Explain the logic behind placing LEBRON above SHAQ

[FTBS]

he had a cedric ceballos and nick van exel team competitive [how they do after he left?]
he drug dennis scott and nick anderson to the nba finals [how they do after he left?]
he led the lakers to 4 straight finals winning three [how the lakers do after shaq left?]

He didn't leave Ceballos and Van Exel, they left LA. The year before he got there they won 50 games and lost in the 1st round. They year after he arrived they won 50 games and lost in the 2nd round.

The Magic still made the playoffs the year after he left and pushed the 2 seed Heat to 5. Penny got hurt and it fell apart.

The Lakers did have a dip after Shaq left but they ended up winning 2 more titles thanks in part to pieces that were directly and indirectly traded for him.

 

[Newzz]

Lebron has been stopped before.

Kawhi shut his ass all the way down.

Boris Diaw shut his ass all the way down.

Point me in the direction of a person who could guard prime shaq.

nikka used to back centers down like babies in the post.

Shaq has been swept before....on more occasions than LeBron has at that



And Centers who could guard him? My nikka Hakeem ate GOOD against Shaq and sent that nikka packing while sweeping his ass out of the NBA Finals easy



Hakeem "The GOAT" Olajuwon

 

[J Money]

I hate to go all Steve Nash on you here, but IMO LeBron makes his teammates slightly better than Shaq did.

It's close, but I'm giving LeBron the edge. What series has Shaq taken over and advanced without a top 5 Wing? The best player LeBron is playing with right now is an always inconsistent J.R. Smith.

Granted it's Atlanta, but whatever.

LeBron also did this to you Ed:

Bron has gifted us with so many memorable playoff performances

 

[FS4LFE]

Lebron has been stopped before.

Kawhi shut his ass all the way down.

Boris Diaw shut his ass all the way down.

Point me in the direction of a person who could guard prime shaq.

nikka used to back centers down like babies in the post.

 

[Newzz]

Didn't Shaq get swept 5 or 6 times?

nikka got swept by the 94 Pacers, 95 Rockets, 96 Bulls, 98 Jazz, and 99 Spurs all while in his prime.....but yet he "couldnt be stopped"


LeBron has been swept only 1 time in his career....by the 2007 Spurs. Shaq was swept out of the playoffs in every year except 1 from the 1994-1999 season

 

[Torrential]

Shaq has been swept before....on more occasions than LeBron has at that



And Centers who could guard him? My nikka Hakeem ate GOOD against Shaq and sent that nikka packing while sweeping his ass out of the NBA Finals easy



Hakeem "The GOAT" Olajuwon

I said prime shaq breh

Crazy how nikkas forget how Shaq used to abuse grown men in the paint (pause)

 

[Ed MOTHEREFFING G]

I'm going to make this even as possible...which isn't because shaq has 4 more years of miles on his legs if I do apples to apples comparison

shaq 92-93 -> 05-06
Lebron 03-04 -> 14-15

..........Games Titles PPG RPG best ppg season best RPG season ROY
SHAQ - 941 4 26.3 11.8 29.7 13.9 yes
LEBRON - 911 2 27.3 7.1 31.4 8 yes

Playoffs

.............Games Finals appearance PPG RPG best ppg season best RPG season Finals MVP
SHAQ - 194 6 25.6 12.2 30.7 15.4 3
LEBRON - 171 5 28 7.1 35.3 10.5 2

Note that the miami run makes shaqs averages dip, but realistically, he gets more accolades as a result. Both also have 2 gold medals with lebron also getting a bronze.

 

[Ed MOTHEREFFING G]

those numbers are shockingly similar considering the different positions.

 

[GetSomeMoney]

bro. its toss up.. on one side you have the most dominating force at the center position..

on the other you have the most dominating force at the forward position..

but imagine prime shaq and prime lebron..

lebron would be a 20-20 player and shaq a 40-20 for a good stretch..

cant guard neither on single coverage...

my lord.

People thought Penny and Shaq was amazing, that Lebron and Shaq combo would be ridiculous

 

[Newzz]

I said prime shaq breh

Crazy how nikkas forget how Shaq used to abuse grown men in the paint (pause)

That's Chris Dudley though breh....I've NEVER been fond of Shaq "abusing" Centers who wouldnt even be Top 5 today


Outside of Dikembe Mutombo in 2001, who was he abusing? Keith Closs? Michael Olowakandi? Todd McCulloch? Rashoooooooo Nestorevic?


Where where the good legit Centers he played against from 97-2006 to say he was abusing them?


Centers are better TODAY than they were during Shaq's prime (97-2006) if you're saying he wasnt prime when Olajuwon sent him packing

 

[Ed MOTHEREFFING G]

Sure it's debatable. LeBron is 30 years old, this is going to be his 6th Finals and he's already won 2.
When Shaq was 30, he finished off a 3peat, so he's ahead right now. If the Cavs win the title Bron pulls even at 3 rings.

Shaq would have reached more Finals if it wasn't for Michael Jordan when he was in Orlando and Tim Duncan when he was in L.A. LeBron has not had to face anyone on that level playing in the East. And the one guy who might have rivaled that level, Wade, LeBron went and joined his team.

i did comporable amounts of games but age is probably more fair, and shaq would probably have the edge.

