Just what was Microsoft thinking?

MeachTheMonster

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1. Yes i care, so should you! So fk everyone that lives in region locked country? no this a negative. My country (in the EU) was supported but still.
Should every product that comes out cater to everyone on earth? Are you upset when a company releases something in Japan that wouldn't work in your country?

2. hmm well i see your point about checking in too authenticate if you have a legit copy.
People hear DRM and go all crazy. But DRM isn't the problem. It's the problems companies have had imementing it that's the problem. Maybe M$ could have got it right, their infrastructure surely is strong enough to handle it.

3. :comeon: Kinnect was ALWAYS on, and it did PUSH shyt FORWARD. put that ISM aside for a second. the rift looks cool though.
The rift does look cool, but the only way it will get big and get software that truly uses its abilities, is if someone makes it "always on" and packages it with a console.

To place the blame on studios closing, and devs not taking risks soley on used gaming is BS. Yes it does hurt them but, PC, smartphones,tablets i don't hear anyone talking about how people game on them more and more.

People game on them more and more because of the flexabilty of the platforms. Iphone games can cost $.99 to $20 PC games range from the $.99 games to full blockbusters that need $1000s of dollars worth of equipment to work.

Console gamers are stuck in the past. They want their experiences to be just like they were with the sega genesis. The rest of the entertainment industry is moving forward and embracing the change and in doing that they are taking part of the games industry with them. If it continue this way, the game industry as we know it will die. And all that will be left is angry birds and call of duty.
 

MidniteJay

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Region lock- why do you care. Are you in a locked region?

I don't know about the next man but for me that region lock microsoft had in place was just wack. I game with homies I grew up with but they moved and are now in countries that Microsoft didn't support for online before the switch.
 

MeachTheMonster

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I don't know about the next man but for me that region lock microsoft had in place was just wack. I game with homies I grew up that are now in countries that Microsoft didn't support for online.

That's totaly understandable. I have no problem with a person such as yourself bringing up these concerns. But in reality 99% of the people on the Internet complaining about X1 restrictions would have had no problem meeting them.
 

MeachTheMonster

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Don't care. Would prefer to own physical copies of stuff I own.

Also, gamestop isn't the only place you can buy used games from you idiots

You would have still been able buy and own physical copies.

And GameStop is by far the largest and most influential used games seller in the world. They had the most to gain and to loose. Gamers sided with them, and they will continue to erode the industry.
 

el_oh_el

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When it comes down to it, people do not like having less (perceived maybe) control over what they buy. People dont like the sound of buying a "license".
 

daze23

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Don't care. Would prefer to own physical copies of stuff I own.

Also, gamestop isn't the only place you can buy used games from you idiots

it's more about the fact that used games are Gamestop's bread & butter. without used games they most likely wouldn't survive. BUT they do still have a position with some leverage, as the industry (thinks it) needs them to sell hardware, accessories, etc

everyone loves to "follow the dollar" and "see who has the most to gain". and those roads clearly lead to Gamestop. Best Buy and such also have something to lose, and probably have had some influence here, but ultimately they can survive without video games
 

Audible101

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Should every product that comes out cater to everyone on earth? Are you upset when a company releases something in Japan that wouldn't work in your country?

Something as major as a console that i would want to play of course. wouldn't you?

People hear DRM and go all crazy. But DRM isn't the problem. It's the problems companies have had imementing it that's the problem. Maybe M$ could have got it right, their infrastructure surely is strong enough to handle it.
co-sign

The rift does look cool, but the only way it will get big and get software that truly uses its abilities, is if someone makes it "always on" and packages it with a console.
Not really look at the kinect it was not required to always be on for the 360 to function, yet it got pretty big. I do agree though to include it with every SKU is one part, but it is very risky. not everyone wants one so its about getting that overall price down for it to fly.



People game on them more and more because of the flexabilty of the platforms. Iphone games can cost $.99 to $20 PC games range from the $.99 games to full blockbusters that need $1000s of dollars worth of equipment to work.

Console gamers are stuck in the past. They want their experiences to be just like they were with the sega genesis. The rest of the entertainment industry is moving forward and embracing the change and in doing that they are taking part of the games industry with them. If it continue this way, the game industry as we know it will die. And all that will be left is angry birds and call of duty.

