Could Bootcamp have even been bigger than The Wu ?

[WIA20XX]

Those two were just as good as the other two. SCC never really got the push they deserved because their prime coincided with Death Row’s prime. And at that time DR overshadowed most west coast acts that weren’t from the Bay.

Lemme Guess, you think Biggie stole his style from this guy

 

[CoryMack]

Lemme Guess, you think Biggie stole his style from this guy

Couldn’t possibly give any less of a fukk my friend.

 

[Frump]

I'm well aware. It dropped in April of 1995. (way after Tical, which apparently was a disappointment to a lot of people)

MTV spins...MTV and BET played a lot of videos.

But Video was always about reaching folks that didn't listen to Black Radio.

You know what was actually popular on Black Radio in April of 1995?







Maybe, just maybe, somebody in Detroit or Chicago or Phoenix heard the All I Need Remix during a mix show - but Wu never really dominated the airwaves. It was only some elite East Coast cats that did (Like Biggie, but not Nas), because even in 95, The South and The West were at least 50% of Black Music at that point.

The song hit #1 on the hiphop
r&b charts yet it was only played alot on NYC radio and maybe some midnight mix shows everywhere else?

 

[TheDarceKnight]

Mega Star? 31 years ago?

Relative to who? Mic Geronimo? King Just?

Mega Star in 94 was Snoop, Biggie. Meth still isn't on that level.

Can you play any Wu Tang at the summer cookout like you can with Snoop and Biggie? Not really. They never made radio records.

In 94, Method wasn't on Masta Killa status, but you had to be heavily into East Coast hip hop in 1994 to know Meth, when the West Coast was arguably at its heights.

Maybe in the Tri- State. Out of the squad, ODB was probably the most recognizable because of his antics on MTV.

Meth was a star bro. There's a reason why he was the only guy in the group with his own solo track. RZA talked about that before.

All I Need with Mary was absolutely a big song.

Tical and ODB both went platinum on their debut albums relatively fast.

Meth was absolutely not on the same tier as Rae, Ghost, GZA, Deck, etc. He was more popular than they were, for sure.

 

[maxamusa]

Not really - that was the little nikkas catchin a bad one. Tek was hooked in with BIG and I doubt that beef was ever going to go too far.

When Enta da Stage dropped, in real time the discussion was maybe that was better than Enter the Wu-Tang 36 Chambers. At the very least the albums were different but equal to most of the people I knew. Da Shinin dropped before OB4CL and Liquid Swords, and Smif n Wessun had undeniable NYC hood anthems (Sound Bwoy Burreill is a record to this day I'll put up against any NYC record as defining the mood and feel of the city back then). But then the Wu dropped classic after bonafide classic on everyone's heads and there was no debate anymore. I think all the reasons were laid out in the thread, though there are some things I personally disagree with.

I thought the second Wu album was disappointing, but their stanbase had grown to incorporate so many non-nikkas that their momentum was unstoppable. Add in their mythological status with that goofy TV show, and you have people who weren't there in real time who believe all their albums are sacrosanct. But it wasn't Wu's double that cemented their rep, it was the raw solo albums. And yeah, the production was a big part of the distinction between Wu and BCC as the years went on. But I think that's unfair to Beatminerz, because their brief run was incredible. And you can't say the BCC lacked the talent, because they had so many elements: Sean P was the credible cool street dude who could rap his ass off; Rock had the amazing voice; Smif & Wessun had the back and forth chemistry; Starang had the it factor; Buck was already a semi-star. But longevity takes timing and luck in addition to talent, and everything just broke the wrong way for them. @Awesome Wells laid out the Smif & Wessun situation. Rock had the voice but seemed directionless for a while and was going through weird label shyt. Buck was very much of his moment and his sound was so tied to Beatminerz he sounded weird going forward. Sean Price was always nice but it took BCC falling apart for him to find that extra something that made him the super ill underground Lord. The stars just didn't align for the crew as a whole.

But just to be clear, they were never going to be what the Wu became because how the fukk can you make sense of the Wu? All those nikkas from Staten Island, which most New Yorkers consider some other off brand city entirely, with an all time producer, dope rhymers who almost all evolved into elite rhymers, and two crossover super hero stars (ODB and Meth). BCC had no chance to be that. My homie was talking to me last year about the different rappers who briefly had the aura of "coolest nikka in New York" from Rakim to Kane to Puba to Q-Tip to Jay-Z... The Wu had two of those in one group in Meth and Ghost. And then they had a once-in-a-lifetime spectacle of a supernova in ODB, who I always thought has a similar spirit to Pac. Wu Tang is incomprehensible, a one-of-one.

5 star posting breh; repped

 

[TheDarceKnight]

Not really - that was the little nikkas catchin a bad one. Tek was hooked in with BIG and I doubt that beef was ever going to go too far.