 

[Dirty D]

Didn't Shaq get swept 5 or 6 times?

3 times in Orlando: Pacers in '94, Rockets in '95, Bulls in '96
2 times in LA: Jazz in '98, Spurs in '99
1 time in Miami: Bulls in '07

6 total.

That Orlando team got swept in their first ever playoff appearance but that series was close for a sweep. They really should have won game 2 at least. The Rockets was their first Finals appearance the following year, and MJ was out for blood in '96 cuz they beat the Bulls in '95 on their way to the Finals. These sweeps were more the result of Nick Anderson and Dennis Scott disappearing when the team needed them most. Shaq did his thing in those series but they got killed on the perimeter.

In the L.A. sweeps, Kobe was still young and the teams they lost to ended up in the Finals (Jazz, WCF) and winning the title (Spurs, 2nd rd). These 2 are the darkest marks on Shaq's record cuz those teams were really talented, just played stupid when the pressure turned up and the more veteran teams exploited them. Duncan was a young buck but the rest of that Spurs team had been together for a while.

The last one in Miami was just an old veteran team that was fat and happy over the summer after a title and totally fell apart the next season.

In between the Laker and Miami sweeps was Prime Shaq.

In his career Shaq only missed the playoffs twice. His rookie year in Orlando (41-41) and 2009 in Phoenix (46-36). He was never on a team with a losing record. LeBron coming out of high school to a horrible Cleveland team can't say the same.

Orlando in 1991-92: 21-61
Orlando in 1992-93: 41-41

Cleveland in 2002-03: 17-65
Cleveland in 2003-04: 35-47

 

[Ed MOTHEREFFING G]

That's Chris Dudley though breh....I've NEVER been fond of Shaq "abusing" Centers who wouldnt even be Top 5 today


Outside of Dikembe Mutombo in 2001, who was he abusing? Keith Closs? Michael Olowakandi? Todd McCulloch? Restorevic?


Where where the good legit Centers he played against from 97-2006 to say he was abusing them?


Centers are better TODAY than they were during Shaq's prime (97-2006) if you're saying he wasnt prime when Olajuwon sent him packing

lol @ that selective window of years

during his career shaq had to face forwards / centers of

• david robinson
• hakeem
• ZO
  
• patrick ewing
• Garnett
  
• mutombo
• rodman
• barkley
• webber
  
• yao ming
• ben wallace
• and your fly-by-night centers like ostertag / dudley / wennington / etc ALL challenged EVERY attempted unlike these weak matador centers today

 

[Ed MOTHEREFFING G]

Shaq has been swept before....on more occasions than LeBron has at that



And Centers who could guard him? My nikka Hakeem ate GOOD against Shaq and sent that nikka packing while sweeping his ass out of the NBA Finals easy



Hakeem "The GOAT" Olajuwon

okay and lebron was the heat / celtics / pistons HOE until he bossed up just like shaq...pretty weak argument fam

 

[Newzz]

3 times in Orlando: Pacers in '94, Rockets in '95, Bulls in '96
2 times in LA: Jazz in '98, Spurs in '99
1 time in Miami: Bulls in '07

6 total.

That Orlando team got swept in their first ever playoff appearance but that series was close for a sweep. They really should have won game 2 at least. The Rockets was their first Finals appearance the following year, and MJ was out for blood in '96 cuz they beat the Bulls in '95 on their way to the Finals. These sweeps were more the result of Nick Anderson and Dennis Scott disappearing when the team needed them most. Shaq did his thing in those series but they got killed on the perimeter.

In the L.A. sweeps, Kobe was still young and the teams they lost to ended up in the Finals (Jazz, WCF) and winning the title (Spurs, 2nd rd). These 2 are the darkest marks on Shaq's record cuz those teams were really talented, just played stupid when the pressure turned up and the more veteran teams exploited them. Duncan was a young buck but the rest of that Spurs team had been together for a while.

The last one in Miami was just an old veteran team that was fat and happy over the summer after a title and totally fell apart the next season.

In between the Laker and Miami sweeps was Prime Shaq.

In his career Shaq only missed the playoffs twice. His rookie year in Orlando (41-41) and 2009 in Phoenix (46-36). He was never on a team with a losing record. LeBron coming out of high school to a horrible Cleveland team can't say the same.

Orlando in 1991-92: 21-61
Orlando in 1992-93: 41-41

Cleveland in 2002-03: 17-65
Cleveland in 2003-04: 35-47

98 Lakers? Shaq, Robert Horry, Rick Fox, Eddie Jones, Nick Van Exel, with Kobe Bryant and Elden Campbell coming off the bench. They went 61-21 in the regular season.....they shouldnt have been swept

99 Lakers? Shaq, J.R. Reid, Glen Rice, Kobe Bryant, Derek Fisher, with Robert Horry, Rick Fox, and Derek Harper coming off the bench. They shouldnt have been swept, especially with the main reason being that Tim Duncan DOMINATED them.



I could go on and on about all 6 sweeps. These excuses for Shaq being swept when every team he was on when he got swept had a better roster than the 2007 Cavs and every team he was swept BY was worse than the 2007 Spurs.