Gun homicides down dramatically, Americans unaware

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

Nice attempt at debunking the study but your statistics in the second graph only take account from 2007. The study is over the course of 20 years of data and the trends are massively downward. Your percentages cover 5 years of steady percantage of gun deaths but blatantly leaves out that 2000 less deaths occurred.

Also, a suicide is not a crime or homicide. Accidental shootings are not homicides. Therefore, the findings of the original stand don't they? It correlates actual data to public perception of homicides.

I think there's cred to both yours and @tmonster's stats

Overall crime in general has gone down in the past 20 yearsand sseveral theories that correlate to that cause come to mind

• Increase in technology thwarting or discourages crime (comparing now to twenty years ago).
• More technology related crimes probably being more appealing to criminals
• Media and social awareness on gun violence and crime

But tmonster's stats do point over the past few years in the second graph that while gun deaths have been decreasing since 2011, gun violence in general is still "relatively" high and compared to other developed countries we do account for the most gun-related deaths.

And there also has been a strange uptick in mass shootings over the past five years (2 per month on average)

 

[tmonster]

Nice attempt at debunking the study but your statistics in the second graph only take account from 2007. The study is over the course of 20 years of data and the trends are massively downward. Your percentages cover 5 years of steady percantage of gun deaths but blatantly leaves out that 2000 less deaths occurred.

Also, a suicide is not a crime or homicide. Accidental shootings are not homicides. Therefore, the findings of the original stand don't they? It correlates actual data to public perception of homicides.

look at the responses in the thread
they all claim that the public is overreacting to gun violence
I say they are not
gun deaths are on the rise since 2000, this is why in 2014 people are alarmed
the emotions match the statistics
the study has has cherry picked one aspect of the stats to get the exact reaction that it got in this thread
the truth is we should be exactly as alarmed as we are today, if not more so when one considers that the cdc chart project us towards returning to the 1990's firearm death toll.

The other point is what do you suggest the media do about mass shootings, not report it? report it with a caveat that homicides are trending downward? do you really think that will matter when mass shootings are happening randomly multiple times a year?

mass shootings will continue to frighten the average sane individual because they have kids out there in these streets.

 

[Type Username Here]

I think there's cred to both yours and @tmonster's stats

Overall crime in general has gone down in the past 20 yearsand sseveral theories that correlate to that cause come to mind

• Increase in technology thwarting or discourages crime (comparing now to twenty years ago).
• More technology related crimes probably being more appealing to criminals
• Media and social awareness on gun violence and crime

But tmonster's stats do point over the past few years in the second graph that while gun deaths have been decreasing since 2011, gun violence in general is still "relatively" high and compared to other developed countries we do account for the most gun-related deaths.

And there also has been a strange uptick in mass shootings over the past five years (2 per month on average)

All valid points that don't contradict the original study at all though my friend. Gun related deaths should be brought down as much as possible, but counting suicide and accidental shootings as homicides is disingenuous don't you think?

The case presented here is that there are major downward trends on crime and "negative" statistics but the public thinks the opposite is happening.

 

[Type Username Here]

look at the responses in the thread
they all claim that the public is overreacting to gun violence
I say they are not
gun deaths are on the rise since 2000, this is why in 2014 people are alarmed
the emotions match the statistics
the study has has cherry picked one aspect of the stats to get the exact reaction that it got in this thread
the truth is we should be exactly as alarmed as we are today, if not more so when one considers that the cdc chart project us towards returning to the 1990's firearm death toll.

The other point is what do you suggest the media do about mass shootings, not report it? report it with a caveat that homicides are trending downward? do you really think that will matter when mass shootings are happening randomly multiple times a year?

mass shootings will continue to frighten the average sane individual because they have kids out there in these streets.

How have they cherry picked the stats friend? You're (admittingly) making an emotional argument. No one said not to report mass shootings.

Crimes and gun homicides are sharply down over the course of 20 years. Those are facts. Even your second graph shows a 2000 less deaths in a 5 year span. The public thinks the opposite is happening. Nothing you have provided here is relevant to the findings or topic of the thread. Suicides are not a crime. Accidental shootings are not homicides.

 

[tmonster]

How have they cherry picked the stats friend? You're (admittingly) making an emotional argument.

yes yes I am friend
because people dying senselessly gets me right in the ole ticker and it is still a better argument than what the article is pushing

No one said not to report mass shootings.

