Al Jazeera got its hands on some fire ass spy documents

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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fukk you too pal


watching that video where israel stole the blueprints to those missiles. damn they sonned south africa hard there. what's the point of getting the thumb drive back ??? the damage is done . I guess we should remember that israel stuck by south africa...back when...



i dont think iran is developing whole nukes right now. i think iran wants to be at a point where it can fire up its shyt and put a nuke together like a lego set. and i think obamas deal might let them do it, but i haven't got the specifics on the deal so I don't know. All i know is israel fukkin hates it
Iran is developing Nukes.

This is just a way to dig at the west for sticking its nose in everything by hedging deniability as "proof"

Its a way to win a moral victory since you can't directly prove anything.

Iran knows why its nuclear scientists are getting rubbed off and why STUXNET and FLAME were invented.

Iran knows whats going on at Natanz.

Iran knows who AQ Khan is and why they tried to buy reactor core plans from him

AQ Khan knows why he apologized to Pakistan. http://fas.org/nuke/guide/pakistan/nuke/aqkhan020404.html

AQ Khan knows why he brags about helping Iran. www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/pakistan/6170145/A.Q.-Khan-boasts-of-helping-Irans-nuclear-programme.html


Don't be dense. This is for dudes like Glenn Greenwald to bust nut over trying to stop western control and dominance so he can "stand up" to something...Because any power in his eyes is a bad thing.

Remember. A Cynic is someone who knows the price of everything and the value of NOTHING.
 

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the iranian nuke documents arent even leaks tho, the IAEA watch dog had stated Iran wasn't producing nuclear weapons long ago. :heh:
Producing nukes is different from refining nuclear material, owning nuclear plans, owning the parts and components of nukes and assembling them.

Russia has completed nukes ready to fire.

Iran just has a bunch of components.

Ya'll can play dumb if yall want but this proves nothing.

All it says is that Iran doesn't have a formed nuke...not that they haven't pursued them.
 

Liu Kang

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I'm not.

Theres no reason to be spinning U235 if you're not using it.

DOn't be dense.

Governments lie all the time.

I have no reason to believe that AT THE MOMENT Iran may have not had a nuke, but it doesn't mean they weren't pursuing one.
The "paranoid" was not about you, I was quoting somebody else.
 

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This is an Israeli newspaper, but I want you all to pay attention to the point:












Those leaked Mossad cables don't actually contradict Netanyahu on Iran's nuclear program

  • 12 MINUTES AGO
  • 100
ap380503912268.jpg
AP / Richard DrewPrime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel brings out a graphic of a bomb during his address the 67th session of the United Nations General Assembly, Thursday, Sept. 27, 2012.
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To contradict, according to the Oxford English Dictionary online, is to “deny the truth of (a statement) by asserting the opposite.”

Used in a sentence, it might look like this: “Leaked cables show Netanyahu’s Iran bomb claim contradicted by Mossad” – which is fine in terms of usage, at least in the condensed prose of headlines, but only partially supported by the evidence provided by The Guardian and Al-Jazeera.

The two media outlets on Monday published a “secret” memo from the Mossad to its South African counterpart, the State Security Agency. The Guardian underscored this fragment of a sentence: “Iran at this time is not performing the activity necessary to produce weapons…” and claimed that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s “inflammatory rhetoric” and “alarmist tone” in describing the threat emanating from Tehran were directly at odds with the Mossad’s allegedly far more sanguine assessment.

Here’s the passage from Netanyahu’s 2012 UN General Assembly address that The Guardian highlighted: “By next spring, at most by next summer, at current enrichment rates, they will have finished the medium enrichment and move[d] on to the final stage. From there, it’s only a few months, possibly a few weeks, before they get enough enriched uranium for the first bomb.”

Note: enough uranium, not a nuclear weapon.


The Mossad, which intelligence historian and reporter Yossi Melman aptly noted on Twitter is not on close terms with its South African counterpart, and therefore does not share with it sensitive information, does not substantively contradict Netanyahu’s statement.

