Lord Jamar DEMOLISHES KRS-One's claim of Latinos pioneering Hip-Hop

[CHICAGO]

Lord Jamar is like Tariq Nasheed were those old tweets acknowledging Kool Herc are coming back to haunt his contradiction. This is just another reason why I originally said Lord Jamar isn't the go to guy for this topic.

x.com

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BECAUSE THATS THE LIE
WE WERE ALL FED FOR DECADES.

THERES NOTHING WRONG
WITH BECOMING KNOWLEDGEABLE
ON A SUBJECT AND CHANGING
YOUR STANCE WITH NEW INFORMATION.

NOW THERE IS
SOMETHING VERY WRONG
ABOUT SEEING NEW INFORMATION
FROM ALL OF THESE PIONEERS
DEBUNKING OLD MYTHS
AND CONTINUING TO DOUBLE DOWN
ON THE OLD MYTHS



​

 

[DontEemTry]

Kinda sad how nikkas fighting over hiphop when that shyt is damn near a rotted corpse now.

One side should be like, damn...you take it breh

 

[Plankton]

BECAUSE THATS THE LIE
WE WERE ALL FED FOR DECADES.

THERES NOTHING WRONG
WITH BECOMING KNOWLEDGEABLE
ON A SUBJECT AND CHANGING
YOUR STANCE WITH NEW INFORMATION.

NOW THERE IS
SOMETHING VERY WRONG
ABOUT SEEING NEW INFORMATION
FROM ALL OF THESE PIONEERS
DEBUNKING OLD MYTHS
AND CONTINUING TO DOUBLE DOWN
ON THE OLD MYTHS



​

Wrong.


I said it numerous times in this very thread The documentary Founding Fathers which involved Ralph McDaniels came out in 2011. Lord Jamar made that tweet in 2016 so you cant use the "but but but but but we been fed lies for decades" cop out on this one.

 

[Knicksman20]

BECAUSE THATS THE LIE
WE WERE ALL FED FOR DECADES.

THERES NOTHING WRONG
WITH BECOMING KNOWLEDGEABLE
ON A SUBJECT AND CHANGING
YOUR STANCE WITH NEW INFORMATION.

NOW THERE IS
SOMETHING VERY WRONG
ABOUT SEEING NEW INFORMATION
FROM ALL OF THESE PIONEERS
DEBUNKING OLD MYTHS
AND CONTINUING TO DOUBLE DOWN
ON THE OLD MYTHS



​

Don't let that weirdo fool you. He's being disingenuous & knows what you're saying, but because he's obsessed with Tariq & anything related to Black Americans, he doesn't care no matter how foolish & goofy he looks

 

[CHICAGO]

Wrong.


I said it numerous times in this very thread The documentary Founding Fathers which involved Ralph McDaniels came out in 2011. Lord Jamar made that tweet in 2016 so you cant use the "but but but but but we been fed lies for decades" cop out on this one.

OR LORD JAMAR LIKE MOST PPL
INCLUDING MYSELF NEVER KNEW
OF THE DOCUMENTARY.







​

 

[Plankton]

Don't let that weirdo fool you. He's being disingenuous & knows what you're saying, but because he's obsessed with Tariq & anything related to Black Americans, he doesn't care no matter how foolish & goofy he looks

That quote had nothing to do with Tariq Nasheed tho. It's about Lord Jamar contradicting himself in an old tweet. The whole thread is about Lord Jamar, the fukk are you on bringing Tariq in this? J You're another one of those "I'm gonna dap everything said against him even if its wrong" posters. Thats'why u brought up Tariq for no reason. Your credibility means diddly squat to me. Just put me on ignore since you have nothing to elaborate on in this convo. Hover the mouse over my username and when the ignore option pops up...Press it.

 

[Plankton]

OR LORD JAMAR LIKE MOST PPL
INCLUDING MYSELF NEVER KNEW
OF THE DOCUMENTARY.







​

That's not how it works..Keep in mind, you are speaking for Lord Jamar.....You don't even have proof he wasn't aware of the documentary...you just made that up.


Ralph McDaniels is not only a way more credible source for Hip Hop history but he was instrumental in pushing Brand Nubians in the early 90's on his show VMB. Ralph McDaniels is literally in the Unsung episode for Brand Nubians giving commentary. So it's not like Lord Jamar wouldn't be aware of who Ralph is, as well as not knowing any projects Ralph was involved in......

Now just because you didn't know about the documentary, that's on you. There is a 2014 thread on this very site about the documentary so again that's on you because you should have heard about it at the least by 2014 since you been here since The Coli started. Saying you are unaware of that documentary confirms you didn't give a shyt about the origins of Hip Hop till just recently because even @IllmaticDelta is in that 2014 thread so there is no excuse.

 

[CHICAGO]

That's not how it works..Keep in mind, you are speaking for Lord Jamar.....You don't even have proof he wasn't aware of the documentary...you just made that up.


