Is Kyrie's Success in Boston an Indictment on LeBron?

[DarrynCobretti]

Boston's offense is humming in the sense that they're keeping the ball moving and Kyrie hasn't been selfish dropping into isolation, something he had struggled with his whole career.

As far as defense though, it's the same damn argument. Kyrie proved that he could play defense in the 2016 Finals, it's just that he rarely ever did. That's somehow an indictment on Papa Lebron, who apparently is always responsible for Kyrie's effort level on both ends, and not on Kyrie or the coaching?

Not to mention that while Kyrie playing well on D, it ain't like his defensive play is driving Boston's success. Smart is still the top defender on the perimeter and Kyrie's only faced one elite point guard so far this season.

You my dude, but that's incorrect. Kyrie leads the entire league in steals(2.4 per game) and has the 9th BEST defensive rating (93.8) in the entire NBA right now.

His defensive play is every bit driving Boston's success so far. Is it sustainable who knows? But as of now, he's playing defense at an ELITE level.

So for the first time in his career he's actually looking like a 2-way player who's impact on the game isn't just offensive.

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

And @The Dankster stop acting all innocent like you haven't said a bunch of dumb shyt about Kyrie's play in the past. Like I said, I expect that 1000-word handwritten apology by the end of the week.

 

[Stick Up Kid]

from all the stans on this forum. including Nas, Jay Z, Kobe, Biggie, 2pac, etc.. LeBron stans seem to be the least educated on hoops and most delusional.

 

[Professor Emeritus]

You just posted 9 regular season shots from a tiny 2.5 year stretch back five years ago as your argument?

I already posted that he's made FORTY-TWO game-winning/game-tying shots in his 15-year career. Looks like you missed 41 of them.

Not to mention 2006 Washington, 2006 Detroit, 2007 Detroit, 2008 Boston, 2009 Orlando, 2011 Chicago, 2012 Indiana, 2012 Boston, 2012 Oklahoma City, 2013 Indiana, 2013 San Antonio, 2015 Chicago, 2015 Golden State, 2016 Golden State.


And @Gil Scott-Heroin dapping up the guy who just made THAT argument for claiming I'm the "least educated" on hoops.

 

[Rigby.]

The Celtics have an incredible system that any really good PG can succeed in. Kyrie individually isnt like WAY better than him in Cleveland. Things like improved defense isnt something LeBron (even if you want to call him LECOACH or whatever Bron haters go with) affects exclusively, Boston, like many other teams with good systems, hold their entire roster accountable for doing as good as possible defensively. Cleveland made moves that took away any foundation of a defense that hustles and Lue is just over his head on that end. Keeping Blatt would've been nice, but past him, they dont give enough minutes to potential rotational players that'll at least try on that end. I dont even know what the fukk they practice defensively, because their ball IQ on that end top to bottom is just bad. Most of those things reflect back to systems, and Lue's system is nonexistent.

IDK what LeBron did in the past 3 years that directly neutered Kyrie though opened the door for a roster of talent he would've never had, allowed him to grow as a facilitator without actually taking the role of being THE facilitator, and I feel the platform that Bron's demands for success allowed Kyrie to take his game to even higher heights. He ofc showed flashes of being the cold killa, but its pretty safe to say the culture of mediocrity that Cleveland seemed content with wouldnt have ever allowed Kyrie to be considered one of the faces of the L, at least not based on doing big things in big moments on a big team. Basically, Cousins on the Kings, Love on the TWolves, this is exactly the situation Kyrie was in. And it didnt really look like it was getting better, CLE still couldnt attract FA, they still didnt have good draft IQ/development (Tristan sucks, maybe he isnt here by this point without Bron caping. Waiters without Riley . Anthony Bennett....list goes on), even tho Im sure someone wants to front like ball dominant, non defense playing Wiggins would've been the answered to those solutions. If you got a lineup that features slasher heavy Kyrie, meh shooting Waiters, non shooting Wiggins, and Tristan, you probably arent gonna win more than 30 games

Tl;dr I fukk with Kyrie succeeding, I just dont know what LeBron physically said or did that hurt Kyrie's growth. He elevated him from the shytty situation of pre-Bron CLE, which was the stepping stone for him to find another good situation.