The leaked Mossad report states that “Iran continues to improve its enrichment abilities and is even liable to advance them significantly” once the then-new centrifuges were put into service. It assessed that Iran is “making efforts” to put the IR40 reactor in Arak into operation, which is “expected to produce enough military-grade plutonium for one bomb per year” – although it would need a nuclear fuel reprocessing plant in order to be converted to fuel for weapons.

“In the area of nuclear of weapons,” the report stated, “there is continued R&D activity at SPND, under the Iranian Defense Ministry, which we understand is intended for accumulating know-how and creating an organizational framework [which] it will be able to make use of to produce nuclear fuel, when the order is given.”

And finally, the full passage from which the quote was cherry picked: “Bottom line: Though Iran at this stage is not performing the activity necessary to produce weapons, it is working to close gaps in areas that appear legitimate such as enrichment, reactors, which will reduce the time required to produce weapons from the time the instruction is actually given.”

In other words, Netanyahu and the Mossad agree that Iran is in pursuit of a bomb and is continually closing in on that objective; that it has advanced on two tracks, uranium and plutonium; and that it has amassed enough five-percent-enriched uranium for several bombs, some of which has been further enriched to 20%. The only disunity between the two assessments regards the rate of enrichment.

Netanyahu said that by the summer of 2013 Iran will have finished the 20% enrichment stage and moved on to the final stage; the Mossad memo, written several weeks after the prime minister’s September 2012 address, says that Iran “does not appear to be ready to enrich it” — its 20% stockpile — “to higher levels.”

In other words, the discrepancy does not revolve around the fundamental issue of whether Iran is, in fact, “performing the activity necessary to produce weapons,” as stated, but rather around the speed with which such action is being taken.

Interestingly, there may well be daylight, and perhaps even an outright contradiction, between the Mossad’s official assessment of the implications of the rise of Hassan Rouhani to the presidency and that of Netanyahu.

rtr47osl.jpg
Mike Segar/ReutersIranian President Hassan Rouhani gestures at the conclusion of his address to the 69th United Nations General Assembly at the United Nations Headquarters in New York, September 25, 2014.

The latter, it would seem, is wary of the significance of the rise of the more Western-oriented political leadership, feeling it is primarily a ruse by Iran’s Supreme Leader, constructed in order to lure — with Rouhani’s smile and Javad Zarif’s Berkeley- and University of Denver-acquired English — the West into a deal that cements Iran’s place, eventually, among the world’s nuclear powers.

The Military Intelligence Directorate, and perhaps the Mossad, too, partially rejected Netanyahu’s assertion that Rouhani, like his predecessors, was simply a “loyal servant of the regime.” In October 2013, Barak Ravid of Haaretz reported that the then commander of military intelligence, Maj. Gen. Aviv Kochavi, submitted an assessment to Netanyahu in which he asserted that, while there has been no change in Iran’s nuclear program, Rouhani’s victory ushered in changes that are “significant” and even “strategic.”

This sort of assessment, though, is truly confidential in nature and there was no word of it in the newly leaked cables.



Read more: http://www.timesofisrael.com/mossad-cables-prove-hardly-contradictory/#ixzz3Sg4XhKoZ
 

Marl0 Stanfield

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The "paranoid" was not about you, I was quoting somebody else.
Wtf makes u think I'm paranoid? I never said the subversion on this site was coming from the gov't or organized entities. This is supposedly a message board for discussion and debate, some ppl have observed :cape: by mods on the flimsiest pretexts of T&C for posters that coincidentally happen to share the same views as that particular mod. There was a cat espousing this same theory in the Black American Men Are Cowards thread.

Of course it's a privately owned site & y'all can do ur thug thizzle if u want to. But for Chrissakes don't get all Pollyanna about it when someone states their opinion on it. shyt, nikka one of the inbox warnings I got from u was complaining about me using the words newblack and fatherless in a thread, as if there's a glossary of acceptable words to use for each subforum:heh:.

shyt I wasn't even using fatherless in a disparaging manner, I was using it to illustrate a major social issue in poor Black neighborhoods that would render a blowback against Black Respectability Politics moot.

