries are Marxists and they are socialists and they are communists. The liberators of Africa were socialists and Marxists...they were the reason Africa even had a chance in the 60s until White people and traitors fukked it up.
They don't sit around as an individual and think about how they are gonna build their starting from nothing while someone else has everything. That's stupid.
If somebody robbed me...I ain't gonna sit around and think about how I'ma make it back. I'ma go get my shyt. They went and got their shyt back.
It would take 228 years for Black people in the USA to catch up to the current material wealth of White Americans. That's the current wealth of White people. I don't wanna know how much wealthier White people are gonna be 228 years from now. We probably won't exist 228 years from now.
Blacks will take hundreds of years to catch up to white wealth
Capitalism doesn't work for people that were enslaved and were colonized and live under the heel of White Supremacy...it works for enslavers and colonizers...
This is why I said individually ... There are more opportunities to generate $$$$ now
than in Marx period. The information is now widely available and right at your fingertips.
but it's an individual decision that comes with certain sacrifices and concessions
Marx lived in a period where setting up a business was horrendously difficult ...
In terms of securing financing, logistics, advertising NOT too mention technology
Furthermore...
You are conflating African-American history with African history then using
political ideology as proof when you already know the economic impact of this
system.
First of The Mali/Songhai Empires were there centuries before European invasions
These were capitalist monarchies that traded and charged taxes and managed
to amass wealth too. There was a hierarchy from the elite to the peasant class.
So the liberators might have been communists but you are ignoring other variables here
such as Russia and China looking to undermine Western Europeans
You clearly haven't thought this through.
"Bingo" 
...For instance back in the 60s-80s when you had the initial public run of African history coming out of black scholars in academia. There was a heavy focus on kingdoms and royalty. Around the same time you had a heavy presence of African American Communist/Socialist commentators in the US who analysed history through a (Hegel, Marx, Engels, Lenin, Mao) paradigm in which the idea of "royalty" was deemed archaic(via it's association with feudalism) and a precursor to the capitalist ideals/forces they were against.
......
Example:
These types view human history through the prism of material "class struggle" via a straight line of distinct transitional stages of development.
- Primitive communism: as in co-operative tribal societies.
- Slave society: a development of tribal to city-state; aristocracy is born.
- Feudalism: aristocrats are the ruling class; merchants evolve into capitalists.
- Capitalism: capitalists are the ruling class, who create and employ the proletariat.
- -----------overthrow of capitalism by a socialist proletariat revolution-------------
- Socialism: working class effectively owning the means of production and the means of their livelihood so that the social surplus accrues to the working class and society as a whole.
- Communism: common ownership of the means of production with free access to the articles of consumption and is classless and stateless, predicated upon a superabundance of material wealth, which is postulated to arise from advances in production technology
(Thus implying the end of the exploitation of labour.)You see these types today in places like...
I.E.If your coming from a socialist paradigm I'd say.... "I don't agree but I see why you say it's oppressive
- Glen ford - (black agenda report)
- Yvette Carnell - (breaking brown)
- Antonio moore - (tonetalks)
- Dr. Cornel West
- Jared A. Ball - (imixwhatIlike)
- etc etc
"
My thoughts on socialist comparative analysis:
That said, I don't agree on a fundamental level because I reject Marx-Engels socialist framework for the analysis of African societies Real or fictional.
As I've mentioned before...
It's like when Europeans call people "chiefs". A hogon's relation to the community in Dogon country maybe distinct from the Asantehene to the Ashanti or Eze in igboland. Either way Europeans would call them all "chiefs" ruling a "chiefdom"This is also a reason I roll my eyes at people using the term "King" & "Queen" all the time. The relationship of a European king to the rest of the community especially as concerns land rights/tenure are distinct in nature.
Example: The hogon doesn't own all the dogons land with the dogon people working the soil as peons.
This is also a problem I have with socialist/communist because they bring their ideas to an African context assuming all "African chiefs" have the same relationship with their people as European kings and try to map their ideology 1 to 1 on Africa. Animism is yet another generic term that doesn't really fit anything in specific.
Hell I'd say something generic like "cattle cults", "ancestor cults", or "mother cult" before saying anything like "animism". Even though cattle domestication came way too late to assume it was first. I think in a situation like this the better question would be...
Better question: What evidence do we have of the black mans original spiritual system(s)?
My position is to view African societies on their on terms through an analytical framework composed of ideals(which I'm not going to go deep into) found throughout Africa dealing with society.
Ideals from/such as...
- Ubuntu
- Maat
- Dr. Fu-Kiau Bunseki - (books on congo based systems)
- Marimba ani - (Utilization of African systems & lectures on women)
- Mwalimu K. Bomani and Yaa Mawusi Baruti - (lectures/books on men/women)
- Poro and Sande societies - (acculturation of children)
- West African land tenure norms / business organization
- Basic African historical analysis
- etc. etc. etc.
Basically there is a shyt load of "cultural ingredients" I pull from to cook my ideological soup. The above being simply a small sample of base ingredients ....or sources(books/lectures) I pull ingredients from. From those ingredients I cook an ideology by which to compare real/proposed societal practices. This is as opposed to what black socialist do which is....
As stated before I disagree with that process. If we are to utilize an abstraction based on analysis of historical social/economic phenomena, then it should be an abstraction of African societal processes not an abstraction based on analysis of English/French historical social/economic phenomena ....that are then applied to an Africa with its own distinct history and social/economic phenomena that doesn't even line up with western Europe.(This is my same prob with feminism btw)
- Take Marx-Engels social/economic analysis of a handful(England, France, etc.) of western European societies around the European industrial revolution,
- Abstract that analysis of 2 or 3 European societies going through the industrial revolution,
- Then apply that abstraction carte blanche to any and all societies... most importantly in this case African societies.
...EDIT:
......
While I don't know if it's the caseIf the person is looking at wakanda from a communist lens.....
- Primitive communism: as in co-operative tribal societies.
- Slave society: a development of tribal to city-state; aristocracy is born.
- Feudalism: aristocrats are the ruling class; merchants evolve into capitalists.
- Capitalism: capitalists are the ruling class, who create and employ the proletariat.
- -----------overthrow of capitalism by a socialist proletariat revolution-------------
- Socialism: working class effectively owning the means of production and the means of their livelihood so that the social surplus accrues to the working class and society as a whole.
- Communism: common ownership of the means of production with free access to the articles of consumption and is classless and stateless, predicated upon a superabundance of material wealth, which is postulated to arise from advances in production technology
(Thus implying the end of the exploitation of labour.)
Then the mere fact that wakanda is a "kingdom" will be seen as a regressive problem. While I don't hold such views(I don't subscribe to [Hegel, Marx, Engels, Lenin, Mao] thought) I'm aware there are people in the community who do.
Examples:
- Glen ford - (black agenda report)
- Yvette Carnell - (breaking brown)
- Antonio moore - (tonetalks)
- Dr. Cornel West
- Jared A. Ball - (imixwhatIlike) <--though he seems to lean heavy towards panafricanism also.
- etc etc
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JahFocus CS
Get It How You Get It
Every working class person should read Marx.
Anyone who wants to understand how society is structured and the dynamics and contradictions of the system we live under should read Marx.
Anyone who wants to understand how society is structured and the dynamics and contradictions of the system we live under should read Marx.
Ya' Cousin Cleon
OG COUCH CORNER HUSTLA
ogc163
Superstar
BlackJesus
Spread science, save with coupons
Yes, read Marx, the same man who inspired some of the most brutal, evil dictatorships in the world and whose ideas lead to the deaths of hundreds of millions of people. Over 100 million in China alone, but who's counting?