Job Automation and the Minimum Wage Debate

[Poitier]

Its crazy how Cacs were the least advanced group of people for MULTIPLE MILLENNIA until 1500. The Earth was healthy and race as a divisive tactic didn't exist nor did individualism. Now these motherfukkers are killing the Earth with their technologies and ideologies before they leave the poor for dead and go to whatever space habitat they build. Us people of color have to stop these barbarians

 

[Starman]

A basic income is inevitable

Like minimum wage? What do you mean?

Edit: Nevermind, I just read this

Its crazy how Cacs were the least advanced group of people for MULTIPLE MILLENNIA until 1500. The Earth was healthy and race as a divisive tactic didn't exist nor did individualism. Now these motherfukkers are killing the Earth with their technologies and ideologies before they leave the poor for dead and go to whatever space habitat they build. Us people of color have to stop these barbarians

and see that you're insane.

 

[Poitier]

Like minimum wage? What do you mean?

No, the government giving you 50k for the year and telling you go find something to do

 

[Type Username Here]

No, the government giving you 50k for the year and telling you go find something to do

How about we just skip currency all together?

Currency is primitive.

 

[Chris.B]

How about we just skip currency all together?

Currency is primitive.

yesu Christo

 

[Poitier]

How about we just skip currency all together?

Currency is primitive.

How do you see it going?

and see that you're insane.

If you can refute anything I say, go for it.

 

[Type Username Here]

How do you see it going?




If you can refute anything I say, go for it.

Something like a resource based economy. See the video I posted on the first page, it touches on it. Doesn't have to be that exactly, but something close to it.

 

[Type Username Here]

yesu Christo

It is. Currency, especially the way it exists in the present, is a primitive concept that borders on illusion. Most of the world's money doesn't exist in a tangible form, but even using precious metals is primitive. We've been using a form of it for two thousand years.

 

[NZA]

Taking it further down the rabbit hole, if there are no consumers, how will the aspring venture capitalists continue to fund/support automation?

You eliminate fast food workers, replace them with machines, you don't think you"ll hear or see McDonalds commercials on the radio?

You know how tech manufacturers produce OEM parts? Automation. Yet, you still get Ad's, Billboards, and 30 seconds intermission plugs for services and new gizmos and gadgets every day.

Perhaps I should have prefaced my initial post with "Playing Devils Realistic Advocate".

the economy pushes workers out, shrinking its pool of consumers but also making operations more efficient. for a while, gains are made because of the new efficiency. capitalists are drunk off this easy money...

eventually, there is no more low hanging fruit. efficiency has done all its going to do, you cant sell more or charge more because you have been actively killing the consumers and your stuff is too cheap to warrant higher prices among the few consumers you do have left.

now as a marketer, you must prove ROI in order to continue getting work. in this scenario, there is no churn of new consumers, just a small dying breed who after looking at all the doom and gloom in the economy are probably going to start saving. this small market is already saturated with your previous marketing, so you as a marketer basically have no reason to have a job either. welcome to the pool of unemployed bums.

so in short, you dont even have to automate literally every job, just enough jobs to ruin a capitalist economy. there is some kind of tipping point that will do it. at least in recent history somebody would eventually start buying stuff again to bring the economy back. with mostly robot workers, that will not happen. hopefully we are smart enough to start paying people a universal wage or something. i have to assume that there will be a lot of people bussing their guns and whatnot before it reaches this point, so extreme unrest should be a motivator.

 

[Jhoon]

It is. Currency, especially the way it exists in the present, is a primitive concept that borders on illusion. Most of the world's money doesn't exist in a tangible form, but even using precious metals is primitive. We've been using a form of it for two thousand years.

if the rich want their lives, they are going to have to give their wealth. The idea of accumulation of property have ruined this planet.

 

[AtomicUse]

no you are finding ways to justify your field of trade from the automation.

shyt will hit everyone

My take on automation is that it impacts areas of the workforce that don't need the human element to a greater degree. We've seen that happen(still happening). How can you argue that?

