Advanced statistics say Derek Carr is a bust!

godkiller

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Another cac QB bust :mjlol:. Scroll down and read the bolded parts if you don't take the whole article (I know how you lot hate reading):

Is Derek Carr Really the Future of the Oakland Raiders?


If you ask Google
, it appears that most people think Derek Carr's rookie season was a success. Perhaps that's true given expectations -- he was a second-round selection in last year's draft, and the Raiders' recent history managing the quarterback position hasn't exactly been strong.

But exceeding expectations doesn't mean a player is good. And it seems like that's being ignored a bit with Carr.

Carr finished his rookie season with 21 touchdowns, 12 interceptions and a solid 3,270 yards. This made him one of eight rookie quarterbacks in NFL history to have thrown for at least 3,000 yards and 20 touchdowns. This was also something his brother, David, never accomplished during his five years as the Houston Texans' starter.

Butterflies and rainbows, right? Not exactly.

Touchdown-to-interception ratios and yardage totals don't really tell us the entire story about a quarterback's season. Touchdowns can be short and unimportant (garbage time), while interceptions aren't created equally -- a pick-six, after all, is a bigger play than a 3rd-and-long interception that would be the equivalent to a punt.

That's why we look at our signature Net Expected Points (NEP) metric to give us a better idea of what's actually happening on the field. In essence, NEP looks at each play and calculates the points added by a player based on expectation. You can read more about it in our glossary.

In 2014, the average Passing NEP -- points added on passes only -- by quarterbacks with 200 or more drop backs was 45.17. (The reason this number wasn't zero, or "expectation", was because passing is naturally more efficient than rushing.) This sample includes a total of 37 signal-callers, with the majority of them -- 31 -- throwing for a positive Passing NEP value.

Derek Carr wasn't part of that group of 31. Instead, he was one of six high-volume quarterbacks this season to finish the year with a negative Passing NEP, finishing with a -40.94 total. The others? Jay Cutler, Austin Davis, Josh McCown, Robert Griffin III andBlake Bortles.

Among these six quarterbacks, Carr's per drop back Passing NEP was fourth worst. And within the entire group of 37, Carr's Success Rate -- the percentage of passes that contribute positively towards NEP -- was fourth from the bottom as well.

If we're being honest, it wasn't a good year for Derek Carr. He was in roughly the 10th percentile as an NFL starting quarterback.

Many will point out that these poor numbers are due to bad personnel around him and inexperience at the position. That's not unfair, and I'm sure that played a role in all of this. However, Carr's first-year numbers don't give us -- me, at least -- much confidence.

In January of last year, I wrote a piece on whether or not a quarterback's rookie season predicts his future. The findings showed that it kind of does -- passers who were good during their rookie campaigns hit at a much higher rate than those who were bad from the start.

Geno Smith, for instance, finished 2013 with a Passing NEP of -68.55. Since 2000, that placed him among the worst rookie quarterbacks we've seen. His campaign didn't show much promise.

Carr's Passing NEP places him in a rookie quarterback tier that includes guys like Joey Harrington and Josh Freeman. Within this tier of 10 players, the best quarterback is arguably Matthew Stafford, or maybe Carson Palmer. But those are the only two quarterbacks who really hit (out of 10 passers), giving Carr pretty low odds.

This isn't to say he'll never be serviceable, but just going by the numbers, it's tough to get behind the franchise building around him. And it's also difficult to get behind new head coach Jack Del Rio's claim of Carr being a special young talent.
 

Newzz

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Another cac QB bust :mjlol:. Scroll down and read the bolded parts if you don't take the whole article (I know how you lot hate reading):

Is Derek Carr Really the Future of the Oakland Raiders?


If you ask Google
, it appears that most people think Derek Carr's rookie season was a success. Perhaps that's true given expectations -- he was a second-round selection in last year's draft, and the Raiders' recent history managing the quarterback position hasn't exactly been strong.

But exceeding expectations doesn't mean a player is good. And it seems like that's being ignored a bit with Carr.

Carr finished his rookie season with 21 touchdowns, 12 interceptions and a solid 3,270 yards. This made him one of eight rookie quarterbacks in NFL history to have thrown for at least 3,000 yards and 20 touchdowns. This was also something his brother, David, never accomplished during his five years as the Houston Texans' starter.

Butterflies and rainbows, right? Not exactly.

Touchdown-to-interception ratios and yardage totals don't really tell us the entire story about a quarterback's season. Touchdowns can be short and unimportant (garbage time), while interceptions aren't created equally -- a pick-six, after all, is a bigger play than a 3rd-and-long interception that would be the equivalent to a punt.

That's why we look at our signature Net Expected Points (NEP) metric to give us a better idea of what's actually happening on the field. In essence, NEP looks at each play and calculates the points added by a player based on expectation. You can read more about it in our glossary.

In 2014, the average Passing NEP -- points added on passes only -- by quarterbacks with 200 or more drop backs was 45.17. (The reason this number wasn't zero, or "expectation", was because passing is naturally more efficient than rushing.) This sample includes a total of 37 signal-callers, with the majority of them -- 31 -- throwing for a positive Passing NEP value.