When Enta da Stage dropped, in real time the discussion was maybe that was better than Enter the Wu-Tang 36 Chambers. At the very least the albums were different but equal to most of the people I knew. Da Shinin dropped before OB4CL and Liquid Swords, and Smif n Wessun had undeniable NYC hood anthems (Sound Bwoy Burreill is a record to this day I'll put up against any NYC record as defining the mood and feel of the city back then). But then the Wu dropped classic after bonafide classic on everyone's heads and there was no debate anymore. I think all the reasons were laid out in the thread, though there are some things I personally disagree with.

I thought the second Wu album was disappointing, but their stanbase had grown to incorporate so many non-nikkas that their momentum was unstoppable. Add in their mythological status with that goofy TV show, and you have people who weren't there in real time who believe all their albums are sacrosanct. But it wasn't Wu's double that cemented their rep, it was the raw solo albums. And yeah, the production was a big part of the distinction between Wu and BCC as the years went on. But I think that's unfair to Beatminerz, because their brief run was incredible. And you can't say the BCC lacked the talent, because they had so many elements: Sean P was the credible cool street dude who could rap his ass off; Rock had the amazing voice; Smif & Wessun had the back and forth chemistry; Starang had the it factor; Buck was already a semi-star. But longevity takes timing and luck in addition to talent, and everything just broke the wrong way for them. @Awesome Wells laid out the Smif & Wessun situation. Rock had the voice but seemed directionless for a while and was going through weird label shyt. Buck was very much of his moment and his sound was so tied to Beatminerz he sounded weird going forward. Sean Price was always nice but it took BCC falling apart for him to find that extra something that made him the super ill underground Lord. The stars just didn't align for the crew as a whole.

But just to be clear, they were never going to be what the Wu became because how the fukk can you make sense of the Wu? All those nikkas from Staten Island, which most New Yorkers consider some other off brand city entirely, with an all time producer, dope rhymers who almost all evolved into elite rhymers, and two crossover super hero stars (ODB and Meth). BCC had no chance to be that. My homie was talking to me last year about the different rappers who briefly had the aura of "coolest nikka in New York" from Rakim to Kane to Puba to Q-Tip to Jay-Z... The Wu had two of those in one group in Meth and Ghost. And then they had a once-in-a-lifetime spectacle of a supernova in ODB, who I always thought has a similar spirit to Pac. Wu Tang is incomprehensible, a one-of-one.

This is a great post. Wu was just such a lightning in a bottle thing. Just a once in a lifetime thing that could never be duplicated or recaptured, and a lot of it was due to circumstances and luck and other x-factors that were never in the cards for BCC

 

[Greenhornet]

not at all

 

[WIA20XX]

The song hit #1 on the hiphop
r&b charts yet it was only played alot on NYC radio and maybe some midnight mix shows everywhere else?

Agreed.

So we're on the same page.

I just draw a different conclusion.

 

[Frump]

I think Deck has a handful of verses that show he has a level of depth Starang never reached. Duel of the Iron Mic is an obvious one. Oddly enough, bombing atomically is not one for me. But he has an obscure verse on Cormega’s Industry remix that I think of. You had to have been there for that moment to understand it: Starang was a thing. A lot of us thought he had it.

The album delay then flood with Decks album and Meth is one of the biggest what if’s in hiphop history

Decks solo I think was supposed to come out right after Tical or return to 36 chambers. Who knows how his solo career turns out or how he’s looked at if he has one classic under his belt

 

[WIA20XX]

The album delay then flood with Decks album and Meth is one of the biggest what if’s in hiphop history

Decks solo I think was supposed to come out right after Tical or return to 36 chambers. Who knows how his solo career turns out or how he’s looked at if he has one classic under his belt

He'd be remembered better, but his solo career would be just like GZA but not Ghostface. Hip hop does not reward their type of rapping.

 

[Walt]

The album delay then flood with Decks album and Meth is one of the biggest what if’s in hiphop history

Decks solo I think was supposed to come out right after Tical or return to 36 chambers. Who knows how his solo career turns out or how he’s looked at if he has one classic under his belt

100%

I think about the flood and the fire that got Q-Tip all the time. We’ll never know what we lost as fans of music.

 

[TheDarceKnight]

He'd be remembered better, but his solo career would be just like GZA but not Ghostface. Hip hop does not reward their type of rapping.

I do agree with this. Deck's first solo was never going to make him a superstar. But it could've been a classic.

 

[TheDarceKnight]

In NYC, yes. But even outside of NYC their r&b features still get burn everywhere I’ve been (Anything remix, Fantasy, Freek’n You). They had such star power they were associated with universal bangers few other street oriented dudes could pull off.

I lived in NC and All I Need Remix definitely got burn.

 

[Walt]

I lived in NC and All I Need Remix definitely got burn.

Oddly enough Carolina radio was the first place I heard N-Tyce's Method Man assisted single Hush Hush tip

 

[BuddahMAC]

Oddly enough Carolina radio was the first place I heard N-Tyce's Method Man assisted single Hush Hush tip

N-Tyce was from Greensboro



shouts to 4th Disciple