As far as shyt hitting everyone, I can't disagree with that, devils advocate or not, but you go deep enough with the automation theory and you end up with social meltdown.

 

[Poitier]

It doesn't have to be all doom and gloom. All it takes is a radical shift of economic and social systems. Full automation can be a very good thing for human beings.

The Venus Project has really good ideas. Obviously it has flaws and shortcomings, but at least it's proposing relatively great alternatives.

I like the engineering and city planning but it does seem like Elysium and I don't see how it rids society of elitism and politics?

You'd also have to be fine with synthetic EVERYTHING to believe that resources are abundant. All I know is that I hope the West declines and the rest of the world keaves them out when our automated future happens. Something like The Venus Project can't happen in the West.

 

[AtomicUse]

the economy pushes workers out, shrinking its pool of consumers but also making operations more efficient. for a while, gains are made because of the new efficiency. capitalists are drunk off this easy money...

eventually, there is no more low hanging fruit. efficiency has done all its going to do, you cant sell more or charge more because you have been actively killing the consumers and your stuff is too cheap to warrant higher prices among the few consumers you do have left.

now as a marketer, you must prove ROI in order to continue getting work. in this scenario, there is no churn of new consumers, just a small dying breed who after looking at all the doom and gloom in the economy are probably going to start saving. this small market is already saturated with your previous marketing, so you as a marketer basically have no reason to have a job either. welcome to the pool of unemployed bums.

so in short, you dont even have to automate literally every job, just enough jobs to ruin a capitalist economy. there is some kind of tipping point that will do it. at least in recent history somebody would eventually start buying stuff again to bring the economy back. with mostly robot workers, that will not happen. hopefully we are smart enough to start paying people a universal wage or something. i have to assume that there will be a lot of people bussing their guns and whatnot before it reaches this point, so extreme unrest should be a motivator.

The "cross your fingers" and "load your guns" approach?
I cosign with you on that, but there's a good peice of satirical art that can explain what Id like to post, succinctly. I'll see if I can find it shortly.

 

[Type Username Here]

I like the engineering and city planning but it does seem like Elysium and I don't see how it rids society of elitism and politics?

You'd also have to be fine with synthetic EVERYTHING to believe that resources are abundant. All I know is that I hope the West declines and the rest of the world keaves them out when our automated future happens. Something like The Venus Project can't happen in the West.

It has flaws. It's a rudimentary idea to build on. As for you question, it's basically a Marxist society. Computers and programs dictate political decisions and portioning equally among citizens. It's a true democracy as the technology and time not spent laboring allows each citizen to have a vote and voice in decisions in real time. It hasn't addressed limiting mob rule.

Like I said, it's just an idea to show that we can proceed in different paths. It was to be fined tuned and debated without a doubt.

 

[Wild self]

the economy pushes workers out, shrinking its pool of consumers but also making operations more efficient. for a while, gains are made because of the new efficiency. capitalists are drunk off this easy money...

eventually, there is no more low hanging fruit. efficiency has done all its going to do, you cant sell more or charge more because you have been actively killing the consumers and your stuff is too cheap to warrant higher prices among the few consumers you do have left.

now as a marketer, you must prove ROI in order to continue getting work. in this scenario, there is no churn of new consumers, just a small dying breed who after looking at all the doom and gloom in the economy are probably going to start saving. this small market is already saturated with your previous marketing, so you as a marketer basically have no reason to have a job either. welcome to the pool of unemployed bums.

so in short, you dont even have to automate literally every job, just enough jobs to ruin a capitalist economy. there is some kind of tipping point that will do it. at least in recent history somebody would eventually start buying stuff again to bring the economy back. with mostly robot workers, that will not happen. hopefully we are smart enough to start paying people a universal wage or something. i have to assume that there will be a lot of people bussing their guns and whatnot before it reaches this point, so extreme unrest should be a motivator.

Switzerland has a universal wage to their citizens. But America would see anarchy before that happens.