I disagreed with u warning posters in the Bible Study thread about that Black Hitler shyt, only because it's a false doctrine when attached to Biblical prophecy and the only way to successfully refute it is to successfully undermine it thru debate.

If a mod comes in :cape:, cats new in their faith will see it and think the Black 4th Reich'ers are on to something. Especially once he sees how Christians get absolutely no :cape: in any other thread but the Bible Study thread.:aicmon: That's why I approach this shyt objectively and my verbiage is acidic as fukk, because I didn't grow up going to tent revivals and ppl acting like Moses holding stone tablets instead of objectively targeting paradoxes and absurdities in various counterarguments weakens the overall position as a whole.

It makes stupid ppl with silly ass assertions zealously believe they're doin thangs when really that approach to discourse on the street will make them want to light themselves on fire in a public square from an onslaught of sonning by more clever spiders than they.

I have no issue with ad hominem as long as ur argument is air tight, otherwise u sound stupid and ppl are gonna poke holes in ur coc00n to reveal just how stupid u are until a person collapses into pure ad hominem, which will get u physically assaulted or arrested on the street.:mindblown:
 

Liu Kang

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*** OFF TOPIC
Wtf makes u think I'm paranoid? I never said the subversion on this site was coming from the gov't or
organized entities. This is supposedly a message board for discussion and debate, some ppl have observed :cape: by mods on the flimsiest pretexts of T&C for posters that coincidentally happen to share the same views as that particular mod. There was a cat espousing this same theory in the Black American Men Are Cowards thread.

Of course it's a privately owned site & y'all can do ur thug thizzle if u want to. But for Chrissakes don't get all Pollyanna about it when someone states their opinion on it. shyt, nikka one of the inbox warnings I got from u was complaining about me using the words newblack and fatherless in a thread, as if there's a glossary of acceptable words to use for each subforum:heh:.

shyt I wasn't even using fatherless in a disparaging manner, I was using it to illustrate a major social issue in poor Black neighborhoods that would render a blowback against Black Respectability Politics moot.
Rules are (slightly) different between the subforums and in HL we try to avoid name calling and caricatures. So don't think that all of our actions are based on snitching because we care about trying to raise the quality bar which is a difficult task lol. Of course, some of them are based on reports, but to think that mods are caping every time we intervene is a wrong statement. About your post, it was not only the newblack stuff, it was all the caricatures that you associated to it. PM me if you need to talk about it and how HL goes down.

I disagreed with u warning posters in the Bible Study thread about that Black Hitler shyt, only because it's a false doctrine when attached to Biblical prophecy and the only way to successfully refute it is to successfully undermine it thru debate.
Considering your join date, you might not be really into The Coli but this simply doesn't work.
Reasonable argumentation always lose against baseless one, not necessarily in the debate but because it derails the thread. When faced against a belief-based or a baseless contradictor, said person will simply move the goal post further and further resulting in a sterile debate and a derailed and unreadable thread. That's why we intervene to put a stop to the bullshyt when we see it. And if people think we caping, that's up to them but the mod team is pretty objective as far as things goes.
Some people have been banned from threads because they derailed them but people are free to post whatever unless their threads are garbage which we either move to the Bushes or simply delete.

If a mod comes in :cape:, cats new in their faith will see it and think the Black 4th Reich'ers are on to something. Especially once he sees how Christians get absolutely no :cape: in any other thread but the Bible Study thread.:aicmon: That's why I approach this shyt objectively and my verbiage is acidic as fukk, because I didn't grow up going to tent revivals and ppl acting like Moses holding stone tablets instead of objectively targeting paradoxes and absurdities in various counterarguments weakens the overall position as a whole.

It makes stupid ppl with silly ass assertions zealously believe they're doin thangs when really that approach to discourse on the street will make them want to light themselves on fire in a public square from an onslaught of sonning by more clever spiders than they.

