Ex-Muslim atheist on Islamic extremism and "new atheism"

[Dr. Sebi Jr.]

I wouldn't say "The Jews" for starters. That'd be generalizing and dangerous. There are Jews who either don't even know about this or who want no part of it.

Yes the ORIGINAL HEBREWS who are BLACK. But I am talking ABOUT the WHITE so-called JEW who founded the NAZI party. And tell a BROTHER about the 93rd degree FREEMASON named Barrack OBAMA.

 

[HummerCrusher]

Atheists with inflammatory perspectives are nothing new. They're getting air time because the country and many parts of the world are rapidly becoming less religious and there's a market for their ideas. They wouldn't have gained any traction 20 years

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By parts of the world, you mean focally Europe and America. And in Europe and America, the majority of major TV and newspaper outlets who put these false Atheists on are controlled by people with ties to Israel. Again, they don't go hard on the religious aspects of Israel and Orthodox Judaism.

lol...gee, maybe that's because there's only 13 million Jews in the world compared to 1.8 billion Muslims and 2.1 billion Christians and we're far more exposed to nutjob Christian politicians and Islamic sectarian and political extremism. The tiny state of Israel is where you see most Jewish extremism in action

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You're having trouble understanding what I've already said. Size is of little importance compared to influence. Those nutjob "Christians" you see pushing for wars and being fundamentalist on TV? - majority Zionist. The stations pushing them - majority Zionist. If you seriously believe that the fervent atheists, who also make it onto these networks, just so happen to omit the influence Orthodox Judaism and spiritual and political Zionism have on the violence in the Middle East, then you're not very well read or objective. If they did, their careers would probably wither. That's not speculation, but how it is in most cases. They would be labelled anti-semites and dumped in the bushes.

Now is that wrong? I don't really care. But don't call them unbiased and brave.

Sounds like you're imposing your own conspiratorial biases on their work. I read Dawkins stuff and to a lesser degree some of the others and they're pro-atheism and against religiosity across the board.

There is no conspiracy. Dawkins will never call out Orthodox Judaism and its link, through political Zionism, to foreign policies/wars. He is false. If he was real, more of the more hardcore atheists, as they call themselves, would do this. And even if he did, I'd still be right, because the majority of the ones who make it onto TV will not go there.

Don't get me wrong, there are real atheists who go in. But a lot of them won't get the airplay.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

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By parts of the world, you mean focally Europe and America. And in Europe and America, all major TV and newspaper outlets who put these false Atheists on are controlled by people with ties to Israel. Again, they don't go hard on the religious aspects of Israel and Orthodox Judaism.

This is a stupid statement because the "new atheists" don't even get much air time on TV and newspapers i.e. the Jew-controlled media.

There following is on the internet and through books. Like I said, they've gained popularity because there's a market for their ideas today, not because of media manipulation.

You're having trouble understanding what I've already said. Size is of little importance compared to influence. Those nutjob "Christians" you see pushing for wars and being fundamentalist on TV? - majority Zionist. The stations pushing them - majority Zionist. If you believe that the fervant atheists who also make it onto these networks who just so happen to omit the influence Orthodox Judaism and spiritual and political Zionism have on the violence in the Middle East, then you're not very well read or objective.


There is no conspiracy. Dawkins will never call out Orthodox Judaism and its link, through political Zionism, to foreign policies/wars. He is false. If he was real, more of the more hardcore atheists, as they call themselves, would do this.

Calm down bruh. I think you're overemphasizing religiosity here and downplaying nationalism, which is what's really at place usually when it comes to hardline support of Israel in the west. Everyone knows Zionists are in some of the highest positions of governance and finance and they ride hard for their people in Israel. However, most of them are not even religious in their thinking and are fueled by nationalism and tribalism. So there's not much there for atheists to pick apart because they're making a case against religiosity, not nationalism and tribalism.

The new atheist folks are anti-religion, but people with different axes to grind see what they want to see. Christians say they attack Christianity too much. Others say they attack Islam too much. People who strongly opposed to Israel say they don't go at Judaism enough. Unless there's some kind of even 33.3% split of disses to the 3 abrahamic religions, people are going to see it through their own prism.

 

[HummerCrusher]

This is a stupid statement because the "new atheists" don't even get much air time on TV and newspapers i.e. the Jew-controlled media.

There following is on the internet and through books. Like I said, they've gained popularity because there's a market for their ideas today, not because of media manipulation

I didn't mention "Jew-controlled media" for one. Secondly, I didn't mention "media manipulation", so you're arguing against synthetic points I didn't make. I said TV and the media is controlled, which includes, as you've just demonstrated, books and the internet.

