Bernie needs to connect with black voters. Here’s how that’s going.

[Pressure]

Like it or not, Bernie is a victim of his own success.

The national conversation around criminal justice reform is something that draws bipartisan support, most democrats have an economic message and Medicare for all is almost defacto.

From a pure big ticket policy perspective there's at least a handful of candidates who would help the black condition.

But that's not what is being discussed. The ask was, why is Bernie Sanders struggling to connect and how should he do things differently?

 

[Professor Emeritus]

So you agree, he weighed the pros and cons and it was more beneficial for him to cater to the woman vote than the black vote back then.

Who do you believe Bobby Rush and Kweisi Mfume were "catering" to when they voted for the bill? You've still juelzed away from that question every single time I've brought it up.

What about Bernie's voting history has made it appear to you that he was cater to ANYONE's votes?

His positions were so far to the left of the establishment party that he had no chance of imagining winning anything on the national stage. He refused to join the Democratic Party, formed the progressive caucus, and got the support of his constituents more on his personality and adherence to principle rather than a step-by-step alliance with his ideas (which were much more radical than the average Vermont voter). And he had won the last two elections by big margins.

He made his position clear that he was for some aspects of the bill and against others, and like most Democrats voted for it in the end. But he voted for it while issuing a STRONG dissent against the mass incarceration and "tough on crime" principles, principles he'd voted against repeatedly in 1991, 1994, and 1996.

Bernie stans are turning into the Hillary stans they hated so much.

What does that even mean?

Bernie stans were pissed off at Hillary stans in 2016 because:

1. They felt she represented the establishment that had brought this country to a tough place
2. They felt the establishment had chosen her without giving the voters their fair say
3. They saw Hillary stans (just as in 2008) launching personal attacks, often not even having to do with policy and often blaming ambiguous "sexism" for any dissent from their chosen one
4. They falsely accused Bernie of being unelectable when she in fact was the one who botched the election

What about that describes me or anyone else in this thread? We're DEFENDING Bernie, we're not even attacking other candidates like y'all are. Is it wrong to defend a candidate you like now?

 

[88m3]

Most of the "progressives" on this board aren't blown away by Tulsi either so that's another misguided attack. I've cast shade in her direction.

I agree that people shytting on Black women for supporting a different candidate are talking some bullshyt. Have you seen me, personally, talking out of hand though? I think I remember the comment you're talking about but I can't find it now, didn't everyone just ignore him and move on? It was too foolish to engage with that shyt - I haven't responded to 75% of the anti-Bernie slander in this thread either. Don't lump me or @FAH1223 or any other quality progressive posters in with people who are talking about this shyt like they talk about sports teams.

Like I've said repeatedly, I have no problem with people who prefer other candidates on the issues. I like Warren too, more than Bernie in several ways, and I've had good things to say about most of the candidates in the field at one time or another (except Biden ). I have no problem with people who think that Bernie is too old, or not specific enough, or just doesn't click with them. I'm only calling out two bad narratives - its stupid to say that Bernie being active in the CRM isn't a positive, and its misleading to claim that he was on the wrong side of the mass incarceration issue. Bernie's got receipts for standing up with Black people way back before it was popular, and Bernie's got receipts for standing up against mass incarceration back before it was popular. I'm projecting clarity on those two issues and that's all.

Oh I'm not accusing you of anything I just wondered if you saw the absurdity in some of the positions being taken in here and in general.

It's disconcerting that some people on the left are so dismissive of these women's concerns. It's like Sanders' and his supporters never changed their attitudes about black people's concerns.

As far as the crime bill goes it's a bit of a dead horse at this point to me but it's "odd" that it's continuously brought up to smear someone who isn't even running(as far as I'm aware and other nuances) but Bernie is immune from such labels(like other "missteps" he's taken). The hypocrisy of it all is a bit much to stomach and he hasn't done much to quash it from where I sit. Personally I wish he had more receipts and more hard policy but that's neither here nor there and I suppose. An event was set up so women of color can have a voice and get to listen to candidates directly and now some people are saying no and making light of their opinions and I think that is very wrong.