Well...I mean I could rebut by saying that I never said that anyone said that? but that would just be a casual masturbation of strawman

Crimes and gun homicides are sharply down over the course of 20 years. Those are facts. Even your second graph shows a 2000 less deaths in a 5 year span. The public thinks the opposite is happening. Nothing you have provided here is relevant to the findings or topic of the thread. Suicides are not a crime. Accidental shootings are not homicides.

hilarious
can you show me where the article states this or where they provide evidence of this?:yasure:
don't tell me you fell for that slight of hand too?:youthink:

 

[Type Username Here]

yes yes I am friend
because people dying senselessly gets me right in the ole ticker and it is still a better argument than what the article is pushing



Well...I mean I could rebut by saying that I never said that anyone said that? but that would just be a casual masturbation of strawman



hilarious
can you show me where the article states this or where they provide evidence of this?:yasure:
don't tell me you fell for that slight of hand too?:youthink:

Sure:

Interestingly, the Pew study finds that 56 percent of respondents believe that deaths caused by guns are more frequent than they were 20 years ago, compared with just 12 percent who accurately said the rates had declined.

Pew study: Gun homicides in U.S. dropped nearly 50 percent over 20 years | The Lookout - Yahoo News

Since 1993, the United States has seen a drop in the rate of homicides and other violence involving guns, according to two new studies released Tuesday. Using government data, analysts saw a steep drop for violence in the 1990s, they saw more modest drops in crime rates since 2000.

"Firearm-related homicides dropped from 18,253 homicides in 1993 to 11,101 in 2011," according to a report by the federal Bureau of Justice Statistics, "and nonfatal firearm crimes dropped from 1.5 million victimizations in 1993 to 467,300 in 2011.

There were seven gun homicides per 100,000 people in 1993, the Pew Research Center study says, which dropped to 3.6 gun deaths in 2010. The study relied in part on data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

All of that is good news — but many Americans don't seem to be aware of it. In a survey, the Pew Research Center found that only 12 percent of Americans believe the gun crime rate is lower today than it was in 1993; 56 percent believe it's higher.

Rate Of U.S. Gun Violence Has Fallen Since 1993, Study Says : The Two-Way : NPR

 

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

All valid points that don't contradict the original study at all though my friend. Gun related deaths should be brought down as much as possible, but counting suicide and accidental shootings as homicides is disingenuous don't you think?

I didn't see in tmonster's study where it tied suicides and and accidentals shootings to homicide in the the data, I saw he said they probably left it out of the data.

The case presented here is that there are major downward trends on crime and "negative" statistics but the public thinks the opposite is happening.

And that seems to be the case, and there's several reasons that is the cause of that lack of understanding with the general public. That withstanding, I think it's reasonable how Americans think gun violence is still high or higher compared to 20 years ago seeing how the U.S. gun murder rate is about 20 times the average for all other developed countries.

 

[tmonster]

Sure:



Pew study: Gun homicides in U.S. dropped nearly 50 percent over 20 years | The Lookout - Yahoo News





Rate Of U.S. Gun Violence Has Fallen Since 1993, Study Says : The Two-Way : NPR

Thank you, I had not seen their link. I retract my insinuation that you fell for a "slight of hand"
this is the quote on the Pew site

According to a new Pew Research Center survey, today 56% of Americans believe gun crime is higher than 20 years ago and only 12% think it is lower.
Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware | Pew Research Center’s Social & Demographic Trends Project

as you can see the article you quoted conflates that with gun deaths

I am not impressed 1 out of 2 people think gun crimes (or for that matter gun deaths) are higher than 20 years ago, certainly not enough to claim some manipulation by the media. You article seems to be the propagandist in the way they frame the information.
That America is at the peak of a steady 15 year increase in gun related deaths while homicides are down, is even more damning to the narrative that guns make us safer or guns are less harmful today, considering that all the efforts to reduce crime have lead to a reduction in homicides while gun deaths continue to rise in a way that makes guns look dysfunctional, basically at this point it is clear that you don't need a criminal for a gun to cause death.

 

[tmonster]

I didn't see in tmonster's study where it tied suicides and and accidentals shootings to homicide in the the data, I saw he said they probably left it out of the data.s.

I did not elaborate my point and left myself open to "misunderstanding"
I really should have said that it is wholly disingenuous to make a point to tell the public that half half of them don't realize that firearms homicides are down, when the public grieves for their loved ones who die from any and all types of firearm deaths the latter of which are generally up and on the rise. It's all about what people care about.

 

[Serious]

 

[Crakface]

This was said on sohh 6 years ago

 

[unit321]

Hold up. That article came out in late May. We haven't even gone through the summer months yet. That is primo homicide time. Just wait until September before you make an article like this. 2014 should be on tap to reverse that downward slope. Detroit and Chicago should be leading the nation in homicides after August.