Calm down bruh

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That old joke to make it look like I'm getting mad. I should be getting mad -- it's a serious subject about death, war, and injustice -- what's not to be mad about? But unfortunately I don't care enough.

I think you're overemphasizing religiosity here and downplaying nationalism

How, in a topic about atheism and religion? That's like saying people are overemphasizing pigs in a topic about pork.

nationalism which is what's really at place usually when it comes to hardline support of Israel in the west. Everyone knows Jews are in some of the highest positions of governance and finance and they ride hard for their people in Israel. However, most of them are not even religious in their thinking and are fueled by nationalism and tribalism. So there's not much there for atheists to pick apart because they're making a case against religiosity, not nationalism and tribalism.

The creation of maintenance of Israel's existence is purely one born out of Zionism, which is a religio-political movement. It doesn't matter if one thinks atheist Jewish bankers are not religious or that some elite rich Jews who have media outlets under control aren't going to the synagogue. The fundamentals of Zionism has its roots in the "The 'Jews' returning to Israel". Before WWI and II even started, Jews in the poor ghettos of Europe dreamt, worked toward, and were motivated by this prophecy: to return to the land of their fathers and have moschiac (the Messiah) rule the kingdom.

Now I don't know if they still want that, but that's where it's from. That's what it was all about. When masonry was at its peak, they wanted to rebuild the Temple of Solomon. They studied the Kabbalah, etc. The Balfour Declaration, which you still haven't discussed, was years before WWII and was all about securing Palestine in lead up to forcing European Jews to go there.

All that effort, money, bloodshed, wars, death wasn't just because they like sand and hot weather. Is it a conspiracy? Not really; it is what it is. But it's a fact that it is and was religious.

Ask me how and I'll tell you how. Or just look up everything I've said at a good library.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

I didn't mention "Jew-controlled media" for one. Secondly, I didn't mention "media manipulation", so you're arguing against synthetic points I didn't make. I said TV and the media, which includes, as you've just demonstrated, books and the internet.

Jews control the internet and books?

Like I said, people like Dawkins, Hitchens, and Harris developed a following because religiosity is rapidly declining in the world and their ideas are resonating with many. This notion that they've gained famed because somehow they're being propped up by Jew is the media is stupid. Your other points are worthy of critique and discussion even if I disagree, but this portion of your argument in particular is straight bullshyt.

How, in a topic about atheism and religion? That's like saying people are overemphasizing pigs in a topic about pork.

Uh, no. I said I think you're overemphasizing the role of religiosity with respect to international support of Israel by power-seated Jews in lieu of nationalistic and cultural kinship among the people of the Jewish diaspora.

The creation of maintenance of Israel's existence is purely one born out of Zionism, which is a religio-political movement. It doesn't matter if one thinks atheist Jewish bankers are not religious or that some elite rich Jews who have media outlets under control aren't going to the synagogue. The fundamentals of Zionism has its roots in the "The 'Jews' returning to Israel". Before WWI and II even started, Jews in the poor ghettos of Europe dreamt, worked toward, and were motivated by this prophecy: to return to the land of their fathers and have moschiac (the Messiah) rule the kingdom.

Now I don't know if they still want that, but that's where it's from. That's what it was all about. When masonry was at its peak, they wanted to rebuild the Temple of Solomon. They studied the Kabbalah, etc. The Balfour Declaration, which you still haven't discussed, was years before WWII and was all about securing Palestine in lead up to forcing European Jews to go there.

All that effort, money, bloodshed, wars, death wasn't just because they like sand and hot weather. Is it a conspiracy? Not really; it is what it is. But it's a fact that it is and was religious.

We know why the state of Israel was founded. Like I said, the continuing support of Israel by the U.S. is for mostly geopolitical and nationalistic reasons. You can be against the Israel occupation, their incursions into Lebanon, their disregard of U.N treaties and their financial and political support by the U. S. all you want.

You claimed that the "new atheists" have some biased agenda of just hating on Christians and Muslims while being silent about Jews and I'm explaining why. Jews make up a tiny fraction of the world's population, 13.4 million compared to 2.8 Christians and 1.8 Muslims, and the dirt done by Jews in the west which mostly takes the form of lobbying support for Israel is mostly based around nationalistic and cultural ties among Jews.

Since the "new atheists" agenda is mostly about championing reason empiricism and as opposed to religious and magical thinking, there's a lot more meat to attack in the form of Christians and Muslims taking actions they specifically state are fueled by their adherence to the Quran and the Bible.

Ask me how and I'll tell you how. Or just look up everything I've said at a good library.

You haven't mentioned one thing about Israel and Jews that people don't already know. Chill with the undeserved sense of pomposity.

 

[88m3]

these make them easier to spot



you guys really hate jews...

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

these make them easier to spot



you guys really hate jews...