I have no issue with ad hominem as long as ur argument is air tight, otherwise u sound stupid and ppl are gonna poke holes in ur coc00n to reveal just how stupid u are until a person collapses into pure ad hominem, which will get u physically assaulted or arrested on the street.:mindblown:
I stated it earlier but if you feel like your faith is being insulted, please report.
Surely HL is mostly leftist/atheist and you're obviously in the minority but be assured that the mod team respects everybody's faith (or lack of). We're not in every threads reading every posts so it's up to posters to report things that they feel insulting. And The Bible Study thread was a demand from @Chez Lopez to which we agreed and it works pretty well. It's a safe haven to avoid every threads to go into endless atheist/christian debate which polluted the sub.
 

Marl0 Stanfield

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This is an Israeli newspaper, but I want you all to pay attention to the point:


That first statement just eviscerated the credibility you lazily tried to establish by attacking a notion of Al Jazeera AND the Guardian's objectivity. :mjlol::snoop::snoop:


Let's end this ridiculousness here and now for the slower children among us:

1. Does Israel have nukes?

If no: Why do they refuse to sign non proliferation treaties and build false brick structures to hide apparatuses that could ONLY BE USED IN THE DEVELOPMENT OF WEAPONIZED ATOMIC ENERGY DURING VISITS BY INSPECTORS, YOU KNOW, LIKE HOW THEY KEEP WHINING IRAN IS DOING?


If yes: Then their argument for doing so, which is a sovereign nation's inherent right to pursue self-defense, is sufficient enough for ANY OTHER COUNTRY to pursue weaponized atomic energy, especially when the Israeli allies doggedly pursue economic sanctions against that country, which can be construed as an act of aggression, which is what is about to make Russia get jiggy with it on the world stage. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. It's fukking retarded to go around feigning objectivity when clearly you're speaking from a position of American exceptionalism at best, and pure Israeli exceptionalism at worst. It has been blatantly demonstrated that Israeli exceptionalism is DIAMETRICALLY OPPOSED to American interests. Why the fukk do you think nikkas are up in arms about Netanyahu (that's not even his real name for Chrissakes:dahell:) marching down to Washington per an invitation by John Clockwork Orange Bohner, a borderline-retarded alcoholic right winger who ALREADY DAMN NEAR COLLAPSED THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT with his piss-poorly conceived right wing strategies?

It's a complete and utter paradox to be an atheistic US citizen who rabidly defends American exceptionalism from a position of cultural objectivity, while at the same time taking off your earrings and spreading vaseline on your face to defend Israeli exceptionalism. Exceptionalism defined by theological assertions derived from a book that, as a dyed in the wool atheist, you have repeatedly on THIS VERY FORUM rejected as pure fantasy.

If the Jews needed a homeland, there were myriad places for them to peacefully attempt a mutually beneficial migration to. It's ludicrous to assume they deserve a big ass chunk of Palestine based on a pretext of having semitic ancestry, BECAUSE HAVING COHANIM GENETIC MARKERS DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE THE LEGAL HEIR TO REAL ESTATE "STOLEN" FROM JEWS WHO RESIDED IN PALESTINE SO LONG AGO MOST OF THE PEOPLE ASSERTING INHERITANCE OF SAID REAL ESTATE CAN'T EVEN MOTHERfukkING TRACE THEIR DIRECT LINEAGE BACK TO THE TIME THE SUPPOSED "THEFT" OCCURRED IN THE FIRST fukkING PLACE. :mjlol::snoop::skip:

Defending Israel's existence and aggression towards her neighbors from a secular pragmatic position literally JUSTIFIES IRAN'S PURSUIT OF WEAPONIZED ATOMIC ENERGY.

But of course you as a pragmatic "scientist" already grasp this, hence you presenting strawman arguments that cause logical fukking fallacies to spring out of the ground like blades of goddamned grass every time you hit the 'reply' button in a thread dealing with Middle Eastern issues.
full



 

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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That first statement just eviscerated the credibility you lazily tried to establish by attacking a notion of Al Jazeera AND the Guardian's objectivity. :mjlol::snoop::snoop:

It doesn't actually. It shows i'm willing to admit that you will avoid the points based on anti-israeli bias.


