"Dear Ghost, you the only nikka I know, like, when the cops come you never hide your toast"

[tuckgod]

Ghost let a white bytch call him a nikka smh

Negged.

 

[Swirv]

Negged.

He said it in his own rap

Stop putting man on a pedestal

 

[Thatrogueassdiaz]

Just Nutmeg............to no beat

Oh? Where did he write the rest of that album?

he still had it right up until fish scale. he just dumbed the slang down so it wasn't so tough to digest. peep the second verse on charlie brown, shakey dog, never be the same (to be a fly on the wall when that nikka decided he was gonna use a "pyoooooooon" sound effect in the middle of his verse... ).

SC is my fave ghostface album... but there's also something ill about the way he can still be super, super vivid without being abstract, like he was during bulletproof, pretty toney and fish scale. it's that same energy. and i can't speak for others, but when i say ghost fell off, that's what i'm referring to. u listen to his verses up to a point, and it's so obvious how much being seen as the best MC mattered to him (and conversely, how not being recognized for it commercially took the hunger out of his verses). not one of. but THE best. whether it was abstract, story-telling, technical shyt, metaphors, swag... that nikka starks used to do things with verses that no one would even consider until after he showed them how.

easily in my Top 5 all-time.

Dumbing it down probably had something to do with signing with def jam. Ironically, SC was the last album of his to go platinum. Plus i still think SC was where he found the holy grail in creativity. He almost duplicated it on fishscale, but he still couldnt redo it.

See, that's why I had an issue with you and several other dudes trying to slander the God's MC acuity over the last several years. The last few Ghost albums haven't really been real solo Ghost albums. These last few projects with Adrian Younge and BADBADNOTGOOD had a totally different dynamic. The albums came out well but you can't compare what he's doing on there with what he's done on his previous solos.

Ghost still can be as vivid as any MC in the game. He had quality verses on the Better Tomorrow album and some of his guest spots has also been top notch. One great example of how Ghost can still paint an ill visual is his verse on Stella on the Wu-Block album:

Stay dip, cute bytch out in Delaware,
moving our bricks of hard, stupid big stones in Miss Stella ear
She just turn 35, we in the spot on Martin Luther King Drive
Whole team getting high,
on phones we learned different codes of pig Latin
So the jakes don’t follow our trail with sick patterns
And the crib is jig, Jennifer convertible love seat
That’s worth forty G’s from Madrid
In Spain, sipping cherry Cosmo’s and things
Stella, finish the glass, showing nikkas her rings
I said "bytch, I ain’t impressed with that!
Why the fukk is every briefcase short by at least ten stacks?!
We had a mil' in each bag, there’s eighty grand missing
You pop up with a new Jag', with a bad system
I done sent your ass to Hawaii and Waikiki
When your man needed bail, you’ll come see me
Rob me? That’s how we do? You pretty slick muthafukka
You must think I’m a sucker!
Matter fact, you gon' suck this dikk, how bout that for a change?
Let me see what’s really on your brain"
She said "Starkey, you violating me, stop it
I saved up for this shyt, you playing me like a hostage
Out of all people, I wheeled you around, when you got shot
Be the closest one too you, and may I rot in hell"
yo Starks, chill, I don’t think she that stupid
Since '90, '95, she came through, kid
Two million in six weeks, cover six space
Just to think of those towns alone, we brought a big steak

Ill storytelling. And how about his verse on Outta Town Sh!t, Guest House or the whole Alex track? Those verses are classic storytelling Tone and post Fishscale. He also sound pristine on those released Doomstarks tracks. That talk of him falling off is premature. His last real solo was Wizard of Poetry (Apollo Kids was basically unreleased tracks he put together to expedite his fulfillment of his Def Jam contract). Let's wait until we get his next real solo before we start going around claiming he fell off.

No, you just don't want to admit the man has aged. It happens to all the greats. Honestly I think part of the problem is he stopped trying adter big doe rehab. The lack of sales of that album crushed his spirit.

wizard of poetry is my shyt. i dont think ghost fell off there at all. i just dont consider it up there with his very best work. same for big doe rehab. there are moments on both those albums that belong right up there with anything he's ever done tho.

alex and the More FIsh shyt doesnt really count towards your argument imo. it's basically from the fishscale sessions.

wu-block tho? man. u have no idea how hard i tried. but nope. same for the adrian younge shyt. it doesnt mean he's not still good. but it's about more than what he's saying on those albums (ghost will always have a knack for writing... he could probably be a scriptwriter. it's clearly a gift). it's how he's saying it. ghost's flow has gotten pretty stale over the years.

the funny thing about me and you going back and forth is that i literally just said this dude is in my top 5. and i think it's pretty obvious i'm not a casual fan when it comes to tony stark. u take exception for reasons that dont even make sense to me.

acknowledging ghost has lost a step or two doesnt tarnish his legacy. it's acknowledging that eventually, they all lose a step, even the very greatest, ghost included. doesn't mean he's wack to admit he's not the MC he once was, or to acknowledge he's dropped more than one song over the last few years that have been straight up trashbin-status. it's been happening to hov for a while now too. so what? ghost will always be that nikka, regardless.

that said, would love nothing more than for ghost to drop SC2 and shut me the whole entire fukk up. so here's to hoping you're 100% correct.

Big doe rehab was his last great project. The fall off starts right after that.

one of the last hiphop songs to amaze me when i first heard it, another was a cannabil ox song that never came out

Which Ox song?

 

[tuckgod]

he still had it right up until fish scale. he just dumbed the slang down so it wasn't so tough to digest. peep the second verse on charlie brown, shakey dog, never be the same (to be a fly on the wall when that nikka decided he was gonna use a "pyoooooooon" sound effect in the middle of his verse... ).