Ralph McDaniels is not only a way more credible source for Hip Hop history but he was instrumental in pushing Brand Nubians in the early 90's on his show VMB. Ralph McDaniels is literally in the Unsung episode for Brand Nubians giving commentary. So it's not like Lord Jamar wouldn't be aware of who Ralph is, as well as not knowing any projects Ralph was involved in......

Now just because you didn't know about the documentary, that's on you. There is a 2014 thread on this very site about the documentary so again that's on you because you should have heard about it at the least by 2014 since you been here since The Coli started. Saying you are unaware of that documentary confirms you didn't give a shyt about the origins of Hip Hop till just recently because even @IllmaticDelta is in that 2014 thread so there is no excuse.

nikka I RARELY POSTED IN THE BOOTH
DURING THE FIRST FEW YEARS OF THIS SITE
SO I CLEARLY NEVER SAW THE THREAD.






​

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Now u playing games. You cut and pasted this but you left in the beginning:







Whatever book you u got that from is acknowledging Maat which is Metu Neter/Ancient Egyptian not Islam or NOI or 5% so they are obviously acknowledging all the spitritual influences on Black Counsessness. You cut and pasted the little part with Hip Hop at the end when it is obvious that is a reference to Black Consciousness because there is no reason for Maat to be in that mix with Islam or the NOI because even the Ancient Egyptian influence was sporadic within Hip Hop culture and we didn't start to see that till the late 80's. Are you gonna truy to tell me next that the Metu Neter was there in the origin of Hip Hop as well?

dude. I'm talking specifically about the NOi/5% influence. We already know that Egyptian and Swahili (Kwanaza) influenced stuff was also part of the of 1960s Afram street cultural mix.

Now this part right here really bit you in the ass:






This article has absolutly nothing to do with 5% influence on Breakbeats and BBoying. The true origins of Hip Hop. It only speaks of 5%ers being at the partys. And it also says that Kool Herc kicked it with 5%'ers. You tried it tho. You put that fluff in there as a distraction like you always do.

Dude, I never said those things had anything to do with BBoys and the music. I specifically pointed to them as part of the Afram street culture (along with the music, the verbal-oral traditions, the style of dress etc..) and street knowledge that HipHop would emerge out of. The article I posted even specified how Afram 5% slang, became HipHop slang

The cultural impact of the 5% influence itself wasn't really a thing until the mid/late 80's like I said. With the likes of Rakim, Kane, Just Ice and Lakim Shabazz. Even the part where the article u posted speaks on the "slang" they use the term "dropping science." Marly Marl and Craig dropped the song "Dropping Science" in 1988. Because that 5% slang stuff was a mid/late 80's thing in Hip Hop. You don't really here that slang in early 80's Hip Hop records. FACTS.

Dude, they existed before that and their influence was already felt by the first gen of HipHop. That's why I posted the part about Herc getting saved by 5%'s in school and him later hanging out with them, absorbing their slang/teachings. That's why you had DJs in the 1970s with names like

Prior to the that biggest spiritual influence in the early 80's came from The Zulu Nation which implimented various aspects of African and Religious influences including Islam/NOI/5% but not just secluded to Islam/NOI/5%.

But

see above

You said Hip Hop "In all actuality, it wasn't started by a single person" and then you used a video about the 5% being the "street knowledge" as a reference to "pre-existing AfroAmerican cultural trait/practice" .......but now u are posting a reference to Kool Herc being the mediator between "5% slang and science. "

That was just one example of how general AFRAM street culture was the FOUNDATIION for/to what became HipHop/people that were involved in HipHop

The very article u posted used Kool Herc as the starting point. That would contradict what you said about it not being started by a single person. The article YOU posted is basically saying if it wasn;t for Kool Herc there would be no Hip Hop for the 5% to later influence.

the article didn't say Herc was the SINGLE starting point of HipHop Herc was just a reference point as an example of how HipHop took on/inherited the influence

Atleast you admitted the NOI's influence on the streets......I'll give u that much but I had to say it for u to acknowledge it.

ALL of it was AFRAM culture, unless you think NOI came from elsewhere

 

[Plankton]

Dude, I never said those things had anything to do with BBoys and the music. I specifically pointed to them as part of the Afram street culture (along with the music, the verbal-oral traditions, the style of dress etc..) and street knowledge that HipHop would emerge out of. The article I posted even specified how Afram 5% slang, became HipHop slang

Dude, they existed before that and their influence was already felt by the first gen of HipHop. That's why I posted the part about Herc getting saved by 5%'s in school and him later hanging out with them, absorbing their slang/teachings. That's why you had DJs in the 1970s with names like

OK this is where I think our wires are getting crossed.


My dude....Every response I have been saying in regards to the 5% is based on the video u posted in post #260. Because unlike the posters who just dap you up, I actually watch the videos and read the articles. First let me just say that you referring to the 5% slang as "AFRAM street culture" is a lil off when specifying the early 70's because it was really more "NYC slang"......that slang wasn't all over America like that in the early 70's. And you even posted videos on "verbal-oral traditions" which specified how "AFRAM slang and lingo" (not secluded to just NYC) spread across the country.

