lets talk about Dirk Nowitzki handing Father Time his first L

[Codeine Bryant]

I'll never forget my Warriors going on a never ending layup drill against the Mavs in 2007. If only the Mavs had a 7 footer that played defense :JJ:

You so furious all you can do is try and shame Dirk for losing.

While at the time KG was sitting at home watching it all on TV.


Ya, KG is the real winner

 

[Goatpoacher]

Again, 2007 is all you have.

A bad playoff series for Dirk was an annual occurance for KG

You KG stans stay overlooking ALL of KGs shortcomings, but emphasize Dirk's few.

I can acknowledge Dirk came up short in 06 vs Heat and 07 vs Warriors. Problem is you delusional KG stans can't acknowledge his litany of shortcomings.

I won't cop pleas for Dirk playing soft. But you'll cop pleas for a decade of KG getting sonned.


Dude took a gigantic franchise player contract and could only make 1 measly WCF. Crippled his team.

I saw KG get sonned by Dirk, Duncan, and Shaq everytime he went up against them. They consistently dropped 30+ on his ass.


Tell me more about KGs defense

Dirk averaged over 30 and 10 when they played each other in 2004.


Tell me more about the game of basketball

When KG had even halfway decent teammates he did well. Funny thing about Dirk is, he won when he had one of his shyttiest rosters. Cuban gave him so many strong teams and he came up short. On the other hand, KG was supposed to win titles with Brandon Terrell (a slower version of D'angelo Russell) and the ghost of Malik Sealy?

YOu're right though, his contract was a big reason he had shytty teammates. But the Joe Smith scandal really fukked them. HOwever, as soon as KG went to the Celtics, he went to 2 finals and his teams overachieved. Whereas Dirk's team's consistently underachieved.

And yes, Dirk took a shyt on KG. He even took a shyt on Timmy once or twice. You're not seriously going to say Dirk is >>> Timmy :JJ: ?

The bottom line is, you are accusing me of doing exactly what you are doing. You're highlighting KG's deficiencies and understating his strengths and doing the converse for Dirk. Unlike you, I'm not a stan and neither player played for my team. KG is objectively better. It's slight, but it's significant. HOwever, the gap between KG and Dirk is miniscule compared to the gap between Timmy and both of them.

 

[Goatpoacher]

You so furious all you can do is try and shame Dirk for losing.

While at the time KG was sitting at home watching it all on TV.


Ya, KG is the real winner

Dirk never missed the playoffs ?


Didn't KG win a championship the very next year? What was Dirk doing?


And you're missing the point. If Dirk played defense, maybe the Warriors would not have dominated them so thoroughly. You claim KG needed Paul Pierce, but Dirk needed a Tyson Chandler to clean up his lack of defensive effort.

 

[the cool]

I saw KG hit clutch shots against the warriors and Kings consistently. But let's leave aside this false argument because it is a false argument.

Let me explain basketball to you.

1. At any given time during actual play, there are five players on the court for each team. These five players are expected to play both offense and defense.

2. There are 4 quarters in basketball. There's not just a "fourth" quarter.

3. You can win games with offense, defense, or, most preferably, a combination of both.


So, KG couldn't win without Paul Pierce to be the "closer"? I could say Dirk couldn't win without Tyson Chandler as a defensive anchor. IN fact, I do say this. Why couldn't Dirk, a 7 footer, be a more effective defender? HE really was no more active on defense than his BFF Steve Nash.


In the end, maybe KG and Dirk should have played together :JJ:

What a terrible post

 

[Codeine Bryant]

Dirk never missed the playoffs ?


Didn't KG win a championship the very next year? What was Dirk doing?


And you're missing the point. If Dirk played defense, maybe the Warriors would not have dominated them so thoroughly. You claim KG needed Paul Pierce, but Dirk needed a Tyson Chandler to clean up his lack of defensive effort.

That's the point. All Dirk needed was a couple role players and defensive specialist. That's how great he was. The first year Dirk got a solid defensive frontcourt player, he won.

KG needed 2 All-Stars and former franchise players.

You say you're not a stan and looking at this objectively. Well, objectively speaking, KG needed All-Stars to do what Dirk did with role players. Yes?

Also, at KG "overachieving" on the Celtics. KG, Pierce, Allen, Rondo, and Perkins was probably the best starting 5 in basketball the year they won. Bynum was hurt on the Lakers. The definition of a Superteam. LeBron even says it was the reason why he went to Miami. But here you are saying Garnett "overachieved."

Okay

 

[Codeine Bryant]

What a terrible post

Dude doesn't realize KG needed All-Stars to achieve what another man did with role players.

