Nvr lost a G7(10 of them), nvr missed playoffs. 11 rings 2 NCAA titles 1 Gold 5 MVPs

[dantheman9758]

Let's talk about Bill Russell for a moment... William Felton Russell made it to the NBA Finals every single season of his career except once, where he "only" made it 1 round away (to the ECF) to be vanquished by a prime Wilt-"most dominant force ever" -Chamberlain and his record breaking 76ers squad which is one of the greatest squads in NBA history. The only NBA Finals he ever lost, he was injured and on the DNP list. In just 14 years he achieved 11 rings. 2 NCAA titles. 5 MVP's and an Olympic Gold. He anchored every single squad as the best player on his team. He NEVER lost a game 7, and he was in 10 of them... the only MVP's not awarded to him during his career went to Wilt Chamberlain, Bob Pettit or Oscar Robertson. His final two rings he earned on the court when he doubled his duties as both starting center AND HEAD COACH. Even beyond his NBA Accolades, he won 2 NCAA titles with the San Francisco Dons, a team that never made it big in NCAA basketball BEFORE or SINCE Bill played. He won FIFTY FIVE straight games with that squad, and before he was pigeon holed by Red Aurbach into a "defensive/rebounding specialist" for the Celtics his offensive numbers on that squad were 22ppg on 52%. There isn't a single "choking" or "failed to ____" blemish in his entire basketball career. The guy was quite literally almost invincible as the last-man-standing during any season or tournament he ever competed in.

Let that sink in to the Lebron stans, Kobe stans and Jordan stans out there that have a bad habit of fixating on just those 3 in "GOAT" discussions. I'm not talking about the typical fans of those players that have some history sense I'm talking about the stans, the ones who insist their man is, or will be the "undisputed GOAT" and then proceed to dump a resume riddled with holes in terms of failing to even make it to the Finals let alone winning them. Every single other super star player including those 3 guys in NBA history have LOST more seasons than they won - except for Bill Russell. Isn't winning the ultimate goal in basketball? And isn't it that if you win as the best player on your team, and you win as often as Bill Russell, you basically are THE measuring stick for basketball greatness?... Aren't "scoring titles" and all those little accolades basically trivial or even pointless in light of the ultimate goal of the game? At times Jordan and Lebron couldn't even crack a winning record or make it out of the first round - yet Bill Russell sonned Wilt Chamberlain over and over at a time when he played him 142 times during his 13 season pro career. For the record, Kobe has only faced off against greats like Tim Duncan, Lebron James, and Michael Jordan a COMBINED 74 times in his 16 season career. Basically half that amount.

The meat and potatoes of this guys resume literally son's the sh*t outta everyone who's ever played. The ultimate goal in basketball is to win, period. Half the "awards" people boast about that Jordan/Lebron/Kobe earned DIDN'T EVEN EXIST in Russell's time. Bill Russell just won, - as the best man on the floor, the only way he knew how - period. His defensive and cerebral impact on the game was so substantial it didn't even matter how many points he had on a stat sheet - he made personal points scored and numbers not matter. Today's NBA Finals award bears his name. Nobody else can even win a title anymore without Russell looming over their shoulder with HIS name inscribed on the trophy. Most of these cats ultimate goal is getting "a" ring (singular).... So even their ultimate goal is nothing but a fraction of what he accomplished.

Here's a glimpse at how profound his defense was:
Celtic DRtg
1957 - 6/8 (+1.5) <---- No Russell
1958 - 1/8 (-5.2)
1959 - 1/8 (-5.8)
1960 - 1/8 (-6.2)
1961 - 1/8 (-8.2)
1962 - 1/8 (-8.7)
1963 - 1/9 (-9.1)
1964 - 1/9 (-11.5)
1965 - 1/9 (-9.9)
1966 - 1/9 (-7.1)
1967 - 1/10 (-4.9)
1968 - 2/12 (-4.6)
1969 - 1/14 (-6.8)
1970 - 7/16 (+0.6) <---- No Russell

And his HOF Celtic teammates that handled much of the scoring? Yah, for 3 seasons of his career the Celtics were actually the WORST offensive team in the league... He still won a title all 3 of those seasons - the only teams to have ever done that in NBA history. The Celtics were a consistently unimpressive, to flat out terrible offensive squad, yet they still DOMINATED strictly because of the presence of Bill Russell anchoring defense:

Russell's Celtic team's ORtgs:
1957 – 87.2 (5th of 8)
1958 – 85.5 (7th of 8)
1959 – 88.3 (5th of 8)
1960 – 90.2 (5th of 8)
1961 – 87.5 (8th of 8)
1962 – 91.6 (7th of 9)
1963 – 92.6 (9th of 9)
1964 – 89.3 (9th of 9)
1965 - 92.9 (7th of 9)
1966 – 91.7 (8th of 9)
1967 – 97.7 (4th of 10)
1968 – 95.8 (8th of 12)
1969 – 93.2 (9th of 12)


Just listen to the man talk:


Got to be one of the most cerebral, and all too often misunderstood players of all time. He's not a player with flashy moves, nor was he a player with gawdy offensive stats. He just dominated in any way possible to get his team a win. Period. Bill Russell is the ultimate measuring stick for basketball greatness.