Let's end this ridiculousness here and now for the slower children among us:
1. Does Israel have nukes?

If no: Why do they refuse to sign non proliferation treaties and build false brick structures to hide apparatuses that could ONLY BE USED IN THE DEVELOPMENT OF WEAPONIZED ATOMIC ENERGY DURING VISITS BY INSPECTORS, YOU KNOW, LIKE HOW THEY KEEP WHINING IRAN IS DOING?
They have nukes. The Vanunu affair confirmed this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordechai_Vanunu

If yes: Then their argument for doing so, which is a sovereign nation's inherent right to pursue self-defense, is sufficient enough for ANY OTHER COUNTRY to pursue weaponized atomic energy, especially when the Israeli allies doggedly pursue economic sanctions against that country, which can be construed as an act of aggression, which is what is about to make Russia get jiggy with it on the world stage
. I don't give a fukk. I don't care about other nations. I care about my nation. Period.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
False.

The world isn't fair and its not equal.

Just cause you want a nuke doesn't mean you get one.

Suck it up.

It's fukking retarded to go around feigning objectivity when clearly you're speaking from a position of American exceptionalism at best,
Damn straight.
and pure Israeli exceptionalism at worst.
Israel's welfare isn't my concern.
It has been blatantly demonstrated that Israeli exceptionalism is DIAMETRICALLY OPPOSED to American interests. Why the fukk do you think nikkas are up in arms about Netanyahu (that's not even his real name for Chrissakes:dahell:) marching down to Washington per an invitation by John Clockwork Orange Bohner, a borderline-retarded alcoholic right winger who ALREADY DAMN NEAR COLLAPSED THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT with his piss-poorly conceived right wing strategies?
This sentence means nothing.

It's a complete and utter paradox to be an atheistic US citizen who rabidly defends American exceptionalism from a position of cultural objectivity, while at the same time taking off your earrings and spreading vaseline on your face to defend Israeli exceptionalism.
I didn't support Israel getting nukes and I damn sure don't support more people getting them.

Exceptionalism defined by theological assertions derived from a book that, as a dyed in the wool atheist, you have repeatedly on THIS VERY FORUM rejected as pure fantasy.
And none of this changes my opposition to nuclear proliferation

If the Jews needed a homeland, there were myriad places for them to peacefully attempt a mutually beneficial migration to.
Its not 1947 anymore. Deal with it.


It's ludicrous to assume they deserve a big ass chunk of Palestine based on a pretext of having semitic ancestry, BECAUSE HAVING COHANIM GENETIC MARKERS DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE THE LEGAL HEIR TO REAL ESTATE "STOLEN" FROM JEWS WHO RESIDED IN PALESTINE SO LONG AGO MOST OF THE PEOPLE ASSERTING INHERITANCE OF SAID REAL ESTATE CAN'T EVEN MOTHERfukkING TRACE THEIR DIRECT LINEAGE BACK TO THE TIME THE SUPPOSED "THEFT" OCCURRED IN THE FIRST fukkING PLACE. :mjlol::snoop::skip:
I don't care. Its 2015. Its not 1967. Israel keeps winning these wars so at some point, you can't just whine your way into victory.

Defending Israel's existence and aggression towards her neighbors from a secular pragmatic position literally JUSTIFIES IRAN'S PURSUIT OF WEAPONIZED ATOMIC ENERGY.
I support a 2 state solution. I do not support rogue nuclear proliferation.

Nukes aren't toys and I will hypocritically support any means necessary, violent or otherwise, to prevent their accumulation.

But of course you as a pragmatic "scientist" already grasp this, hence you presenting strawman arguments that cause logical fukking fallacies to spring out of the ground like blades of goddamned grass every time you hit the 'reply' button in a thread dealing with Middle Eastern issues.
full

Not once did you address the flaws in the article written and used to support Mossad's claims (selectively) that Iran had no nukes.