Pierce was still a top 20 player in 07-08 and Allen was dropping 30 some nights.

Meanwhile Dirk's best player was a 6th man and Caron tore his ACL middle of the year.


One guy clearly did more with less.

 

[Codeine Bryant]

KG needed a superteam to win. Dirk beat a superteam to win.

 

[Codeine Bryant]

When KG had even halfway decent teammates he did well. Funny thing about Dirk is, he won when he had one of his shyttiest rosters. Cuban gave him so many strong teams and he came up short. On the other hand, KG was supposed to win titles with Brandon Terrell (a slower version of D'angelo Russell) and the ghost of Malik Sealy?

YOu're right though, his contract was a big reason he had shytty teammates. But the Joe Smith scandal really fukked them. HOwever, as soon as KG went to the Celtics, he went to 2 finals and his teams overachieved. Whereas Dirk's team's consistently underachieved.

And yes, Dirk took a shyt on KG. He even took a shyt on Timmy once or twice. You're not seriously going to say Dirk is >>> Timmy :JJ: ?

The bottom line is, you are accusing me of doing exactly what you are doing. You're highlighting KG's deficiencies and understating his strengths and doing the converse for Dirk. Unlike you, I'm not a stan and neither player played for my team. KG is objectively better. It's slight, but it's significant. HOwever, the gap between KG and Dirk is miniscule compared to the gap between Timmy and both of them.

Nah, I'm pointing out how overrated his defense was.

All you back in the day ass dudes hype his defense up. shyt went GHOST when it mattered the most. At least Dirk's offense came up big in the big moments.

Whenever the Wolves needed KGs defense the most vs the premier frontcourt players of his era (Shaq, Duncan, Dirk), he got raped no vaseline.

KGs defense really only mattered in meaningless regular season games or if he had 2 All-Stars around him. He wasn't stopping or affecting shyt vs the players he ACTUALLY needed to defend.

But the way you tell it, KGs defense actually meant something vs good competition.

What good is KGs defense when it was nonexistent vs the best players he was supposed to lock down?


Yo, I got a nice Ferrari in the garage. It's fast as fukk breh. It'll smoke your little Honda.

But it only starts up in May

 

[duckbutta]

The mental gymnastics people do to talk around Dirk atrocious defense is

I think this guy has surpassed Lebron for what 1 championship did for him...

I don't remember seeing a "Dirk is top" anything thread on any message board before he won 1 ring...

I just legit don't understand these Dirk VS KD arguments...

When it comes to putting the ball in the hoop Dirk is better but KG was not bad at it...

When it comes to EVERY OTHER CONCEIVABLE FACET OF BASKETBALL...kg is better...

So the guy who is better at more basketball things > the guy who is better at the one thing people place the most emphasis own...

Off the top of my head I think maybe only Lebron has played with as many players to make an all star team as Dirk has...

This dude has played with 2 first ballot HOF point guards

fukking 2

If you start listing the top 15 point guards of all time Dirk has played with 2 of them

Who is the best point guard KG ever played with...

fukking Rondo

 

[Codeine Bryant]

The mental gymnastics people do to talk around Dirk atrocious defense is

I think this guy has surpassed Lebron for what 1 championship did for him...

I don't remember seeing a "Dirk is top" anything thread on any message board before he won 1 ring...

I just legit don't understand these Dirk VS KD arguments...

When it comes to putting the ball in the hoop Dirk is better but KG was not bad at it...

When it comes to EVERY OTHER CONCEIVABLE FACET OF BASKETBALL...kg is better...

So the guy who is better at more basketball things > the guy who is better at the one thing people place the most emphasis own...

Off the top of my head I think maybe only Lebron has played with as many players to make an all star team as Dirk has...

This dude has played with 2 first ballot HOF point guards

fukking 2

If you start listing the top 15 point guards of all time Dirk has played with 2 of them

Who is the best point guard KG ever played with...

fukking Rondo

Lettuce continue to use your logic.

Kevin Durant is really good at putting the ball in the basket. Kawhi's not bad himself.

At almost every other phase of basketball, argument could be made that Kawhi leonard is better.

We crowning Kawhi over Durant? No, cause offense is a premium in the league.

It's why guys like Melo, Durant, and Harden, guys who either play little or no defense get ranked over all-around players.


And Dirk played with Kidd when he was like 36 years old breh. Let's be objective about this here. Duncan has played with more All-Stars than Dirk.

Dirk - Finley, Nash, Josh Howard (1 year I think), Kidd (1 year I think)

Duncan - Robinson, Parker, Manu, Kawhi, Aldridge. Parker and Manu for multiple years.