:tu:

Im not so pessimistic though. There will always be devs willing to push the envelope. i have full faith people will start to recognizing that what developers are doing is truly art and beautiful.
 

Clapsteel O'Neal

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You would have still been able buy and own physical copies.

And GameStop is by far the largest and most influential used games seller in the world. They had the most to gain and to loose. Gamers sided with them, and they will continue to erode the industry.

I don't know. I'm either succombing to fear mongering, thinking 10 years down the line or a mixture of the two but I just don't want there to ever be a time when I can't buy a physical disc and the steps microsoft were taking was heading down that path


I'm just not a fan of digital ownership (or lack thereof) when it comes to games :yeshrug:
 

iceberg_is_on_fire

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Microsoft thought that they'd have a dance partner in Sony to implement this stuff, once it showed that they didn't, they had to lean back. Microsoft and Sony are after the same goal. Don't get it twisted with the millions of proprietary memory card formats that Sony has come out with for years was all out of love for consumers. They want to get people invested in their ecosystem and away from others. Microsoft was just way more blatant and out in the open with it. Also, Don Mattrick is a dumbass, Phil Spencer seems to be an ok dude.
 

MeachTheMonster

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Something as major as a console that i would want to play of course. wouldn't you?
I would mind but as long as there was an alternative that i could use, it ultimately wouldn't matter to me. And I damn sure wouldn't be protesting cause someone else couldn't use it.

Not really look at the kinect it was not required to always be on for the 360 to function, yet it got pretty big. I do agree though to include it with every SKU is one part, but it is very risky. not everyone wants one so its about getting that overall price down for it to fly.
The kinect sold well but there was never any really compelling software that took advantage of it outside of casual and dancing games. The price will come down, it always does. But by putting it in the box you make sure that it will be supported by devs willing to put extra resources into it.




:tu:

Im not so pessimistic though. There will always be devs willing to push the envelope. i have full faith people will start to recognizing that what developers are doing is truly art and beautiful.
Yeah I hope you're right.
 

MeachTheMonster

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Microsoft thought that they'd have a dance partner in Sony to implement this stuff, once it showed that they didn't, they had to lean back. Microsoft and Sony are after the same goal. Don't get it twisted with the millions of proprietary memory card formats that Sony has come out with for years was all out of love for consumers. They want to get people invested in their ecosystem and away from others. Microsoft was just way more blatant and out in the open with it. Also, Don Mattrick is a dumbass, Phil Spencer seems to be an ok dude.

Exactly. People prop up Sony as "looking out for gamers" "consumer friendly" but they're just trying to make money like everyone else. They just decided for this gen that they'd rather play it safe and ride the Internet rage wave instead of trying to push things forward. But at the end of the day they only care about lining their own pockets, just like everyone else. Also with their online infastructure so behind they may not have been able to pull off a system such as the one M$ proposed, so it made business sense for them to push away and postpone that future untill they were ready.
 

MeachTheMonster

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Another article on the subject
Microsoft's Xbox One Eighty

Humans are amazing optimizers. There is a game shop here in Warsaw, where all you have to do is to buy one game, and then from now on for about fifteen dollars you can exchange it for any other new game. In other words, after the initial purchase any new console title costs you fifteen bucks. Is it right? Is it wrong? It doesn't matter. What matters is that many people are playing off one box of a game, and while this makes the consumers and the shop happy, it’s not making the developers and publishers happy.

And, you know, just like salesmen and gamers are great optimizers, so are the developers and publishers. A good few years ago, a mantra was born: “…so they keep the disc in the tray”.

That is how the DLC was born. “Don’t sell your copy yet, there’s more to come!” Not all gamers fell for it. But those who did were paying five, ten, fifteen dollars for added content which took only a tiny fraction of developer’s resources and time needed to make the full game, and yet cost these gamers 25 per cent of it. It was often enough to cover the perceived loss from used game sales. Not unlike when 'whales' cover the cost of 'freeloaders' in free to play games.

That is also how filler content was born. Far Cry 3 is not a better game because you need two boar hides to craft a simple rucksack item, but it certainly is longer. For some game players, length equals value. But then somehow the same people often do not finish such a game (industry standard is about 25 per cent). They put it back on the shelf, promising themselves that they will finish it one day. Most of the time, they never do. But the important thing for the publishers is: the gamers hold on to the game, they’re not selling it, all is good.

