GameInformer: Microsoft to announce GPU Speed Upclock For Xbox1 (from 800mhz to 853MHz)

[MeachTheMonster]

@MeachTheMonster dapping your post.

you don't see me pretending to know any of that stuff. I have basic knowledge of the way computer hardware works and I speak on that. But I leave talk of tflops, coding to the metal, APIs, ect to you stans. And the "insiders" on gaf you got your opinion from

 

[Insensitive]

Just to clarify. "To the metal" means unimpeded access to all hardware with no layers in between managing what you can and can't do.

When you take RAM and reserve it for the OS, giving devs free reign over everying else is no longer "to the metal"

The term is quickly becoming a marketing gimmick. You're going to hear every idiot repeating it now.

For the record I know what "Coding to the metal" means, I was just correcting them on their assumption
that "Coding to the metal" was a new thing by pointing out that this has been done on consoles several times
including this current generation.

Though I imagine that it's a little more difficult with the new machines being introduced to the market.
I'm guessing that has to do with the complicated set ups they're running that allow multiple applications
and an OS to run alongside games.

Well the Xbox One is using a windows kernal for the apps and and xbox kernal for the games. Then a third kernal is used to assist both kernals like its a backup generator

So on xbox one, games will be made with the same "everything" they can access for PC games. Only the PS4 will have to port to its OS
Are PC games are coded to the metal?

No PC games aren't coded to the metal, the reason for this is because
there are so many different set ups out there.
Graphics API's like Direct X (D3D) and Open GL were created to
allow developers to write games for a variety of different GPU's.
On console it's a different, they don't have to worry about that, they write
for one machine and one machine only, and when doing so they can
optimize the experience and explore all the things that they normally
can't do using an API.

I know of the set up that they use for the Xbox One but I don't know any specifics,
the most I know is that it behaves similar to a virtual machine (basically a program
that simulates a computer within a computer).


AS for porting I think it'll be pretty easy across the board now that all
three platforms use x86 processors and both use GPU's that are pretty much'
off the shelf.

All those insults and none of those stone throwers come back when the truth is revealed. Throwing stones and hiding hands, is the order of the day.

That's because you have no idea what those developers are talking about.
You CAN do things on the console beyond what would be dictated by the
API for that specific generation.
Both the Ps3 AND 360 are currently doing things that a PC
from 2005/2006 wouldn't be able to do, due to the inherent
restrictions of Direct X. ( a lot of those GPU's if not all
of them are no longer supported by Direct X 10/11).
And yet here we are seeing things done on both machines
that are within the realm of Direct X 10 and 11.
Believe what you want to believe but there are certain
things you can ONLY DO if you write for that GPU specifically.
Not to mention your source is four years old, who knows though
I could be wrong and maybe microsoft has some sort of a
different implementation of Direct X that allows certain things
to be implemented on the 360 that wouldn't be possible otherwise.

Tessellation is a good example because it wasn't really taken advantage of
until it was written into Direct X DESPITE it being a feature in certain
lines of GPU's for several years.

There is no reading between the lines. "Coding to the metal" is using the hardware to its fullest capacity, without ANYTHING standing in the way. Not one console has EVER done this, so when you hear someone use the term it's almost ALWAYS inaccurate. Therefore if you hear the term it's almost ALWAYS that persons interpretation, not reality. This was pointed out to you by previous posters but you seem to not understand it because you'd rather believe individual articles that you've read since they support your agenda.

Nah pretty much all consoles have done this.
Developers were practically coding in assembly on the ps2
to get the best performance out of it.
The same thing happened with the N64, near the end of the N64's life.
it was putting out some impressive looking games.
The reason for this being that getting performance out of those
two with standard tools was practically a nightmare. So they had to
come up ways to extract everything out of those machines and that
usually meant writing their own tools to interface with the CPU and GPU.

That's why there's such a start contrast visually between titles
like Golden Eye vs Perfect Dark or Super Mario 64 vs Conkers Bad
Fur Day.

 

[PS5 Pro]

For the record I know what "Coding to the metal" means, I was just correcting them on their assumption
that "Coding to the metal" was a new thing by pointing out that this has been done on consoles several times
including this current generation.

