Massive Unemployment Incoming

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People don't realize how close we are to a future where we don't have to drive. The technology is already here, they just need the regulations (*cough* lobbyists *cough*) to make it a reality.

I work on a government campus with 30+ buildings and in 2020 were gonna replace the 4 shuttle bus drivers with automated buses

I know this is going to happen one day, But Automobiles are deeply ingrained in American culture. Sure its one thing for people to kill others in accidents. But holy shyt what happens if a A.I. controlled vehicle causes a large scale accident. Ideally if Cars/Trucks are automated then ALL Cars/Trucks should be automated? If I'm a passenger in an automated vehicle do I really want actual drivers behind the wheel? It really is interesting to see how this plays out. Although it would be HORRIBLE anyone in the trucking industry.
 

Kyle C. Barker

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I know this is going to happen one day, But Automobiles are deeply ingrained in American culture. Sure its one thing for people to kill others in accidents. But holy shyt what happens if a A.I. controlled vehicle causes a large scale accident. Ideally if Cars/Trucks are automated then ALL Cars/Trucks should be automated? If I'm a passenger in an automated vehicle do I really want actual drivers behind the wheel? It really is interesting to see how this plays out. Although it would be HORRIBLE anyone in the trucking industry.


Oh yeah, autonomous vehicles will pop up in the trucking world first then eventually make way into the car world. Every car manufacturer has been spending money in their R&D to make this happen. That's why uber is scared shytless at the moment because that will mean the end for them as well. They (uber) did buy a company called otto that specializes in this but they're behind in technology. They were doing automated transit for Anheuser-Busch but Anheuser-Busch just ordered some self driving trucks from Tesla.

Speaking of Tesla, they already have self driving cars and I want one. Bad. They have even mentioned offering their car for less if you were willing to lend your car for ride sharing. For example, you could lend your self driving car to an uber like service while you are at work for 8 hours. Hell, once your Tesla car is paid off you could actually make money while you aren't using your car.

Back to what you were saying, yeah there would be a huge paradigm shift with Americans when it comes to automated driving. I'm old and have been driving for 2 decades now and I actually hate driving. I kind of welcome a world where I can kick back and relax (maybe sleep?) while my car drives me to work in dc traffic.
 

hayesc0

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2020 breh


Its only a matter of time people never take me serious when I try to warn people about this stuff in real life its gonna be rip to my job in a few years also because of AI.
 

David_TheMan

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How about 2024?

Thanks to uber technology Annheiser Busch is making autonomous deliveries within the state of Colorado. Even in traffic with humans on the road. Yeah they have a dude sitting in the cabin but according to the reports the human did not assist in the driving (ie he's just there to make sure the shyt doesn't hit the fan).
Thats what I'm talking about, they stll need the people there. In heavy trafffic and bad weather there is still a ways to go before the tech puts humans out for good. Thats all, and its farther than automation people will admit because they are trying to sell a service (nothing wrong with that). Thats all I'm saying.
 

Kyle C. Barker

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Thats what I'm talking about, they stll need the people there. In heavy trafffic and bad weather there is still a ways to go before the tech puts humans out for good. Thats all, and its farther than automation people will admit because they are trying to sell a service (nothing wrong with that). Thats all I'm saying.

Gotcha gotcha. I feel you.
 

David_TheMan

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Thank u man. Quick question, u think it's better to self learn for the A+, Or to enroll in a class?
I think it is easy enough to learn on your own, but people are different.
If you can pick things up better reading it yourself and self studying do that. If you had issues with that method through school checkout a class or look into some videos online that have instructors guiding you through the different modules to learn.


But you are not a classically trained programmer. It's obvious. If the breh needs to understand the foundations of computer science, computability and questions of AI you should be avoided. Unsound and incomplete and lacking introspection. That will go above your head no doubt because of your lack of understanding of the things you are talking about.
I'm not a programmer and I never said I was. I told the breh to go to the 6 cert thread where plenty of actual folks in the field can give him targeted help.
Again you show your ass, because instead of helping the breh and offering advice or a place to get advice, you make uneducated statements directed at me that serve no purpose for you or him.
Now have a good one kid.
 

Francis White

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Its only a matter of time people never take me serious when I try to warn people about this stuff in real life its gonna be rip to my job in a few years also because of AI.
Thanks for warning me. I should have taken you serious because you know everything.
 
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It's funny how top execs and CEO's are cool with robots and other tech avenues that cut out low wage workers.

The problem is that robots will only continue to improve with the growth in Artificial Intelligence. They can compute so many scenarios, alternatives and potential outcomes that you have to ask the question: why do we need CEO's and expensive VP's? A robot could easily do their job and solve problems much quicker and effectively. Instead of getting rid of the fry-cook or the janitor, get rid of your top executives and REALLY save money for the shareholders.
 

null

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I think it is easy enough to learn on your own, but people are different.
If you can pick things up better reading it yourself and self studying do that. If you had issues with that method through school checkout a class or look into some videos online that have instructors guiding you through the different modules to learn.

I'm not a programmer and I never said I was. I told the breh to go to the 6 cert thread where plenty of actual folks in the field can give him targeted help.
Again you show your ass, because instead of helping the breh and offering advice or a place to get advice, you make uneducated statements directed at me that serve no purpose for you or him.
Now have a good one kid.