This is how artificial extenders were born. The hardest difficulty is inaccessible on your first play-through not just because the developer wants to stop you from making a mistake. It’s so you replay the game at least one more time and double your play time. And if you don’t care about that? Hey, there are always achievements to collect, right?

That is also how microtransactions were born. There will always be people who are ready to pay for a golden saddle or extra ammo in a game they already paid sixty bucks for. The numbers are insane – some triple-A games made tens of millions this way. Again, 'whales' were paying for 'freeloaders'.

The problem is: games only got worse this way. Do you think any flesh and blood developer likes working on DLC? Most of the time, no, they don’t, they’d happily move onto the next big thing. Do you think that game designers are happy reconfiguring their mechanics to support micro-transactions? No, they’re not, they know these things are not making their game better, and most of them feel dirty for knowing what psychological tricks to use to lure the whales into paying. Do you think that the teams don’t know their game would be better without the filler content or artificial extenders? Trust me, they do.

But this was the price to pay – or so they thought – for used game sales. 'Our game is not better because of all these things, but at least the people will' – yep, you guessed it – 'keep the disc in tray'. And in the case they won’t, well, the whales will pay for it.

If you care about video games, you must want this model to die.

The problem is, no one knows what the right solution is, and how to stop the used game sales. The often repeated 'just make better games' is a myth, unless you truly believe that the best sellers in 2010-2013 were also the best games out of all released in that period. To me, it’s that the $60 price needs to die. The truth is, no one really gives a crap about 'the right of first sale' or 'sharing with friends' if the price is low. Unless a movie is bad, no one complains they pay ten bucks to see it, and no one complains they can only see it once for that price.

But even if the salvation was in the form of the death of the $60 price tag, then …how? With episodic content? Shorter games? Freemium games? Separation of singleplayer and multiplayer? Big games relying on more people buying them because of the lower price? Who knows?

What we know, though, is that these kinds of experiments can only happen in the digital space. They will not happen at GameStop. GameStop – never was a company named so fittingly – cares only about big expensive games, and used game sales. But we have already established that none of these things results in better games.

Some may say at this point: but what stops anyone from experimenting with various digital forms right here, right now? My answer to that is simple: as long as the retail box is alive, no big publisher can ignore it. As long you want to touch and smell the box and believe that you absolutely need to be able to play this game twenty years from now (except you won’t, because in order to DRM, everyone is doing single/multiplayer hybrids right now, and no, these servers will not be alive in twenty years), GameStop will still be relevant. And with GameStop relevant… well, you already know.
 

Black_Jesus

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You would have still been able buy and own physical copies.

And GameStop is by far the largest and most influential used games seller in the world. They had the most to gain and to loose. Gamers sided with them, and they will continue to erode the industry.

That's a bunch of bullshyt. .

Ain't nobody side with no motherfukking gamestop... nikkas sided with Sony which indirectly was a W for gamestop... BIG DIFFERENCEA

$499 vs $399 and requiring no 24hr online check in as well as no used game restrictions to where I could buy a game (physical) and sell it without the use of internet (no hidden fees) is why so many people sided with the PS4
 

MeachTheMonster

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That's a bunch of bullshyt. .

Ain't nobody side with no motherfukking gamestop... nikkas sided with Sony which indirectly was a W for gamestop...

$499 vs $399 and requiring no 24hr online check in as well as no used game restrictions to where I could buy a game (physical) and sell it without the use of internet (no hidden fees) is why so many people sided with the PS4

If people such as yourself would stop to anylize the situation you'd realize that your "choice" was totaly influenced by GameStop. And the things you thought you were fighting for were more ideology than impact to your gaming experience.
 

krexzen

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Ooooh Poor Microsoft.. Their horrible way of introducing this as a steam like service was wonky from jump. They should have just said we are offering digital downloads, and of course at a cheaper price. They just came off super greedy.

This. They could've said a $10 - $15 price drop for digital downloads, but they didn't. They want their $59.99 (or in this likely case $69.99) for every copy regardless of medium. As always greed wins. If I'm going to pay full price, I might as well buy a physical copy. As of right now DD is mostly for instant gratification.
 
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