All these debates on God but I hardly see people debate free will

Sensitive Christian Grey

The Fisher King
Joined
Nov 17, 2016
Messages
5,380
Reputation
1,475
Daps
19,324
Reppin
Welsh Hills
Does it exist? :patrice:

I don't mean fate is necessarily the only option/truth, though there's some merit to it (no decision/action is truly irreversible).

But I'm saying determinism seems interesting. Like sure you can make a decision, but the overwhelming context (where you were born, who to - biologically, financially etc, how people have treated you) can make your say in the matter seems moot. At least that's what I understand of determinism. Your thoughts?
 

Dorian Breh

Veteran
Joined
Jan 14, 2016
Messages
20,811
Reputation
13,130
Daps
107,222
Does it exist? :patrice:

I don't mean fate is necessarily the only option/truth, though there's some merit to it (no decision/action is truly irreversible).

But I'm saying determinism seems interesting. Like sure you can make a decision, but the overwhelming context (where you were born, who to - biologically, financially etc, how people have treated you) can make your say in the matter seems moot. At least that's what I understand of determinism. Your thoughts?

You have little control over your circumstance and a lot of the things that happen to you
Even a lot of your "choices" and reactions are based on genetics and biology when u do think about it
Can only control what u can control :manny:
This is an accurate understanding of determinism. OP you should read Thomas Aquinas who says that if God is omnipotent He can see all of eternity at once, hence everything is predestined :ehh:
 

AlainLocke

Banned
Joined
Dec 16, 2015
Messages
16,258
Reputation
2,675
Daps
74,022
No, You Don’t Have Free Will, and This is Why
The Will Is Caused, Not "Free"
Scientists say free will probably doesn't exist, but urge: "Don't stop believing!"
Jerry A. Coyne: You Don't Have Free Will


There is no such thing as a free will...just by the laws of causality...

Your genes, your personal history, your family's personal history, your nation's history, your race's history, and etc determine your present and your future.



To put it in a very everyday example..if you have a personality ( which all of us do)...you do not have free will.


If somebody knows you...as in they know the actions you would take in certain situations...you do not have free will.

We point out people's lack of free will all the time...

"Oh I know John, he wouldn't do that."

Basically saying, there are certain things you will not do because you were DESIGNED that way.

People say shyt all the time that violates the idea of free will.

"Bob is just like his father..."

Meaning you through your genes, you are programmed to behave like your dad.


Free Will is an illusion...a necessary illusion to keep people thinking that what they do has some type of agency...that their actions are their own and that they can affect their position in life. Free Will is the foundation of our collective sense of morality. Sadly, there is no such thing as free will which basically means there is no such thing as morality


Everything you will ever do and everything that will become of you was decided before you was even born.

Your life is nothing but a set of instructions that you carry out. We are programs, a bio-mechanical machine that has a level of sentience that causes us to ponder the nature of our existence and position in the universe. We are essentially AI.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jun 11, 2013
Messages
40,513
Reputation
6,155
Daps
107,533
Reppin
Birmingham, Alabama
Does it exist? :patrice:

I don't mean fate is necessarily the only option/truth, though there's some merit to it (no decision/action is truly irreversible).

But I'm saying determinism seems interesting. Like sure you can make a decision, but the overwhelming context (where you were born, who to - biologically, financially etc, how people have treated you) can make your say in the matter seems moot. At least that's what I understand of determinism. Your thoughts?

We've had this argument on here before and it generally goes like this.

"(If)God is real then why are their children starving in XYZ location and why did he allow XYZ atrocities to occur"

Me: "People have free will, how is It Gods fault any of that happened"

"But God didn't have to make those (evil)people".

Me: "Then you don't want free will"

Back in fourth for 10 pages or so. I saved you time.
 

Genos

Superstar
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
7,526
Reputation
-1,109
Daps
25,718
I don't think there really is an actual argument for free will on both sides of the argument, and that religious folks mainly use it to not look deeply into the complexities that make up ones life.

If you believe in god how can you believe in free will. Most people who believe in god also believe that he intervenes at times in their lives. That's the opposite of free will right there, it doesn't take much farther than Exodous when god hardens pharaoh's heart and makes it so he has to do all the plagues. Even if you ignore that in the bible god constantly interferes with peoples lives for better or worse, religious people also believe god is omniscient. If god knows everything, the beginning and the end then in the end of the day you are following a script that you don't know about. If the future is truly knowable then we are all just drones following whatever path the time map has for us at that given time.

If you don't believe in god or at least one who actively cares about you specifically, and you do it for evidence based reasons then you can't deny the multitude of complex forces at play at every given moment and how they interact within your life. From details like the shape of your brain, your moms financial, emotional, and physical well being while you were in the womb. The time period you were born in, where you were born, what type of food did you eat, what schools did you go to, if you were raised in a area with dangerous chemicals like lead, the well being of the people around you, and really so many things that have nothing to do with you specifically but have an effect in your life. With all those things in mind free will is laughable as a concept at the moment, especially with around 80% of the world living under $10 a day. Yea there is probably some agency and your choices can affect your life outcome but many of the things you do are not like a cartoon devil and angel on your shoulder but rather pre determined algorithms that were made when you were very little or before you were even born.
 

Slangtonomo

Formerly Slang Dussain Ali
Joined
May 23, 2012
Messages
14,279
Reputation
2,415
Daps
39,848
Reppin
www.weohh.com
Black people are older than all this.

Realize the Bible and any other religious article you read are for the men or mankind who came after us.
 
Top