Does western independence and individualism make us unhappy?

[Prynce]

If you've ever noticed in other cultures that families stay together their entire lives. A child doesn't leave until they are married and even then they stay near to their own parents, who will eventually move in with them. I'm not saying it's the best way of living but I have noticed those countries and cultures tend to be more happier even if they are poor.

while in western countries we are indoctrinated to be materialistic go getters who's main focus is money and not social relationships. I mean at our very core we are social animals who need connection but in western society it is pushed to they way side. I haven't really decided where I sit with this personally but I would like to hear y'all's thought on this!

 

[Sex Luthor]

it's funny bc we in America scream "independence" and "freedom" but then worry about what everybody else has or what they're doing. this country was built on the false idea of freedom and it hasn't changed. They left England for freedom from the king only to come here and take away other people's freedoms and force their beliefs or be killed. we still do the same within our country and around the world. american freedom should have it's own definition bc the idea of freedom and actual freedom here are two different things

 

[AlainLocke]

No, it's a lack of economic opportunity and safety net that makes us unhappy.


Other cultures supplement the lack of opportunity with strong social cohesion.

 

[NotaPAWG]

i literally was JUST talking with my therapist about this the other day. the self esteem issues and insecurity that come with the struggle between family cultural norms and american cultural norms and finding a place in the world between balancing both.

in my family, it’s acceptable and encouraged to live with your family until whenever. my mom always says to me i can live with her forever , i won’t but that’s just how it is.

i know plenty of polish, russian and portuguese people who immigrated here really young and it’s the same. most live with their family until their late 20s, shyt.. i knew one ukrainian who was still living with his parents at 32 and he had like 7 siblings. his parents preferred it. in many cultures that’s acceptable and the norm is kids move out when they either go off to college, move back in with parents after college then move out when they get married and or make a family.

but many americans with no family or cultural identity outside of “american” will shame you. when i was 21 i had some 15 year old kid clown me over xbox for still living with my parents lol the whole “moving out when your 18” shyt is really not “normal” in majority of cultures outside of American. it’s an American thing.

 

[Hugo Floss]

 

[010101]

folks just lack natural sense*

 

[Prynce]

No, it's a lack of economic opportunity and safety net that makes us unhappy.


Other cultures supplement the lack of opportunity with strong social cohesion.

I mean I get what you saying and I agree to a degree. I feel like we place too much value on economy. Humans in our natural state don't have financial depression because we were meant to just live socially. But I guess you can't seperate social constructs from being human either tho and you can't place being social over survival either

 

[Turk]

Good thread topic

 

[Squidward24]

Nothing wrong with Living with your parents after you get married assuming you own the house and letting them live with you. By the time we're making good money in our 30s, most of our parents will be retired and can look after the kids and take them to school, look over the house, etc. I might its only right, our parents take care of for so long might as well repay them. My dad's a math teacher so when I eventually have kids, I want them to get all the math education they can at an early age.

 

[Cynic]

If you've ever noticed in other cultures that families stay together their entire lives. A child doesn't leave until they are married and even then they stay near to their own parents, who will eventually move in with them. I'm not saying it's the best way of living but I have noticed those countries and cultures tend to be more happier even if they are poor.

while in western countries we are indoctrinated to be materialistic go getters who's main focus is money and not social relationships. I mean at our very core we are social animals who need connection but in western society it is pushed to they way side. I haven't really decided where I sit with this personally but I would like to hear y'all's thought on this!

Depends on what you personally want out of life...

Happiness is relative

 

[Ghost Utmost]

Yeah niqqa

 

[Prynce]

Depends on what you personally want out of life...

Happiness is relative

I agree, but what if what you think makes you happy doesn't really make you happy?

I mean in America we think being rich or successful will make us happy but what if achieve it to only find that same emptiness?

I'm not disagreeing but just asking what if our indoctrination is the problem?

 

[Flywin Lannister]

i literally was JUST talking with my therapist about this the other day. the self esteem issues and insecurity that come with the struggle between family cultural norms and american cultural norms and finding a place in the world between balancing both.

in my family, it’s acceptable and encouraged to live with your family until whenever. my mom always says to me i can live with her forever , i won’t but that’s just how it is.

i know plenty of polish, russian and portuguese people who immigrated here really young and it’s the same. most live with their family until their late 20s, shyt.. i knew one ukrainian who was still living with his parents at 32 and he had like 7 siblings. his parents preferred it. in many cultures that’s acceptable and the norm is kids move out when they either go off to college, move back in with parents after college then move out when they get married and or make a family.

but many americans with no family or cultural identity outside of “american” will shame you. when i was 21 i had some 15 year old kid clown me over xbox for still living with my parents lol the whole “moving out when your 18” shyt is really not “normal” in majority of cultures outside of American. it’s an American thing.

Actually it is not a typically American thing

In most of West-Europe children move out at 18 because this is when they go to College/University after High school to live with flat mates or alone near the school, especially if it’s in another city. Governments also provide more subsidies to them for no longer living at home.

Unlike with your friends’ cultures: once they’ve left for College, the idea is not to return home after graduating - the idea is to find work and find an apartment to live in alone

For clarity: we are talking mainly about white people who are natively from there, people who migrate there for the 2nd and 3rd generation it’s a mix of Western and local cultures

I know through experience about how children can totally stay at home until after 30 in the South of Europe indeed

What’s your cultural background then?

 

[NotaPAWG]

Actually it is not a typically American thing

In most of West-Europe children move out at 18 because this is when they go to College/University after High school to live with flat mates or alone near the school, especially if it’s in another city. Governments also provide more subsidies to them for no longer living at home.

Unlike with your friends’ cultures: once they’ve left for College, the idea is not to return home after graduating - the idea is to find work and find an apartment to live in alone

For clarity: we are talking mainly about white people who are natively from there, people who migrate there for the 2nd and 3rd generation it’s a mix of Western and local cultures

I know through experience about how children can totally stay at home until after 30 in the South of Europe indeed

What’s your cultural background then?

that’s EUROPEAN culture due to their safety nets, they can afford to do those things and not struggle in the least. and i think that’s mainly in the UK, anyways. in the US most don’t have those safety nets let alone a gov that gives a shyt about them. and regardless, that's not the inner family culture. many immigrants from european countries, even non europeans.. at least on the east coast don’t even go to college.

many arabs and non whites in other countries work together as a family, not as an individual.

 

[Flywin Lannister]

I agree, but what if what you think makes you happy doesn't really make you happy?

I mean in America we think being rich or successful will make us happy but what if achieve it to only find that same emptiness?

I'm not disagreeing but just asking what if our indoctrination is the problem?

You bring up a great point

The issue is that happiness is not something that is not as simple a subject, because a person’s life is built on more pillars than finance/career.

You could have 1 million but no relationship with your family, no friends and can only date and meet people who want your money and you’d be miserable.

Because people like simple explanations and shortcuts the story has become: get rich, be happy.

Physical health, emotional health, relationships and friendships, family, fulfillment from what you do with your life and many more things (incl travel, discovery, play, hobbies, art/music) decide your level or happiness.

Money plays such a huge role and it’s the world’s obsession - but unfortunately all the other important puzzle pieces are barely mentioned