Unsound and incomplete and lacking introspection ..

Soundness and Completeness
(lack of) is a conclusion of Gödel's incompleteness theorems - Wikipedia.

And so what you may ask..

This was an adjunct to the Turing Proof of the Halting problem which showed the limits of our von Neumann based computation namely that problems cannot fully understand other programs. In the case of the proof itself Turing fed a Turing Machine to another Turning Machine - i.e recursion. This is proof that Turing Equivalent languages are fundamentally not able to introspect. In practical terms this means that Turing Equivalent machines are unable to understand (and hence write) general purpose programs.

These two results both show the incompleteness of formal systems and are essential parts of any discussion about AI (weak/strong), the limits of them and the scope, rate of advancement.

The fact that this did (as predicted) go above your head (once again) demonstrates that you lack the foundation for a discussion like this. Your posts make sense to you because of your limitations not because they are correct.

You give me 'you showed your a$$' and I give you 'your inability to recognize a cornerstone result of the topic that we are discussing'.

Without a formal framework you lack the tools (predicate, prepositional logic, mathematical training in inductive, deductive reasoning and proof forms such as induction, contradiction) to reason about effects by way of formal argument.

It just goes over your head. :scust:



I hope I don't have to go into more detail about what this result means.
 

---

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Not misinformed at all.
I literally talk about jobs that will come about to create the programs, to write code, and to create the automation and maintain it and you respond talking about the loss of low skilled jobs that I said would get replaced.

Again try a bit better to read what is written.

Did you read what I wrote, how are you creating jobs when there is a net loss in jobs.

Your talking about what if scenarios. Algos are replacing jobs right now.

Already wrote this. So I'll rehash it again my industry has been decimated. The financial products and financial services industry has been decimated. No new jobs created, no new skills were needed to make the algos. Now there is a bunch of highly skilled people hanging onto their careers.

Another caveat everyone's job has parts that can be automated; the end equation doesn't have to be total job losses. It just has equated to a lower standard of living once salaries have been adjusted for automated sections of your job.

Since its Chinese new year and I should be relaxing and I don't feel like writing again, I'll answer your retort here. The old economy model you're referring to sites creative destruction as an equilibrium where you lose and gain jobs based on the development of new technology or better know as creative destruction.

The problem with the old model is it uses past examples and past slopes or rate of change to make that assumption that there is an equilibrium in displacement. The old model was right for every job lost there was a new job waiting in the wind.
6165571_14733738716506_rId16.png

There is no equilibrium in the new model only structural unemployment. Hence why UBI is being tested and proposed as a serious alternative to the outdated model.
 
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null

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It's funny how top execs and CEO's are cool with robots and other tech avenues that cut out low wage workers.

The problem is that robots will only continue to improve with the growth in Artificial Intelligence. They can compute so many scenarios, alternatives and potential outcomes that you have to ask the question: why do we need CEO's and expensive VP's? A robot could easily do their job and solve problems much quicker and effectively. Instead of getting rid of the fry-cook or the janitor, get rid of your top executives and REALLY save money for the shareholders.

As in this film @ 37m in... "That's why we employ scientists"

 

David_TheMan

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Did you read what I wrote, how are you creating jobs when there is a net loss in jobs.

Your talking about what if scenarios. Algos are replacing jobs right now.

Already wrote this. So I'll rehash it again my industry has been decimated. The financial products and financial services industry has been decimated. No new jobs created, no new skills were needed to make the algos. Now there is a bunch of highly skilled people hanging onto their careers.

Another caveat everyone's job has parts that can be automated; the end equation doesn't have to be total job losses. It just has equated to a lower standard of living once salaries have been adjusted for automated sections of your job.

Since its Chinese new year and I should be relaxing and I don't feel like writing again, I'll answer your retort here. The old economy model you're referring to sites creative destruction as an equilibrium where you lose and gain jobs based on the development of new technology or better know as creative destruction.

The problem with the old model is it uses past examples and past slopes or rate of change to make that assumption that there is an equilibrium in displacement. The old model was right for every job lost there was a new job waiting in the wind.
6165571_14733738716506_rId16.png

There is no equilibrium in the new model only structural unemployment. Hence why UBI is being tested and proposed as a serious alternative to the outdated model.

I read what you wrote, but I responded to a reply you made towards my posting.
Its clear I disagree with your argument as well.

Actually you are talking about a what if, I'm talking about what has historically happened when humans have dealt with automation.

You are in the finance industry, I appreciate personal anecdotes but I don't put much stock in them when talking about an industry as a whole.

Projections overview and highlights, 2016–26 : Monthly Labor Review: U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
Finance industry from 2006 to 2016 lost 0.1% of workforce, hardly decimation, and is projected to grow by .6% by the time it gets to 2026

I don't really care what you do to relax, this isn't a big deal or stressor for me, if it is for you I don't know why it is, it isn't that serious.

Your chart is a terrible benchmark of technical progress by the way. LOL. No automated looms, no cotton gin, or mechanized agricultural machinary listed. Then listing youtube and ipads. LOL.

That said I've asked and not once has any actual evidence been presented to support the contention that "this time its different". The arguments are the same though, and they've been repeatedly debunked historically.
 
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