Though I imagine that it's a little more difficult with the new machines being introduced to the market.
I'm guessing that has to do with the complicated set ups they're running that allow multiple applications
and an OS to run alongside games.

Well the Xbox One is using a windows kernal for the apps and and xbox kernal for the games. Then a third kernal is used to assist both kernals like its a backup generator

So on xbox one, games will be made with the same "everything" they can access for PC games. Only the PS4 will have to port to its OS
Are PC games are coded to the metal?

 

[backbreaker65]

I noticed.


@backbreaker65
No hard feelings breh.

I was reporting what was reported in articles about coding to the metal, not proclaiming to know the ends and outs of programming. It was stated that PS4 and MS has never let there machines to be coded to the metal and you came in and tried to correct

I noticed.


@backbreaker65
No hard feelings breh.

I appreciate you chiming in, but I was reporting what has been reported and you took it upon yourself to suggest otherwise. So you said the X360 could write to the metal or code to the metal. My "You Win" statement was done in jest because I wasn't about to get into a pissing contest. Maybe you know more about the X360 console more than the developers do.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-directx-360-performance-blog-entry



By Richard Leadbetter Published Monday, 20 July 2009

It's often been said that one of the many advantages of working on console is that you have a fixed set of hardware to work with, that you can "write to the metal" and code to the "bleeding edge" of the spec. However, our sources suggest that this simply isn't an option for Xbox 360 developers. Microsoft doesn't allow it.

Suspicions were first aroused by a tweet by EA Vancouver's Jim Hejl who revealed that addressing the Xenos GPU on 360 involves using the DirectX APIs, which in turn incurs a cost on CPU resources. Hejl later wrote in a further message that he'd written his own API for manual control of the GPU ring, incurring little or no hit to the main CPU.

"Cert would hate it tho," he added mysteriously.

According to other dev sources, what that actually means in real terms is that circumventing the use of the standard APIs would result in a submitted game not ever making it past Microsoft's strict certification guidelines which state that all GPU calls need to be routed through DirectX. Compare and contrast with PS3 development, where writing your own command buffers and addressing the RSX chip directly through its LibGCM interface is pretty much the standard way of talking to the hardware.

If all of this sounds pretty harsh on Microsoft, it's worth noting that there is a ton of excellent reasons for standing by this requirement. It means that the platform holder can update the system software and hardware specification and ensure that all games past, present and future will work on all iterations of the console.

 

[backbreaker65]

All those insults and none of those stone throwers come back when the truth is revealed. Throwing stones and hiding hands, is the order of the day.

 

[MeachTheMonster]

All those insults and none of those stone throwers come back when the truth is revealed. Throwing stones and hiding hands, is the order of the day.

The problem is, that you shouldn't be posting shyt as fact just cause you read it. "Coding to the metal" in the literal sense has never happened on consoles. But ALL consoles have allowed it much more than computers have. It's the same thing as we layman's call "optimization"

 

[backbreaker65]

The problem is, that you shouldn't be posting shyt as fact just cause you read it. "Coding to the metal" in the literal sense has never happened on consoles. But ALL consoles have allowed it much more than computers have. It's the same thing as we layman's call "optimization"

So now It's i reported all consoles didn't allow coding to the metal, the goal post is moving I see. I think I said it was announced in Feb PS4 would do it, and MS announced that they will also be doing it and followed that up with it was unprecedented speaking on these 2 consoles predecessors. You trying to read between the lines doesn't change what I said.

 

[MeachTheMonster]

So now It's i reported all consoles didn't allow coding to the metal, the goal post is moving I see. I think I said it was announced in Feb PS4 would do it, and MS announced that they will also be doing it and followed that up with it was unprecedented speaking on these 2 consoles predecessors. You trying to read between the lines doesn't change what I said.

There is no reading between the lines. "Coding to the metal" is using the hardware to its fullest capacity, without ANYTHING standing in the way. Not one console has EVER done this, so when you hear someone use the term it's almost ALWAYS inaccurate. Therefore if you hear the term it's almost ALWAYS that persons interpretation, not reality. This was pointed out to you by previous posters but you seem to not understand it because you'd rather believe individual articles that you've read since they support your agenda.