Well maybe if the U.S. would stop interfering with the countries that want something right other than Democracy and Capitalism maybe...maybe...those countries could have or could flourish...Cuba.
as a leftist, i no longer feel like identify with most other leftists
- Thread starter NotaPAWG
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Well maybe if the U.S. would stop interfering with the countries that want something right other than Democracy and Capitalism maybe...maybe...those countries could have or could flourish...Cuba.
JahFocus CS
Get It How You Get It
Why wouldn't the center be the most logical choice?
Can't balance a scale except from the exact middle :panthersafe:
Argument to moderation - Wikipedia
So is the moderation due to: a) lack of care about an issue, b) lack of knowledge, or c) cowardice?
Dafunkdoc_Unlimited
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biscuitsnbangers said:at disagreeing with me then going on to praise Leninproving my exact point
Liberals are inherently, unavoidably hypocritical.
Marlostanfield.
High On That Ray Charles
And no disrespect but you're retarded just like the rest of people who buy into politics these days.
been saying this shyt, since the election
the far left & the far right are the same
jimmy dore / kyle kulinski are no different from rush limburgh/ sean hannity
JahFocus CS
Get It How You Get It
been saying this shyt, since the election
the far left is no differences from the far right
jimmy dore / kyle kulinski are no different from rush limburgh/ sean hannity
You repeating it over and over again doesn't make it true or worth a damn. And rest assured, it is neither true nor worth a damn.
southpawstyle
Superstar
Posted by a dude in a South American Marxist band. Very well thought out.
@JahFocus CS
I want to comment on some things I saw being discussed on the previous page, especially in regards to the violence and political-economic "failures" of socialism and communism.
Starting with the violence - death counts are very passe and some sort of Cold War-era fear mongering bogus. The difference between Communism and Nazism is punching up rather than punching down. Communism attempts to expropriate wealth from those who make fortunes off of other peoples' misery - they can either join the revolution or combat it (as we see in USSR that resulted in firing squads; in Cuba that meant exile). Nazism seeks to construct an internal other out of vulnerable and already marginalized populations for the sake of further consolidating power among the ruling classes (ie. capital and state power).
Now, Marx sees the inevitable culmination of conflict between labor and capital (ie. transition to socialism) as bringing about an inevitable violence just as the conflict between bourgeoisie and oligarchy (ie. transition to capitalism). How the hell do you think Europe (cuz that is what he is talking about, EUROPE) moved out of kingdoms? These bourgeois fools were violent as fukk and defended their revolution with high levels of violence, cuz, well, that's what revolution entails.
I am not a state communist, but I sympathize and support all peripheral, or Third World, socialist projects. I find it very unpalatable when people from within empire comment on the "failures" of socialist projects in the Global South. Most folks know nothing about these places other than some 60 Minutes sort of sound-bytes, yet they want to evaluate whether they fit within the true Marxian model for a socialist country, or whether or not they just inevitably resort to capitalism.
Of course they will have many elements of capitalism! That is what it means to be in the global periphery, the backbone of resource extraction and labor exploitation for the building of empire. They struggle to cut those ties fully because of things like, well EMBARGOES, MILITARY COUPS, CIA-BACKED COUNTERREVOLUTION AND TORTURE CAMPAIGNS, etc. That is what most of these places have faced when attempting to implement even the most basic of Left reforms (REFORMS, is the key word here too!). So to expect them to just cut themselves off from the 500+ years of colonial dependency is absurd - as much as I wish it could happen (and as much as many of these people in the Third World do too), it is a very very hard thing to do considering the reality of the global economy and global politics. But, the most important thing that should be learned is that most of these revolutions are indeed popular revolutions. The support for the Cuban project within Cuba was incredible; same with Chavismo, which saw the highest levels of voter participation in any country of the world outside of countries that had obligatory voting. Does that mean nothing? If these projects have issues, they are for the people from within those countries to sort out and resolve. You need to realize that in many of these places, the option is Chavez/Maduro or Peña Nieto (where you get neo-liberalism on steroids and state complicity in the disappearance of roughly 200,000 people with US support in the past decade for the sake of free market advancement). I think I'd take the former.