SC is my fave ghostface album... but there's also something ill about the way he can still be super, super vivid without being abstract, like he was during bulletproof, pretty toney and fish scale. it's that same energy. and i can't speak for others, but when i say ghost fell off, that's what i'm referring to. u listen to his verses up to a point, and it's so obvious how much being seen as the best MC mattered to him (and conversely, how not being recognized for it commercially took the hunger out of his verses). not one of. but THE best. whether it was abstract, story-telling, technical shyt, metaphors, swag... that nikka starks used to do things with verses that no one would even consider until after he showed them how.

easily in my Top 5 all-time.

Dap + Rep

 

[tuckgod]

Starksy with the gum sole

 

[TrifeGod]

Ok, I lied it's not No Pork on my Fork Part 2, I was thinking of Hidden Darts Part 2 and 3

 

[Billy Ocean]

Oh? Where did he write the rest of that album?
Dumbing it down probably had something to do with signing with def jam. Ironically, SC was the last album of his to go platinum. Plus i still think SC was where he found the holy grail in creativity. He almost duplicated it on fishscale, but he still couldnt redo it.

No, you just don't want to admit the man has aged. It happens to all the greats. Honestly I think part of the problem is he stopped trying adter big doe rehab. The lack of sales of that album crushed his spirit.


Big doe rehab was his last great project. The fall off starts right after that.
Which Ox song?

Never said he didn't age, just don't prescribe to the illogical belief that he "fell off". His voice sounds older but Ghost still puts out dope music and verses. I reserve the term "fall off" for dudes who no longer does either. You dudes love to use that term super liberally, and the main reason is because alot of yall mad because he moved on from his Supreme Clientele style (about 15 years ago now...may I add). When Ghost comes out with a true solo and it's not dope, I'll be the first to say he fell off. Until then, he's still an avant garde MC and still the most consistent legend in the game.

 

[Atsym Sknyfs]

The decline on Ghosetface to me started when he drooped the killah from his name so Target and Walmart would stock his CDs. Even he knew it was problem cause he went back to killah but he just used GFK instead of spelling his name.

And I don't mean decline so say he's wack.. its the decline of the extra abstractness now its just like in your face

 

[BuddahMAC]

graveyard spells fog your goggles

 

[mr. smoke weed]

graveyard spells fog your goggles

Laying like needless in the hospital...........

Buddah, you ever show the god mc the coli?

 

[BuddahMAC]

Its the decline of the extra abstractness now its just like in your face

He dropped the abstract style mainly because so many music critics/people criticized Ghost's style as babbling or not knowing what he was talking about. That's why Bulletproof Wallets sessions are almost entirely concept songs & storytelling tracks, but when that release got jacked up w/ sample clearance & all, Ghost took it on himself as his lyrics were the problem again. That's why I think Pretty Tony/Theodore Unit era was where he kind of backed off and rhymed more basic crimy shyt. The Fishscale/More Fish sessions were more an amalgam of all Ghost's styles so far so it was a nice uptick, but I agree that I miss the abstract Ghostface.

With most his recent projects being reciting other people's story albums, it feels like a minute since I got some real Ghostface to know where he's at now. I got a sneaking suspicion that when SC2 finally drops, Ghost is going to come through.

 

[Billy Ocean]

Supreme Clientele also the last Wu album with classic skits. That's part of the reason why it's so special. Part of the reason Cuban Linx 2 wasn't as good as the original is because of its lack of notable skits. No Rae and Ghost snorting. No Ghost slapping n!ggas for bubbling on his block. No Woodrow the basehead. No "Where's my Killer tape"...none of that. One of the reasons I know that that Cilvaringz Wu album is a gem (too bad we'll probably never get to hear it) is because Cilvaringz knows the importance of those skits in those early Wu classic albums.

 

[Inspect Her Deck]

Supreme Clientele also the last Wu album with classic skits. That's part of the reason why it's so special. Part of the reason Cuban Linx 2 wasn't as good as the original is because of its lack of notable skits. No Rae and Ghost snorting. No Ghost slapping n!ggas for bubbling on his block. No Woodrow the basehead. No "Where's my Killer tape"...none of that. One of the reasons I know that that Cilvaringz Wu album is a gem (too bad we'll probably never get to hear it) is because Cilvaringz knows the importance of those skits in those early Wu classic albums.

What did you think of the FishScale skits though?

I mean ignoring those 6 second transitions

the spoiled brat kid, the heart street directions, the barbershop transition into the song

that may have been the last album

 

[Billy Ocean]

What did you think of the FishScale skits though?

I mean ignoring those 6 second transitions

the spoiled brat kid, the heart street directions, the barbershop transition into the song

that may have been the last album

I love the bad kid skit leading into Whip You with a Strap but that's the only one that I loved. The other skits were cool but nothing as creative as the ones on those early Wu albums. Even the Clyde Smith skit is only notable to me because of the shots at 50. Fishscale is still a damn near classic album though. The versatility Ghost showed on that album was ridiculous. Damn near every song is concept driven. The album would have been certified classic with the full Barbershop track, the original The Champ and instead of Clyde Smith, Ghost shoulda just came out himself on a skit telling 50 to eat a d!ck. Woulda been perfect.

 

[MidnightMercenary]

I love the bad kid skit leading into Whip You with a Strap but that's the only one that I loved. The other skits were cool but nothing as creative as the ones on those early Wu albums. Even the Clyde Smith skit is only notable to me because of the shots at 50. Fishscale is still a classic album though. The versatility Ghost showed on that album was ridiculous. Damn near every song is concept driven.

Fixed