 

[NZA]

that article was confusing - he didnt do well explaining how he can specifically help black voters, but liz talking about colorblind free-college policy is somehow doing a better job on black policy?

all the major candidates are poor at addressing ADOS needs

bernie is unlikable to a lot of older black folk. he may lose them in the primary. he has no practice at this type of politics, and at his age he may never get much better. you can wage a war on black people but if you get the style down, hacks will invite you to the cookout and the apathetic will go along with it.

liz is really good on domestic policy, and she has bernie to thank for creating her lane at the presidential level. and progressive voters have bernie to thank for normalizing all this socialism that has pulled the candidates farther left than the center is comfortable with.

i think the most fair assessment is bernie being an old white man from vermont is a limitation on his style, and him being an independent means that he lacks strong relationships with democrat bosses and any of his flaws are to be magnified by partisan hacks among the punditry. he is, however, the only one responsible for pulling our politics left and preventing the race from being all about how bad trump is, which is the only way to actually win - having actual ideas people can be proud to vote for.

 

[Pressure]

Who do you believe Bobby Rush and Kweisi Mfume were "catering" to when they voted for the bill? You've still juelzed away from that question every single time I've brought it up.

Bobby Rush agreed with the bill at the time. He thought tough on crime policy would actually lead to positive change in the black community.

He has since condemned his own vote saying it was one of the two worst things that have happened to the black community in the last 50 years.

Regarding Mfume, his interviews at the time of the bill was that he was using the CBC to play politics to gain someeverage, but overall he supported the bill. These are his words:

Q: Does the crime bill help or hurt African Americans?

A: I don't care what color you are, if you are a criminal, you aren't going to like the crime bill. Beyond that, if you are looking for some sense of security, for bans on weapons that are in our streets, for additional police officers and for programs for inner-city and rural young people, the crime bill helps you.

They both thought it was a good bill. So they voted for it.

What about Bernie's voting history has made it appear to you that he was cater to ANYONE's votes?

Bernie himself admitted he supported the bill because of its protections on domestic violence despite his concerns that it was a "Punishment bill."

As I said before, he weighed the pros and cons and thought the violance against women act was more important than the harm it would cause to the black community. Looking at the makeup of his constituents at the time, I can understand how he came to that conclusion.

His positions were so far to the left of the establishment party that he had no chance of imagining winning anything on the national stage. He refused to join the Democratic Party, formed the progressive caucus, and got the support of his constituents more on his personality and adherence to principle rather than a step-by-step alliance with his ideas (which were much more radical than the average Vermont voter). And he had won the last two elections by big margins.

He made his position clear that he was for some aspects of the bill and against others, and like most Democrats voted for it in the end. But he voted for it while issuing a STRONG dissent against the mass incarceration and "tough on crime" principles, principles he'd voted against repeatedly in 1991, 1994, and 1996.

Again, I don't really care much for his strong dissent when he could have just voted no if it actually mattered that much to him.

He's a lawmaker, he voted on a bill that significantly impacted the lives of millions of black men, women, and children as a calculated risk.

Not everyone gets the vote right, but he voted for the bill and he deserves criticism for it. Especially since he knew at the time the potential for harm it would cause.

What does that even mean?

Bernie stans were pissed off at Hillary stans in 2016 because:

What about that describes me or anyone else in this thread? We're DEFENDING Bernie, we're not even attacking other candidates like y'all are. Is it wrong to defend a candidate you like now?

It means that you're disregarding legitimate criticism just because he's your guy. It's the same behavior that cost Hillary the Whitehouse.

 

[Professor Emeritus]

Oh I'm not accusing you of anything I just wondered if you saw the absurdity in some of the positions being taken in here and in general.