 

[mastermind]

dropped a gem on em

 

[Da_Eggman]

6 ft 9 215 pound center that ruled in a ten team league vs lesser talent while playing with 6 other hall of famers and a hall of fame coach

 

[jadillac]

this is why the GOAT discussion is silly.

Kareem is the all time scoring leader(and that'l probably NEVER be broken), 3rd in blocks all time and 2 in blocks all-time, or something like that. Multiple rings, 19 or 20x All-Star, possibly the greatest NCAA player ever....

What else does he need to do be considered the GOAT?

 

[dantheman9758]

6 ft 9 215 pound center that ruled in a ten team league vs lesser talent while playing with 6 other hall of famers and a hall of fame coach

6-9.63 and (6-9 and 5/8ths) without shoes on
7-4 wingspan
215lbs (rookie) 240lbs max w/o ever lifting weights
10.5 inch hand length wrist to the middle finger.

Prior to lifting weights:
Anthony Davis: 222lbs, 6-9.25 w/o shoes
Tyson Chandler: 224lbs, 6-11.5 w/o shoes 7-3 wingspan
Joakim Noah: 223lbs, 6-10.5 w/o shoes, 7-1.25" wingspan
David "The Admiral" Robinson: 226lbs, 7-0 w/o shoes
Kevin Garnett: 217lbs, 6-11 w/o shoes

And he played this behemoth 142 times in his career:
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bU43dTuMuig[/ame]

 

[dantheman9758]

this is why the GOAT discussion is silly.

Kareem is the all time scoring leader(and that'l probably NEVER be broken), 3rd in blocks all time and 2 in blocks all-time, or something like that. Multiple rings, 19 or 20x All-Star, possibly the greatest NCAA player ever....

What else does he need to do be considered the GOAT?

He's a GOAT candidate too. But his resume doesn't supercede Russell's. And he wouldn't be 2nd in blocks all time had they counted Bill or Wilt's, or perhaps even all of Nate Thurmond's blocked shots. He has less than half as many titles as Bill Russell, and less than 3% of the records Wilt Chamberlain has. Bill Russell was no less potent than Lew Alcindor in the NCAA. IMO there will also always be a convincing argument for Wilt who is on the extreme end of the "individual dominance" spectrum, Russell who is on the extreme end of the "dominant winner" spectrum, and of course Kareem or any of the other GOAT candidates who basically sit in between Russell and Wilt in terms of how they built up their resumes (their combination of titles and statistical accolades). Whoever someone asserts is their "GOAT" usually just plays favorites as to what accomplishments they deem to be the most important. And FWIW Kareem was never even close to the rebounder or defender Bill Russell was. My flavor of the month right now, is Bill Russell. The undisputable greatest winner in basketball history.

 

[PortCityProphet]

i didn't know he was so athletic and could run point Dan stay droppin knowledge

 

[Goat poster]

Dantheman is the most quality poster on this site.


All he does is come through and drop gems.

 

[Goat poster]

And big men will never be in the discussion for GOAT because people fall in love with and relate more to perimeter players.Thats why big men don't sell shoes.

I guess they have their own category



That being said NOBODY has a resume that fukks with Bill Russell's .

The finals MVP is named after him for crying out loud.

 

[King Poetic]

6 ft 9 215 pound center that ruled in a ten team league vs lesser talent while playing with 6 other hall of famers and a hall of fame coach

Just Like a 6'8 250lb forward that's considered the best player at the time who couldn't win on his own against lesser talent in the easteren conference and had to skip town and join 2 other all-stars to get a championship

 

[pez]

Yea, no one's going to argue against those facts. You got it.

I love that video of Barkley telling that story of Bill saying he's going to make Cousy the best point guard in the NBA.

Makes you wonder... Were these Hall of Famers around Bill really great or were they made great by Bill? Red Auerbach never won without Bill. But Bill has won several times without Red. WOAH

 

[Goatpoacher]

Bill Russell has always been a humble dude who's supported his peers and younger generations. You never saw him being a bytch like Wilt. He even regularly gives Wilt props.

He'd be a better version of Zo in today, so people need to knock off that "but he played in a weak era" bull shyt.

 

[FAH1223]

"I'll never distort your offense or your defense"

 

[Da_Eggman]

Just Like a 6'8 250lb forward that's considered the best player at the time who couldn't win on his own against lesser talent in the easteren conference and had to skip town and join 2 other all-stars to get a championship

difference is he didn't play with 6 other hall of famers in a ten team league with a hall of fame coach vs 6 ft white boys

 

[Da_Eggman]

Bill Russell has always been a humble dude who's supported his peers and younger generations. You never saw him being a bytch like Wilt. He even regularly gives Wilt props.

He'd be a better version of Zo in today, so people need to knock off that "but he played in a weak era" bull shyt.

he didn't have even close to an offensive game as Zo thou