Making sense of the 4th of July: Fredrick Douglas vs Martin Delany views (short video)

[valet]

How should Black people view this country and issues like the 4th?

 

[Buddy]

Martin Delaney doesn't get anywhere NEAR enough praise. Rep off the GP of even mentioning him

The Triple OG breh deserves a biopic

 

[KingsOfKings]

Rep

 

[Still Benefited]

Its just another day,celebrate it or dont. What does it change either way? Supporting white supremacy every other day by going to work. Celebrate if you got a day off

 

[invalid]

Good thread topic. And thanks for posting the guy in the OP. It's good to know black men are having these types of conversations on social media.

I agree with Garrison on this.

- Garrison thought the Constitution was inherently flawed which differed from Douglas.
- He also viewed black people as the cornerstone of American society who didn't need to relocate to Africa which differed from Delaney.

His solution was to tear shyt down and build it back up.

This is a whole other discussion altogether. The Constitution should have been redone at the Emancipation, because the Constitution in it's original state did nothing to free and protect the rights of black slaves in 1776. Didn't even recognize them as citizens. The Constitution should have been redone making central the rights of black people as full citizens and benefits afforded to them as such. Many prominent people actually advocated for this such as John Brown and William Lloyd Garrison, who thought problems would arise if we kept the original Constitution while layering on amendments because it puts a bandage on an infection. They were dismissed as radicals but they were right which is why it took a whole century for the Civil Rights Act to come about, and even then, we're still fighting for basic liberties afforded to everyone else.

Part of a tribute Garrison made to John Brown -

I tell you our work is the dissolution of this slavery-cursed Union, if we would have a fragment of our liberties left to us! Surely between freemen, who believe in exact justice and impartial liberty, and slaveholders, who are for cleaning down all human rights at a blow, it is not possible there should be any Union whatever. “How can two walk together except they be agreed?”

The slaveholder with his hands dripping in blood–will I make a compact with him? The man who plunders cradles–will I say to him, “Brother, let us walk together in unity?” The man who, to gratify his lust or his anger, scourges woman with the lash till the soil is red with her blood–will I say to him: “Give me your hand; let us form a glorious Union?” No, never–never! There can be no union between us: “What concord hath Christ with Belial?” What union has freedom with slavery? Let us tell the inexorable and remorseless tyrants of the South that their conditions hitherto imposed upon us, whereby we are morally responsible for the existence of slavery, are horribly inhuman and wicked, and we cannot carry them out for the sake of their evil company.

By the dissolution of the Union we shall give the finishing blow to the slave system; and then God will make it possible for us to form a true, vital, enduring, all-embracing Union, from the Atlantic to the Pacific–one God to be worshipped, one Saviour to be revered, one policy to be carried out–freedom everywhere to all the people, without regard to complexion or race–and the blessing of God resting upon us all! I want to see that glorious day!

But I believe there is space for both Garrison and Delaney's ideas.

I think there is room for both ideas, foundationalism and Pan-Africanism, to coexist.

I don't believe that we will achieve the true power that we should have in the US unless we have a strong West African nation behind us advocating and putting pressure on the US to do right by us from the outside while we are simultaneously applying pressure from the inside.

As an ADOS or FBA, however we want to term ourselves, we do need to build up what we have here. And we should not look to a collective "resettling" in Africa to solve our problems. But we also need 'explorers' who want to explore, to get out of America, acquire resources, build relationships, and forge alliances, that we can leverage back home. That is what I see as Pan-Africanism. It's not us leaving the US for brighter pastures. It's us leaving to acquire resources and key relationship that we can leverage for our fight back here.

England did it. Spain did it. France did it. All through the mechanism of colonialism. Pan-Africansim is our answer to that. Going out to acquire resources that you don't have at home, history has shown us, is the only way that a group can build up true power.

Of course, it has to be a reciprocal relationship. West African nations advocating for us will encourage us to advocate for West Africa in the halls of Congress in the same way Jews advocate for Israel and how the nation of Israel backs them.

Tariq conceded that most people in the Diaspora and on the Continent are not on any c00n type of time, it's only some of the ones the white supremacists system allows to come in.

The sister made a good point, the white supremacists owned media has caused discord amongst black groups. But the reason why Pan-Africanism worked (which Tariq conceded as well) prior to the 1960's is because we had events and conventions that brought all of these black groups together to be in relationship with each other. And we need to return to that because that's how we build trust with each other and combat any false and negative media portrayals that are causing discord.

As a sidenote, my 4th great grandfather was an abolitionist from Chatham, Ontario who worked with Delaney when he arrived there before the Civil War.

 

[bnew]

https://mastodon.social/@Deglassco/110657881013620059

https://archive.is/tnLDu

 

[GoAggieGo.]

That was a good listen.

He said something in that video to the tune of, “it’s ok to love America, and hate its history”. I tend to lean this way. Black American history is apart of American history, so I celebrate the day. When I say celebrate, I mean I grill, hang with fam and friends, and will acknowledge that I’m blessed to be where I’m at.

 

[Wildhundreds]

The problem isn't with the constitution, but its writers. Just like the bible would somewhat be a ok book if the presenters of the doctrine wasn't hypocrites.