Yeah, it's dumb shyt, but what can you do? There are people who treat politics like they stan sports heroes and don't realize the seriousness of the issues.

It's disconcerting that some people on the left are so dismissive of these women's concerns. It's like Sanders' and his supporters never changed their attitudes about black peoples concerns.

I don't think that's true about Sanders, he was campaigning step-by-step with people like Killer Mike and Nina Turner from early on, but when BLM disrupted his speech he took that moment to reevaluate and got more explicit in trying to reach out to Black people (early in the campaign I don't think he believed he had a chance in hell of winning and was just trying to get a few of his main ideas out there, he wasn't catering to anyone). It was a losing battle because Clinton had GOAT name recognition and connections in the South and he had none, but he made some inroads. Then for this campaign he made Turner his national co-chair and Grey his press secretary. So I don't think you can claim he's unresponsive, it's just that his calling card is still going to be his calling card and his main focus is always going to be a better safety net for everyone.

As far as the crime bill goes it's a bit of a dead horse at this point to me but it's "odd" that it's continuously brought up to smear someone who isn't even running(as far as I'm aware and other nuances) but Bernie is immune from such labels(like other "missteps" he's taken). The hypocrisy of it all is a bit much to stomach and he hasn't done much to quash it from where I sit. Personally I wish he had more receipts and more hard policy but that's neither here nor there and I suppose.

It's the anti-Bernie people who brought up the crime bill, not the pro-Bernie people.

And the only reason it's brought up regarding Clinton is when people start trying to re-litigate the past, or when people start acting blind to why everyone is so pissed at the Democratic establishment.

 

[Pressure]

He made his position clear that he was for some aspects of the bill and against others, and like most Democrats voted for it in the end.

And the only reason it's brought up regarding Clinton is when people start trying to re-litigate the past, or when people start acting blind to why everyone is so pissed at the Democratic establishment.

This is where you all confuse me. He's antiestablishment when you build him as your hero, but when he does something wrong it isn't a big deal because the establishment did it too.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

And it's silly.
Facts, the only person near Bernie (and better in some ways) on criminal justice is Corey Booker.
Facts, the bill was going to pass anyways.
Facts, it's perfectly valid to course attack Bernie on the grounds that abstaining on principle was better than a vote for the other provision he wanted, but it's patently absurd to ignore or play down his speech, when half of his critics and those blue check folks complain about Bernie not being "intersectional" when that speech was everything they claim to want.

I could literally care less about this line of critique on Bernie, I find it one of the least valid.

He voted for the bill despite his "reservations."

makes you wonder why he N E V E R votes for Russian sanctions







@88m3 @ADevilYouKhow @wire28 @dtownreppin214
@DonKnock @dza @wire28 @BigMoneyGrip @Dameon Farrow @re'up @Blackfyre @Cali_livin @NY's #1 Draft Pick

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

liz is really good on domestic policy, and she has bernie to thank for creating her lane at the presidential level. and progressive voters have bernie to thank for normalizing all this socialism that has pulled the candidates farther left than the center is comfortable with.

you nikkas are so disrespectful at this point is should be illegal.

Bruh. Hillary Clinton had a MORE PROGRESSIVE version of Obamacare 25 years ago.

Warren was blogging her ass off about this shyt BEFORE SHE EVEN GOT IN THE SENATE IN THE EARLY 2000s!

Yall really think Bernie really created the stars and moon out this bytch don't you?




@wire28 @Return to Forever @ezrathegreat @Jello Biafra @humble forever @Darth Nubian @Dameon Farrow @Piff Perkins @BigMoneyGrip @Iceson Beckford @Lucky_Lefty @johnedwarduado @Armchair Militant @panopticon @88m3

 

[Piffery]

Chuck Grassley

?
I'm just pointing out that Booker's beliefs on aging out of violent crime and the issue of lengthy sentencing, for violent crime, is not only incredibly unique, but brave.



