Eastern philosophy is some crazy shi brehs

Scustin Bieburr

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The most famous of all Zhuangzi stories—"Zhuang Zhou Dreams of Being a Butterfly"—appears at the end of the second chapter, "On the Equality of Things".

昔者莊周夢為胡蝶,栩栩然胡蝶也,自喻適志與。不知周也。
Once, Zhuang Zhou dreamed he was a butterfly, a butterfly flitting and fluttering about, happy with himself and doing as he pleased. He didn't know that he was Zhuang Zhou.

俄然覺,則蘧蘧然周也。不知周之夢為胡蝶與,胡蝶之夢為周與。周與胡蝶,則必有分矣。此之謂物化。
Suddenly he woke up and there he was, solid and unmistakable Zhuang Zhou. But he didn't know if he was Zhuang Zhou who had dreamt he was a butterfly, or a butterfly dreaming that he was Zhuang Zhou. Between Zhuang Zhou and the butterfly there must be some distinction! This is called the Transformation of Things.
— Zhuangzi, chapter 2 (Watson translation)[18]
The image of Zhuangzi wondering if he was a man who dreamed of being a butterfly or a butterfly dreaming of being a man became so well-known that whole dramas have been written on its theme.[19] In the passage, Zhuangzi "[plays] with the theme of transformation",[19] illustrating that "the distinction between waking and dreaming is another false dichotomy. If [one] distinguishes them, how can [one] tell if [one] is now dreaming or awake?"

:ohhh: :mindblown:


another one:
莊子妻死,惠子弔之,莊子則方箕踞鼓盆而歌。惠子曰:與人居長子,老身死,不哭亦足矣,又鼓盆而歌,不亦甚乎。
Zhuangzi's wife died. When Huizi went to convey his condolences, he found Zhuangzi sitting with his legs sprawled out, pounding on a tub and singing. "You lived with her, she brought up your children and grew old," said Huizi. "It should be enough simply not to weep at her death. But pounding on a tub and singing—this is going too far, isn't it?"

莊子曰:不然。是其始死也,我獨何能無概然。察其始而本無生,非徒無生也,而本無形,非徒無形也,而本無氣。雜乎芒芴之間,變而有氣,氣變而有形,形變而有生,今又變而之死,是相與為春秋冬夏四時行也。
Zhuangzi said, "You're wrong. When she first died, do you think I didn't grieve like anyone else? But I looked back to her beginning and the time before she was born. Not only the time before she was born, but the time before she had a body. Not only the time before she had a body, but the time before she had a spirit. In the midst of the jumble of wonder and mystery a change took place and she had a spirit. Another change and she had a body. Another change and she was born. Now there's been another change and she's dead. It's just like the progression of the four seasons, spring, summer, fall, winter."

人且偃然寢於巨室,而我噭噭然隨而哭之,自以為不通乎命,故止也。
"Now she's going to lie down peacefully in a vast room. If I were to follow after her bawling and sobbing, it would show that I don't understand anything about fate. So I stopped."
Zhuangzi seems to have viewed death as a natural process or transformation, where one gives up one form of existence and assumes another.[27] In the second chapter, he makes the point that, for all humans know, death may in fact be better than life: "How do I know that loving life is not a delusion? How do I know that in hating death I am not like a man who, having left home in his youth, has forgotten the way back?"

:wow:

Finna go ahead and buy this book.
 

Tair

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"the distinction between waking and dreaming is another false dichotomy. If [one] distinguishes them, how can [one] tell if [one] is now dreaming or awake?"

:ohhh: :mindblown:


Zhuangzi said, "You're wrong. When she first died, do you think I didn't grieve like anyone else? But I looked back to her beginning and the time before she was born. Not only the time before she was born, but the time before she had a body. Not only the time before she had a body, but the time before she had a spirit. In the midst of the jumble of wonder and mystery a change took place and she had a spirit. Another change and she had a body. Another change and she was born. Now there's been another change and she's dead. It's just like the progression of the four seasons, spring, summer, fall, winter."

In the second chapter, he makes the point that, for all humans know, death may in fact be better than life: "How do I know that loving life is not a delusion? How do I know that in hating death I am not like a man who, having left home in his youth, has forgotten the way back?"

:wow:

Finna go ahead and buy this book.



:wow:

@MMS

Illusion of reality = false perception = unaware.

What is "Divine wisdom"?

:jbhmm:
 

Complexion

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row row row your boat (of flesh) gently down the stream (of consciousness). merrily merrily, merrily merrily. Life is but a dream (within a dream)

:wow:

They tell you exactly what it is when you step in the Game before they extinguish the flame of curiosity which would lead you to draw the links between the bits which prove we're living in a simulation. No hypothesis.

Heads have known this since Plato was preaching but people keep believing the deceit their lying eyes make them think they see.
 

MMS

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:wow:

@MMS

Illusion of reality = false perception = unaware.

What is "Divine wisdom"?

:jbhmm:
what is reality if you believe in illusion?

better yet, what is the purpose of disbelief?

people describe "non-existence" without understanding that non-existence cant be described because it doesnt exist.

there is no such thing as "true or false perception"

there is just perception. Whether you perceive what I perceive or not has no bearing on either of us. The only thing you can be sure of is I can read your posts.

gargamel-the-smurfs.gif


EDIT - to give some of my off-brand Taoism in here

People seek oneness, they say even they are part of one, but the separations we perceive tell us that there is more than one. Yet if one encompasses all, what we seek is neither in front of us nor behind us.

 
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