Moreover, these reformist projects, due to their popular support, have laid the foundation for what could potentially be an infrastructure for more revolutionary projects in the future - especially as US Empire continues to rapidly shyt the bed and retracts as a political and economic influence in these places. The collapse of US Empire is inevitable, and these people in these parts of the world should have the right to decide how to govern themselves outside of that dependency. Only a white supremacist imperialist a$$hole would say otherwise
What does all this mean for Left projects in the middle of US Empire? To me, our job is to build popular power by supporting people who want to act against their oppression autonomously, both locally and globally. That is what is solidarity and mutual aid. I agree that there is no way to just implement a socialist project from the top. Socialism requires participation and radical subject transformation (which has happened in many parts of the world due to the reality of everyday conditions - go tell people in the Third World that capitalism is better for them cuz Commies killed people, they will laugh in your face cuz they are surrounded by death and misery everyday). In the US, we still have people trying to defend the capitalist system. Most of the working class does not have that sort of "ideological" consciousness. However, many people are indeed willing to fight and confront shyt when times get rough. And that is our role to offer solidarity and a perspective/critique, hopefully contributing to a subject transformation in the US that comes about through shared participation in struggle and what we learn from it about our own system. You can only understand the system through confronting it; you only have a working class that is "for itself" not "in itself" as some some of objective category. So until we can compose ourselves as a working class in the US (rooted in the REALITY of conditions here, not in the ones that Marx wrote about 150 years ago), then we do not have a clear project. BUT, that does not mean that whatever we do is a failure. We are learning, while dealing with all of the contradictions and violences of living within Empire - that should mean something.
@JahFocus CS
islam is not a socially progressive entity.Social issues like Immigration and Islamophobia?
@biscuitsnbangers to answer your question on where do we go from here....ignore the Russia part....
Lenin: What Is To Be Done?
southpawstyle
Superstar
aint you far left ?
the fact you posted - not giving a shyt about all this Russia meddling inwhich the ONLY other group that agrees with that notion is the far right
sorta proves my point
let me be clear - when i say its no differences i'm mostly referring to method not ideology
JahFocus CS
Get It How You Get It
Ask a random person walking down the street if they care and they'll also tell you they don't really care. Has nothing to do with a person being far left or far right, but more to do with priorities.
The only people who care are TV talking heads, those who follow talking heads, and Beltway types.
And you're still wrong if you're making a methods argument, so my original statement stands.
Snoopy Loops
All Star
So you okay with another country directly shaping your country's politics?
JahFocus CS
Get It How You Get It
A few quick thoughts in response to this:
- I find the Israel lobby much more offensive and harmful than anything that Russia did
- As a New Afrikan facing national and racial oppression, I have bigger political concerns than the integrity of my oppressor's system
- As a socialist I understand that bourgeois politics do not serve the working class or its interests
Snoopy Loops
All Star
To the first point, I agree. The influence aipac holds, is absurd. It doesn't help that Christian right justifies them.
To the 2nd point, as an African, I don't see any gain in letting foreign intruders take over your house even if you have disputes with the head of house, and especially if the intruders have no love for you. The home of the neo-nazi revival is in Russia.
To the 3rd point, that might be true, but it doesn't reflect the nature of the political fight right now. On one side of the ring, it's the treasonous, religiously motivated, intolerant, socially stifling, eco-unfriendly right, while on the other side, it is the politically cowardly, PC culture enabling, self serving, climate change accepting left.
I'm going with the left.
JahFocus CS
Get It How You Get It
It is no mere "dispute" with the head of the house, it is more akin to being kept in the basement most days and physically abused. I have no care whatsoever about the house itself, whatever circumstances arise that increase the chance of me being able to escape and get my own house on the block should be seen as opportunities. fukk the intruder but let my enemy and his enemy battle it out while I navigate a separate path in my own interests.
It doesn't represent the nature of the political fight because there is no significant organized working class presence. That's due to a bipartisan (Republican and Democrat) effort over a period of decades to weaken the class. I care for neither of the two sides you described and will continue to focus on building what I think is actually productive and in the interests of the working class (and therefore, the vast majority of humanity) as opposed to expending my energy on a particular political faction that unapologetically serves ruling class interests.