 

[Goatpoacher]

What a terrible post

Maybe you're just stupid? (Answer is yes)

 

[Goatpoacher]

That's the point. All Dirk needed was a couple role players and defensive specialist. That's how great he was. The first year Dirk got a solid defensive frontcourt player, he won.

KG needed 2 All-Stars and former franchise players.

You say you're not a stan and looking at this objectively. Well, objectively speaking, KG needed All-Stars to do what Dirk did with role players. Yes?

Also, at KG "overachieving" on the Celtics. KG, Pierce, Allen, Rondo, and Perkins was probably the best starting 5 in basketball the year they won. Bynum was hurt on the Lakers. The definition of a Superteam. LeBron even says it was the reason why he went to Miami. But here you are saying Garnett "overachieved."

Okay

Dirk lost with Finley and Nash

Dirk lost with his 67 win team that had a shyt load of talent (Harris, Howard, Terry)

Dirk lost to a team with a quasi-Holmes Shaq, Antoine Walker, old ass Gary Payton, Jason Williams on Prozack, and Alonzo Mourning on one kidney :JJ:


And Dirk never played defense.

Also, KG's CELTS overachieved in getting to the Finals in 2010 and how far they pushed Lebron's Heat teams.

 

[Goatpoacher]

When it comes to putting the ball in the hoop Dirk is better but KG was not bad at it...

When it comes to EVERY OTHER CONCEIVABLE FACET OF BASKETBALL...kg is better...

Exactly. Next they'll say Dirk is better than Timmy because Dirk can shoot the 3.

If you look at KG's defensive stats when he was on the Celtics, he was a beast up to two years ago.

 

[Codeine Bryant]

Dirk lost with Finley and Nash

Dirk lost with his 67 win team that had a shyt load of talent (Harris, Howard, Terry)

Dirk lost to a team with a quasi-Holmes Shaq, Antoine Walker, old ass Gary Payton, Jason Williams on Prozack, and Alonzo Mourning on one kidney :JJ:


And Dirk never played defense.

Also, KG's CELTS overachieved in getting to the Finals in 2010 and how far they pushed Lebron's Heat teams.

so 2007 Devin Harris, Josh Howard, and 6th man Jason Terry is "shyt load of talent?"

But 06 Shaq, Walker, Payton, White Chocolate, Mourning, Haslem, Posey is trash.


If that 2007 team won a ring that year, it would have been the worst roster to win a ring in the last 20 years. Fact.

Devin Haris, Adrian Griffin, Josh Howard, Eric Dampier, Jason Terry, Desagana Diop, and whoever the fukk else was on that team. That's a 67 win team and a "shyt load of talent."

Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, Dirk carried that team? Maybe, just mabye, those guys were bums who probably wouldn't win 20 games without Dirk?



Nah. That team had a "shyt load of talent"

 

[duckbutta]

Lettuce continue to use your logic.

Kevin Durant is really good at putting the ball in the basket. Kawhi's not bad himself.

At almost every other phase of basketball, argument could be made that Kawhi leonard is better.

We crowning Kawhi over Durant? No, cause offense is a premium in the league.

It's why guys like Melo, Durant, and Harden, guys who either play little or no defense get ranked over all-around players.


And Dirk played with Kidd when he was like 36 years old breh. Let's be objective about this here. Duncan has played with more All-Stars than Dirk.

Dirk - Finley, Nash, Josh Howard (1 year I think), Kidd (1 year I think)

Duncan - Robinson, Parker, Manu, Kawhi, Aldridge. Parker and Manu for multiple years.

Uh...I am absolutely crowning Kawhi over Durant this year and every year going forward...

They put up comparable offensive numbers but Kawhi is so far ahead of him defensively it has gotten to the point that Kawhi can guard Durant straight up with no help and Durant can't do anything but get ran over and give up layups trying to guard Kawhi...

As far as Duncan...I can't imagine a world where Tony Parker is an all star without him...Parker couldn't even make a jumpshot until about 5 years ago...i don't see how he becomes the player he is today without the goat power forward giving him open looks whenever he wants them...I could see Manu making some all star teams without Duncan though...

I don't put a very big premium on scoring because the number 1 factor in that is how many shots you take and that has nothing to do with how good you are. Guys like Durant and Harden BETTER put up a shyt ton of points because they take a shyt ton of shots. It''d be sorry of them or any player to be top 10 in FGA and not be top 10 in scoring...

The problem with age is that perennial all stars and hof tend to fall off and end as still pretty good nba players...kobe notwithstanding...so let's not act like 36 year old Jason Kidd was some sorry ass scrub...he was still a good player...