Derek Carr wasn't part of that group of 31. Instead, he was one of six high-volume quarterbacks this season to finish the year with a negative Passing NEP, finishing with a -40.94 total. The others? Jay Cutler, Austin Davis, Josh McCown, Robert Griffin III andBlake Bortles.

Among these six quarterbacks, Carr's per drop back Passing NEP was fourth worst. And within the entire group of 37, Carr's Success Rate -- the percentage of passes that contribute positively towards NEP -- was fourth from the bottom as well.

If we're being honest, it wasn't a good year for Derek Carr. He was in roughly the 10th percentile as an NFL starting quarterback.

Many will point out that these poor numbers are due to bad personnel around him and inexperience at the position. That's not unfair, and I'm sure that played a role in all of this. However, Carr's first-year numbers don't give us -- me, at least -- much confidence.

In January of last year, I wrote a piece on whether or not a quarterback's rookie season predicts his future. The findings showed that it kind of does -- passers who were good during their rookie campaigns hit at a much higher rate than those who were bad from the start.

Geno Smith, for instance, finished 2013 with a Passing NEP of -68.55. Since 2000, that placed him among the worst rookie quarterbacks we've seen. His campaign didn't show much promise.

Carr's Passing NEP places him in a rookie quarterback tier that includes guys like Joey Harrington and Josh Freeman. Within this tier of 10 players, the best quarterback is arguably Matthew Stafford, or maybe Carson Palmer. But those are the only two quarterbacks who really hit (out of 10 passers), giving Carr pretty low odds.

This isn't to say he'll never be serviceable, but just going by the numbers, it's tough to get behind the franchise building around him. And it's also difficult to get behind new head coach Jack Del Rio's claim of Carr being a special young talent.


:sas1:



What they did was take all 40 rookie quarterbacks to start a significant number of games as a rookie between 2000 to 2013 and place them in four tiers. Carr falls squarely into the third tier which does not put him in very good company.

Others in the same tier include Sam Bradford (-29.04), Christian Ponder (-33.49), Kyle Boller (-33.52), Josh Freeman (-39.56), Vince Young (-47.29), E.J. Manuel (-47.84), Ken Dorsey (-54.47), Matthew Stafford (-55.54), and Joey Harrington (-64.39).

Stafford is the lone rookie in that tier who has had success in the NFL. Which if you think of him as the one out of ten, that would suggest Carr has a 10% chance of being a successful NFL quarterback.

In case you were wondering, the top tier of rookie quarterbacks consists of, in this order, Matt Ryan (89.16), Russell Wilson (84.01), Robert Griffin III (73.63), Ben Roethlisberger (62.25), Cam Newton (57.48), Marc Bulger (44.51), Andrew Luck (36.68), Matt Leinart (18.26), Andy Dalton (12.64), and Jason Campbell (6.99). For the most part a pretty good group to be associated with.

For what it's worth, Matt McGloin's NEP per dropback for his 2013 rookie season puts him in the top tier (9th overall) of rookies just ahead of Andy Dalton


http://www.silverandblackpride.com/...kland-raiders-long-term-answer-at-quarterback


So Matt Leinart, Matt McGloin, Andy Dalton, and Jason Campbell were considered top tier rookie QBs (McGloin in only NEP)......and we are supposed to realistically take their "results" serious?:comeon:



:sas2:
 

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Stats analysis is great.

But 1 season is too small of a sample size to determine anything.

Even the biggest stat-heads know this.

This article is sensationalist bullshyt.

:camby:
 

godkiller

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Stats analysis is great.

But 1 season is too small of a sample size to determine anything.

Even the biggest stat-heads know this.

This article is sensationalist bullshyt.

:camby:

Fair enough criticism. One season is too small a sample size but available information still counts for some part of the picture, however incompete. The year before last I watched Raiders' games and McGloin looked at least as good as Carr did last year. McGloin may have even looked and performed better in specific instances which is why he had a higher NEP in the 2013 season than Carr does in his respective 2014 season. So if McGloin looked better in his rookie year, it doesn't stand to reason that Carr is the future.
 

godkiller

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:sas1:






So Matt Leinart, Matt McGloin, Andy Dalton, and Jason Campbell were considered top tier rookie QBs (McGloin in only NEP)......and we are supposed to realistically take their "results" serious?:comeon:



:sas2:

I interpret the discrepancy to mean that rookie QBs that record top tier NEPs won't definitely succeed, but nevertheless have a higher chance of succeeding. Conversely, rookie QBs that record bottom tier NEPs have a very low chance of ever succeeding. Only guys like Stafford and Palmer have climed their way out of the bottom tier, and they are former #1 picks. Carr wasn't a former #1 so the chances of him clawing out of the bottom tier rung are lower. Additionally McGloin played his rookie year with a worse receiving core and recorded better numbers than Carr. This times McGloin, a UDFA, is maybe a better QB that McGloin. But even if one doesn't subscribe to that notion, the pure statistical NEP difference between Carr and McGloin's respective NEP implies Carr is the main variable behind his NEP performance.
 
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