Yeah, the thread got derailed. Dude who wrote the article is from Pakistan and raised in Libya and Saudi Arabia, and he sympathizes with the "new atheist" movement, btw. I guess he's a Zionist tool.

 

[HummerCrusher]

Jews control the internet and books?

Nope. I didn't say "Jew's control" anything, especially anything as far-fetched as that. I said the major TV, paper, and radio networks are run by those with ties to Israel and Zionism. The reach also bleds into the publishing industry, and certain internet sites.

If you want to believe there's no Zionist influence in publishing or on the internet, more power to you.

Like I said, people like Dawkins, Hitchens, and Harris developed a following because religiosity is rapidly declining in the world and their ideas are resonating with many. This notion that they've gained famed because somehow they're being propped up by Jew is the media is stupid

Another argument I didn't even make. Let me make it clearer. What I said: "the well-known hardcore atheists who make it onto TV, happen to omit Judaic influence" what you're saying "Stop saying internet-boosted atheists are being propped up by the Jew".

You gotta see how far-off target that is, surely. What you're doing is taking arguments you've had with anti-semitic people and trying to project them onto me. It's not productive. Argue against what I actually say.

Your other points are worthy of critique and discussion even if I disagree, but this portion of your argument in particular is straight bullshyt

The weird arguments you say I'm making are bullshyt, yes. Problem is, I didn't make them, you did.

Uh, no. I said I think you're overemphasizing the role of religiosity with respect to international support of Israel by power-seated Jews in lieu of nationalistic and cultural kinship among the people of the Jewish diaspora

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Again, I didn't say international support. I said America and Britain, with Europe. And in 1914, that's all that matters. No-one cared enough about the Middle East to stop them.

There's almost always a divide between the public and those governing them. We're not talking about the public - they have little political gravitas - we're talking about the governing bodies above these populations. In the case of Europe, political Zionism, from at least the 18th century has called most of the shots; whether it be by the power money, idealism, or both.

And it doesn't matter if you delve into masonry or money, the push to create a land for professed Jews to return to was being formulated before any such international (ie: European and American) support was even a talking point in the public arena, which was about 1917 and before that.

We know why the state of Israel was founded

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Go on.

Like I said, the continuing support of Israel by the U.S. is for mostly geopolitical and nationalistic reasons. You can be against the Israel occupation, their incursions into Lebanon, their disregard of U.N treaties and their financial and political support by the U. S. all you want

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I've no opinion in this thread on Lebanon or UN treaties or any of that. The nationalistic reasons Israel often alludes to are religio-political. It's like White Nationalism, except if Whites believed they were chosen by their god. Many Israelis believe this, especially Orthodox rabbis (who have heavy influence in Israel, also). But yeah, if you don't want to believe that's a politico-religious stance, sure.

The US supports Israel for the same reasons the UK does. And both do it at the expense of their own economies with a number of non-repayable loans. It's no coincidence that these two countries, in particular, had the largest number of masons and were the strongest of all the supposed Judeo-Christian nations.

There are millions of injustices going on all over the world. Yet, the one place these two mega, formerly masonic and Christian empires chose to start wars around and support is the one country they not only helped create, but with which both have shared hundreds of years having idealistic and spirtualistic ties to.

There's no coincidence. The further one goes back into history. Rosicrucianism, The Enlightenment, Freemasonry, The Crusades, it all goes back to religious ideals.

You claimed that the "new atheists" have some biased agenda of just hating on Christians and Muslims while being silent about Jews and I'm explaining why

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It looks like I'm going to have to reiterate. Not "Jews", but Judaism's religious ties to Zionism - both American and European, and therefore Israel's existence. Not Jews, not Jewish people, not Judaens. It's not that hard to follow.

Jews make up a tiny fraction of the world's population, 13.4 million compared to 2.8 Christians and 1.8 Muslims

I've already debunked this. The billions of people on Earth are ruled by a few million at most. Number of people =/= influence and power.

and the dirt done by Jews in the west which mostly takes the form of lobbying support for Israel is mostly based around nationalistic and cultural ties among Jews

Now you mention cultural. Good. Now expand on that without mentioning any single religious aspect, accurately and objectively, and I'll concede. It's impossible. The culture is Zionism/Judeo-Christianity. (not Christianity, by the way. That's different).

Moreover, I'm still not talking about Jews, specifically. There are Black, White, Hispanic Zionists, as well. And there are some of these ethnicities who believe "The Jews" belong in Palestine because God said it was their land. Millions of people.

And as I keep saying, there are atheists who ignore the Judaic aspect to the wars, which leads to Israel, which leads to Middle Eastern conflict, which is the biggest battle waging on Earth right now. Pretty big to ignore it.