Now in regards to you posting that video and saying that the origins of Hip Hops "street knowledge" used 5% influence......that's where our wires are crossed at. Because I'm referring to the influence that we could see based on the slang and what was social and that didn't happen till the mid/late 80's. Doesn't matter if a DJ named himself Divine in the mid 70's I'm talking about what was visually popular to everyone on the outside. You say it happened prior but in the early 80's the popular images related to Hip Hop was break dancers not 5%ers standing in a cypher. The Furious 5, the Treacherous 3, Curtis Blow, Run DMC, LL Cool J, Doug E Fresh, Fat Boys. Their images was rapping with DJ scratches behind them not Black Men wearing Kufis and brothers in a circle reciting lessons regardless of that happening in the streets......Thats why I brought up how the influence wasn't there till mid/late 80's and me physically getting the lessons in 1994 because that involves 'street knowledge' that was passed by the actual music and rapper visuals from the likes of Rakim, Kane, Ice Cube, Brand Nubians and others.

You are the one who brought up "street knowledge" and used that 5% video and I'm saying that it doesn't count because the 5% teaching in Hip Hop itself created influence to where people wanted to actually join the 5%'ers and that didn't happen in Hip Hop till the mid/late 80's. Prior to that it was more a street thing then a Hip Hop thing. But......I get what you are trying to say, using it as an example of a precursor to Hip Hops origin influence when you said "AFRAM street culture." Hopefully you understand what I'm trying to say.



One more thing......U say the article didn't say Herc was the SINGLE starting point of HipHop and was more a "reference point"....But that article is only using Herc and you didn't post anyone related to Hip Hop prior to Herc with the same bio. I caught that.

That was just one example of how general AFRAM street culture was the FOUNDATIION for/to what became HipHop/people that were involved in HipHop

ALL of it was AFRAM culture, unless you think NOI came from elsewhere

Dude.......I said I give you that. You posted the 5% video by itself and now you are specifying u just used it as an example after u followed up with the NOI video and it's all AFRAM culture. Got it. We good on that.

 

[kingofnyc]

Question for all you outsider non-New York, online pseudo-Hip Hop historians trying to rewrite 50-year old history. If Herc isn’t the founder, then WHO is?

I’ll wait.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Mario was there, but he was known more for disco, not breaks and Hip Hop.

We talked about him earlier in the thread. @kingofnyc

Caz speaks on Mario a lot. Mario was the disco party guy. And like Caz always says, Mario also started getting into Hip Hop after Herc did.

 

[kingofnyc]

Mario was there, but he was known more for disco, not breaks and Hip Hop.

We talked about him earlier in the thread. @kingofnyc

Caz speaks on Mario a lot. Mario was the disco party guy. And like Caz always says, Mario also started getting into Hip Hop after Herc did.

honestly speaking, I didn’t even read this thread when it popped up and I read the first several post. I immediately got turned off by the amount of Lord Jamar slander and just turned off my phone so I guess I’ll have to read this entire thread

with that said, I have a lot of love for Caz, but he really is not the person to speak about Mario because Caz is originally from the South Bronx and Mario is from the East Bronx and one of the major misconceptions about hip-hop culture and all is the South Bronx is where it all started …. when in reality the South Bx got hip-hop last outta the 4 parts

 

[Awesome Wells]

honestly speaking, I didn’t even read this thread when it popped up and I read the first several post. I immediately got turned off by the amount of Lord Jamar slander and just turned off my phone so I guess I’ll have to read this entire thread

with that said, I have a lot of love for Caz, but he really is not the person to speak about Mario because Caz is originally from the South Bronx and Mario is from the East Bronx and one of the major misconceptions about hip-hop culture and all is the South Bronx is where it all started …. when in reality the South Bx got hip-hop last outta the 4 parts

Caz grew up watching Herc, in person.

But all of the founders say the same sh*t about Herc. The only people saying otherwise today, are either white journalists or weirdos online. But all of the people who were actually there, like Flash and Red Alert and others, even next generation dudes like KRS, Nas and Brother J, all credit Herc. So it's weird when outsiders try to come back 5 decades later and rewrite something that's carved in stone. People don’t respect the legends. And it's always the ones who didn't even grow up in this.

 

[kingofnyc]

Caz grew up watching Herc, in person.

But all of the founders say the same sh*t about Herc. The only people saying otherwise today, are either white journalists or weirdos online. But all of the people who were actually there, like Flash and Red Alert and others, even next generation dudes like KRS, Nas and Brother J, all credit Herc. So it's weird when outsiders try to come back 5 decades later and rewrite something that's carved in stone. People don’t respect the legends. And it's always the ones who didn't even grow up in this.

you literally have a YouTube channel going back 1213 years totally debunking the Kool Herc story
That’s matter of fact, the first hip-hop person to ever win a Grammy … grandmixer DXT has stated that Mario and Smokey are 1st generation while Herc , Bam , Flash , Barren & Breakout are 2nd generation