There's bi-partisan support, and there's being able to take that next step on voting rights and other issues like Bernie/Booker.

Also, I happen to value consistency on those values, maybe you don't.

 

[NZA]

you nikkas are so disrespectful at this point is should be illegal.

Bruh. Hillary Clinton had a MORE PROGRESSIVE version of Obamacare 25 years ago.

Warren was blogging her ass off about this shyt BEFORE SHE EVEN GOT IN THE SENATE IN THE EARLY 2000s!

Yall really think Bernie really created the stars and moon out this bytch don't you?




@wire28 @Return to Forever @ezrathegreat @Jello Biafra @humble forever @Darth Nubian @Dameon Farrow @Piff Perkins @BigMoneyGrip @Iceson Beckford @Lucky_Lefty @johnedwarduado @Armchair Militant @panopticon @88m3

a first lady is not like being a candidate. she wasnt offering anything bold when she actually ran. i dont even remember what the hell her 2016 cause d'etre was other than inevitability

a blog from a non-politician liz? im sure 200 people were really moved by that. im talking presidential level, and warren was so shook in 2016 she wouldnt even endorse anyone or campaign to become a VP pick. bernie was proof of concept, and his remaining status as the most popular left politician in america seems to have helped AOC as well. i dont even believe bernie thought he would do as well as he did until it was too late. the national left in this country was dormant as hell until 2016. now all kinds of people are bringing out big policies that would have been laughed at years ago

 

[Pressure]

?
I'm just pointing out that Booker's beliefs on aging out of violent crime and the issue of lengthy sentencing, for violent crime, is not only incredibly unique, but brave.



There's bi-partisan support, and there's being able to take that next step on voting rights and other issues like Bernie/Booker.

Also, I happen to value consistency on those values, maybe you don't.

I prefer direct engagement from a candidate.

 

[Piffery]

I prefer direct engagement from a candidate.

I don't care about Bernies supposed lack of "engagement" with black voters when I and millions of others black voters support him, and the polls/stats show so.

I think everyone should support who's positions or governing style they align with, everything else is just noise in my mind.

 

[Unknown Poster]

By the time his campaign aides scrambled to release a detailed criminal justice platform on Aug. 9, Sanders was still struggling. In a September meeting with Campaign Zero, a movement formed out of the Ferguson protests, activists asked Sanders why, in his opinion, there were a disproportionate amount of people of color in jail for nonviolent drug offenses. Sanders, seated across the table, a yellow legal pad at hand, responded with a question of his own, according to two people present: “Aren’t most of the people who sell the drugs African American?” The candidate, whose aides froze in the moment, was quickly rebuffed: The answer, the activists told him, was no. Even confronted with figures and data to the contrary, Sanders appeared to have still struggled to grasp that he had made an error, the two people present said.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/rubycramer/bernie-sanders-revolution-needs-black-voters-to-win-but-can

 

[Unknown Poster]

First if all Bernie Sanders really lost me during the Democratic state of the union address when he refused to share the podium with Stacy Abrams

He's treated the Democratic party like a girl he has sex with in private but won't be seen with in public.

Bottom line hes really shown he has had trouble with getti g the black vote recently and being on Twitter there is a huge contingent of Black people who would not vote for Bernie Sanders...hell not just Black people.

Bernie Bros are aggressive and harass women online and doxx people who dont support Bernie Sanders...splintering the Democratic ticket as a result before the election. It's obvious his ideas appeal to liberals who dont want to watch the status quo go away. America needs Democratic Socialism but where are his realistic policies and plans?

Anybody can beat Trump but Bernie does not have the same momentum he had in 2016.

He's alienated Black people, women and the LGBT and those make a significant contribution to the Dem vote. Right now the vast majority of Bernie supporters are white guys.

Personally the man is past his bedtime. I wish him the best but I will not be supporting him or voting for him.