Since the "new atheists" agenda is mostly about championing reason empiricism and as opposed to religious and magical thinking

No, no, no. Hardcore Atheists, whom we should still be talking about, almost always harp on about the weakness of magical thinking as well, in almost equal measure.

there's a lot more meat to attack in the form of Christians and Muslims taking actions they specifically state are fueled by their adherence to the Quran and the Bible

I agree and disagree. Firstly, because there only appears to be more meat, because those two religions, again, appear to be more a prevalent issue. They are 1: the religions most people of the populace claim to adhere to. And 2: always talked about and exposed on TV, "big internet", radio, magazines, newspapers, and so forth. It's like pop and underground music. Whatever that tube (major media) puts on repeatedly, it's gonna seem bigger than it really is, until it really does become bigger than it was.

I'm not saying that they shouldn't talk about them, but if you don't go directly behind to the core influence of the government's pushing for war and support of a nation whose enemies in turn cause even more problems, it's biased. And it's even more biased if they speak of the radical bloodlust of Islam and Christianity, without mentioning the rampant warmongering in the very same religion pushing for war with Islam, which is Orthodox and Ultra Orthodox Judaism, along with the remaining scraps of masonry.

If the radical tenets of radical Judaism (not to be confused with peaceful, regular Judaism) were brought forward and fully exposed, the game would probably change. But it ain't gonna happen.

You haven't mentioned one thing about Israel and Jews that people don't already know. Chill with the undeserved sense of pomposity.

Insults are cheap. You allege to speak for all people and claim to be an authority on what they do or do not know. That's a definition of pomposity. I claim no such authority. People can read and decide on their own terms.

 

[HummerCrusher]

you guys really hate jews...

There's no Jew-hating going on here. Jews are cool. If I was talking about the Italian Mafia, it wouldn't mean I hated Italians.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

But you have to admit most atheists are not bold enough to criticize Islam the way they do with Christianity or Judaism.

 

[Type Username Here]

There's no Jew-hating going on here. Jews are cool. If I was talking about the Italian Mafia, it wouldn't mean I hated Italians.

Nah brah, you're right. They get a pass on a lot of shyt from mainstream religious critics and posters on here.

You basically have a theocratic state pushing apartheid on a people, while using unprecedented lobbying power in the US government. You have Orthodox Jewish towns in the UNITED STATES pushing "Sharia"-like unconstitutional laws in their towns. Israel has been letting their Orthodox communities abuse secular women for dressing certain ways.

This gets no play.

 

[Robbie3000]

The circumstances regarding Israel's creation are BS, but that said, I don't think most people think of Judaism as very influential since the proportion of people who identify as Jewish is much smaller than those who identify as Christian or Muslim. Your average atheist on the street is going to encounter Christians/Muslims much, much more often than Jews and will thus have more to say about those religions.

You seem to be thinking of it as some sort of Zionist conspiracy when it has more to do with the fact that most people don't think or care about Judaism that much. Most people in America, atheist or not, don't think of Judaism as the most powerful religion in the world. We can debate about how much influence Jews actually have but that's a different issue. My point is that every religion seems to think atheists only target them and not the other guys.

People don't criticize Judaism as much if at all because it doesn't proselytize. Unlike Christianity which sends missionaries all over the world to convert people or Islam which kills people for apostasy.

 

[Blackking]

Where do you all live? I live around many Muslims.. but I really don't 'encounter them'. They don't really affect my life, and I'm freaking Muslim.. I actively chose to be around Muslims from time to time. Outside of those times, I rarely see or am affected by Islam.

Before I became a Muslim, I was not like you all.. shyts crazy. What am I missing???


From reading the post, (and a number of Islamic threads) I would guess that Muslims are running wild in the streets smacking lames and screaming Allahu Akbar on the streets of America, in mass.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

Where do you all live? I live around many Muslims.. but I really don't 'encounter them'. They don't really affect my life, and I'm freaking Muslim.. I actively chose to be around Muslims from time to time. Outside of those times, I rarely see or am affected by Islam.

Before I became a Muslim, I was not like you all.. shyts crazy. What am I missing???


From reading the post, (and a number of Islamic threads) I would guess that Muslims are running wild in the streets smacking lames and screaming Allahu Akbar on the streets of America, in mass.

So...what did you think about the article?

 

[Blackking]

So...what did you think about the article?

There are times when religion causes horrible things...

But I don't agree with this statement, it's immature and shows a lack of understanding of the term..' justification'.

"extremism in any ideology isn't a distortion of that ideology. It is an informed, steadfast adherence to its fundamentals, hence the term "fundamentalism."

I'm not going to look at the craker who blows up an abortion clinic and say that Pro-life ideology is horrible and wrong. I can recognize that that individual was either crazy or misguided.