 

[Anerdyblackguy]

No, it just shows that Danny Ainge and Brad Stevens are a great group. The Celtics have lockdown defenders ( Smart & Rozier) a great passing center who can spread the floor ( Horford) and great wings ( Tatum & Brown).

This team already showed what they can do without Isaiah Thomas and Kyrie ( Last year Eastern conference Finals).

 

[Stick Up Kid]

You just posted 9 regular season shots from a tiny 2.5 year stretch back five years ago as your argument?

I already posted that he's made FORTY-TWO game-winning/game-tying shots in his 15-year career. Looks like you missed 41 of them.

Not to mention 2006 Washington, 2006 Detroit, 2007 Detroit, 2008 Boston, 2009 Orlando, 2011 Chicago, 2012 Indiana, 2012 Boston, 2012 Oklahoma City, 2013 Indiana, 2013 San Antonio, 2015 Chicago, 2015 Golden State, 2016 Golden State.


And @Gil Scott-Heroin has gone full retard mode dapping up the guy who just made THAT argument for claiming I'm the "least educated" on hoops. You KNOW that idiocy.

LeBron is the Peyton Manning of the NBA.. all time great regular season player with empty stats, below average in the clutch/playoffs

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

And @Gil Scott-Heroin has gone full retard mode dapping up the guy who just made THAT argument for claiming I'm the "least educated" on hoops. You KNOW that idiocy.

I dapped him for the 'LeBron stans are the most delusional' comment - which is true, but sure, a lot of LeBron stans can be classified as being the "least educated" too. I'm glad that got under your skin. You've been posting a lot of nonsense lately.

 

[Rigby.]

part of LeBron's aura (media narrative anyway) was that he could play with anyone and elevate anyone.

but it looks like it was the other way around, and it was Kyrie that was elevating LeBron and the Cavs

Even if I give you this, how is this statement wrong for most of LeBron's career. You would certainly be dishonest in trying to say he didn't elevate Cleveland in his first stint. Miami was in the lower part of a coaster that seemingly reached its peak with Wade's earlier years. THere's not that much saying that it would've got back to championship culture without more and more years of struggling, especially with how Riley viewed things like FA loyalty and drafting pre Bron and Wade leaving. Those moves really accelerated Riley's acceptance of the new culture of basketball prospects (even tho he still hasnt gotten that one elite player yet). point really being is that while you can say Bron doesnt make players directly better, building a sufficient system around his strengths and weaknesses has been a proven form of success pre-Kyrie. That's not even a media narrative, that's just following the guy's career

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

Leave it up to a LeBron stan to say Kyrie isn't having a MVP-caliber season because he isn't averaging the right amount of box score stats.

 

[Stick Up Kid]

Leave it up to a LeBron stan to say Kyrie isn't having a MVP-caliber season because he isn't averaging the right amount of box score stats.

LeBron is the king of the empty stats, he ushered in a new era of idiots that think % rates and other cac'analytics is more important than winning, clutch shots etc.

 

[Rigby.]

kyrie was right to leave lebron he was only holding him back and it shows

How does it show though? What is the tangible proof that LeBron directly held back Kyrie? Its not like he held him back from playing better defense, didnt hold him back from having actual court vision the plays and games LeBron sat out. Kyrie had flaws that he could've improved with LeBron if he wanted to, it seems this offseason motivated him for multiple reasons and if he felt like he could only improve elsewhere, then so be it. But its like you're trying to say a system (and coach) that made a 5'9 sixth man MVP caliber is great evidence that playing with Bron lessens your performance.

 

[ELESDEE616]

How fitting that you create your arguments based on the box score. You're following in the footsteps of all the LeBron stans before you.

What argument am I creating? That the Celtics have a good team. That Kyrie is playing good not great on a good team.

Tell me dumb hoe, what argument am I creating?

 

[Stick Up Kid]

What argument am I creating? That the Celtics have a good team. That Kyrie is playing good not great on a good team.

Tell me dumb hoe, what argument am I creating?

Lebron stans upset

Kyrie winning the war

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

What argument am I creating? That the Celtics have a good team. That Kyrie is playing good not great on a good team.

Tell me dumb hoe, what argument am I creating?

Do you not know how to read properly -

How fitting that you create your arguments based on the box score. You're following in the footsteps of all the LeBron stans before you.