Sure they don't have nukes.

Nukes are completed projects.

Nuclear proliferation IS something they are pursuing
 

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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The "paranoid" was not about you, I was quoting somebody else.
That being said, read up on the content I posted.

Just because Iran doesn't have a nuke on parade on a russian launcher during celebration parades like this:

_198173_parade300.jpg


Doesn't mean they're not:

- buying nuclear design plans
- buying nuclear material in the form of yellowcake
- buying metal alloys used to make nukes (which the CIA has documented and arrested numerous people for...its fascinating if you watch documentaries on the subject)
- operating refineries at rates that produce nuclear material to construct weapons
 

Matt504

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That being said, read up on the content I posted.

Just because Iran doesn't have a nuke on parade on a russian launcher during celebration parades like this:

_198173_parade300.jpg


Doesn't mean they're not:

- buying nuclear design plans
- buying nuclear material in the form of yellowcake
- buying metal alloys used to make nukes (which the CIA has documented and arrested numerous people for...its fascinating if you watch documentaries on the subject)
- operating refineries at rates that produce nuclear material to construct weapons

The United States has nuclear weapons, why shouldn't Iran?
 

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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The United States has nuclear weapons, why shouldn't Iran?
1. I don't want Iran to have nukes
2. I want nuclear proliferation at the cost of the blood of those stupid enough to try it. It should be THAT hard. Nukes are no joke.
3. The world isn't fair and power isn't equal.
4. Not all actors are equally invested in power-sharing nor do they share our values or interests.
5. Just because you want one, doesn't mean you get one. And I don't care how much you bytch about it.

I don't believe in hypocrisy in geopolitics.

This whole "what about what XYZ" argument doesn't bother me and I don't care if it sounds unfair. Nukes are non-compromisable and off the table unilaterally.

I do not pursue equality with respect to geopolitical leverage of other nations nor do I find a vested interest in their nuclear interests.
 

Matt504

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1. I don't want Iran to have nukes
2. I want nuclear proliferation at the cost of the blood of those stupid enough to try it. It should be THAT hard. Nukes are no joke.
3. The world isn't fair and power isn't equal.
4. Not all actors are equally invested in power-sharing nor do they share our values or interests.
5. Just because you want one, doesn't mean you get one. And I don't care how much you bytch about it.

I don't believe in hypocrisy in geopolitics.

This whole "what about what XYZ" argument doesn't bother me and I don't care if it sounds unfair. Nukes are non-compromisable and off the table unilaterally.

I do not pursue equality with respect to geopolitical leverage of other nations nor do I find a vested interest in their nuclear interests.

Why are you so afraid of Iran protecting itself?

:lupe:
 

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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Why are you so afraid of Iran protecting itself?

:lupe:
I care less about Iran's defense than I do one more nation getting official nuclear capabilities.

It reduces US leverage around the world and it challenges the safety of other nations not aligned with our values and interests.

Its bad enough India and Pakistan are not only neighbors but are nuclear states.
 

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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Ya'll kill me with this "well what about the US?"

fukk outta here.

Big dawgs only when nukes are on the table. I don't wanna hear about how much you want one. I don't give a fukk.

95% of ya'll are from or live in the USA anyways. Stop trying to pretend nukes ain't gonna slap you too if they get the chance.

Power matters and I am not interested in sharing with other nations.

You want a nuke? Fine. We're gonna make you bleed for it.

The USA used a nuke? Too bad. We have no interest in using another one and we're not going to make it easy for you to do either.

Suck it up and go cry in your corner.
 

Matt504

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I care less about Iran's defense than I do one more nation getting official nuclear capabilities.

It reduces US leverage around the world and it challenges the safety of other nations not aligned with our values and interests.

Its bad enough India and Pakistan are not only neighbors but are nuclear states.

And none of them used their nukes.


United States on the other hand is on record demonstrating it's irresponsibility with weapons of mass destruction.
hiroshima-bomb-o.gif
 
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