Obama says Democrats should make sure Ocasio-Cortez has a platform

[Smoking With Cigarettes]

Obama again talking out of both sides of his mouth. Denounce Defund the Police while at the same time exulting AOC.

In fuller context I think Obama said he agrees with the sentiment of Defund the Police but doesn't like the slogan. I think getting caught up on the slogan is stupid because if the slogan "More Empathetic Policing" or anything as tame as that it'd get shytted on just the same. Debating the slogan and not the policy is the public perception of Democrats, whether its true or not

Got no evidence to support this but my gut feeling is Defund The Police will go through the same trial by fire Black Lives Matter did. People called BLM a fukking terrorist group in the Obama era and now its almost a social taboo to be anti BLM. The key to enacting change is to actually do it but Dem leadership is so focus group oriented that it freezes them from doing anything that would cause backlash. Which of course fuels the "both sides are the same" arguments, which are mostly done in bad faith but people have legitimate gripes and frustrations about how the Dems wield power

As far as Obama goes, I think he wants AOC to be more like a politician and smooth talk all the policies to try and drum up maximum public support. I get it but the appeal for many of an AOC is her to the point style and overall bluntness. I think as the years go on she may fine tune her approach but I don't believe it'll be too different from how she is now. She has the advantage of being right on the fact that many issues our government ignores currently will be dire to American lives in the future. She just needs to continue reminding people how this country could be and keep needling rethugs with the blame for our current state of affairs

 

[hashmander]

you have to be pretending to be stupid to act like Obama didn't have any role to play in unifying the Party around Biden once Biden showed he still had life after SC.

Looking for Obama's hidden hand in candidates coalescing around Biden

It would be insane for him not to do so. He's the leader of the party, of course he had a preference.

so he's playing kingmaker for the president-elect while being so toxic he should go home and never wade into politics again?

 

[NkrumahWasRight Is Wrong]

Sure, but what prompted this debate was Obama's post-term statements, the majority of which have been throwing water on the youth/progressive movement. He didn't have to make all these anti-progressive statements and actions after he left office. If he had left and then came out at least signalling he was on the side of progressives to "finish the job he started" or something like that, I don't think he'd be getting told to shut the hell up by activists, liberal media figures and freshman Democratic congresspeople. But this wing doesn't have patience for this guy who fukked up pretty badly and often, leaving us with this mess, and then turns around to scold progressives. I just don't see many people in this wing looking back at Obama longingly, whereas Bill got the revered treatment for quite some time after his term.







Well, his policies did play a large part in leading to President Trump, so...



I'm not saying Obama was a worse President than Bill Clinton, I'm just saying he's getting comeuppance faster. It's probably due to social and decentralized media allowing the left to have a stronger voice than in the early-aughts. People aren't in awe of the powerful and the elite as much anymore.

His post-term statements have no bearing on his two term administration. Is Jimmy Carter seen as a good president because of how fantastic he has been since he left office? No.

So then what are you writing? You are right about the slogans swaying people--which is ironic because Obama decided to criticize young activists for it despite giving us ambiguous shyt like "Hope" and "change," and "yes we can"--but Obama didn't run as a progressive and was not a progressive president. Progressives were calling out his bullshyt when he was President. I remember a lot of black people saying, "say bruh, are you gonna do anything for black people?" and the Clyburns of the world saying, "he isn't the president of black people, but of all people."

Those presidencies aren't aging well because they didn't do anything for real people. Obama's presidency brought us Trump due to white backlash and Obama's genuine inaction for regular people after the 2008 financial collapse. And again, he came in with a supermajority in the House and Senate, yet decided to listen to buffoons like Rahm Emmannuel.

I am saying that everyone besides the mega-wealthy end up disappointed in presidents after being sold dreams. Which was the last administration that didnt age poorly to their constituents? Reagan?

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

you have to be pretending to be stupid to act like Obama didn't have any role to play in unifying the Party around Biden once Biden showed he still had life after SC.

Looking for Obama's hidden hand in candidates coalescing around Biden

It would be insane for him not to do so. He's the leader of the party, of course he had a preference.

People voted. And?

 

[NkrumahWasRight Is Wrong]

People think don’t ask don’t tell, was homophobic today when in reality in the 90s it was arguably one of the most progressive social things the government had done in decades

Wouldnt be surprised if some progressives think FDR didnt go far enough

 

[NkrumahWasRight Is Wrong]

I know right. Social media is not reality.

perception is reality..so to some, it is.

 

[hashmander]

Wouldnt be surprised if some progressives think FDR didnt go far enough

he rightfully gets smoke (from black people) for excluding black people from social security, not supporting anti-lynching laws, etc. but it's never criticism in the sense that people use to say FDR is bushed now.

 

[King Kreole]

ALL LIES.

Need I continue?

 

[King Kreole]

so he's playing kingmaker for the president-elect while being so toxic he should go home and never wade into politics again?

Obama's electoral legacy is keeping the head pristine while the body rots. So yes, if the Democrats want to build a healthy, holistic party that no longer has to go to the mat every time against a minoritarian death cult, they would be wise to start building an apparatus that doesn't rely on Obama. He's a good brand spokesman but his political instincts are ass.

 

[King Kreole]

His post-term statements have no bearing on his two term administration. Is Jimmy Carter seen as a good president because of how fantastic he has been since he left office? No.

His post-term statements are what's driving this discussion. If anything, his two terms were worse than the statements he's coming out with now. I think a lot of progressives were willing to give him a chance post-presidency under the assumption that he tried his best but was hemmed in by the structural constraints of the political environment, and the fact he's being succeeded by Donald Trump would knock some sense into him, but it turns out no, he's still making dumbass statements and exhibiting milquetoast centrist tendencies. Obama is who he is. There's not some secret progressive hiding under his both-sidesing of predatory police harassment and brutality of black people, or his enduring faith in the elites of the financial sector, or his "Only in America is my story possible!" schtick. He actually believes this shyt.

 

[mastermind]

I am saying that everyone besides the mega-wealthy end up disappointed in presidents after being sold dreams. Which was the last administration that didnt age poorly to their constituents? Reagan?

So you're saying accept it like a bytch?

Wouldnt be surprised if some progressives think FDR didnt go far enough

TBF, he didn't. Most of the New Deal legislation didn't include black people.

 

[Althalucian]

Need I continue?

Obama's electoral legacy is keeping the head pristine while the body rots. So yes, if the Democrats want to build a healthy, holistic party that no longer has to go to the mat every time against a minoritarian death cult, they would be wise to start building an apparatus that doesn't rely on Obama. He's a good brand spokesman but his political instincts are ass.

His political instincts are great for himself. It's just that the country sucks, and he wants to conform to an image of himself and that shytty country. In your example, is the body the Democratic party or America?

Criticizing Obama the way they're doing it is like philosophers doing metaphysics: intellectual masturbation. I get it - Obama was president of a war hungry, a$$hole, capitalist, ruthless, libertarian, conservative, racist, Christian country. But people often assign him too much power and responsibility when the real culprits are congress, state legislators, and governors (or should I say the real culprits are the American people at large for electing them?). They can constitutionally change the country and give the president/the executive branch the middle finger. Are people just too shallow and can only consider one person as the cause of all bad things in this country? No wonder so many people love monotheistic religions. Simplifies all matters into one I guess.

 

[King Kreole]

His political instincts are great for himself. It's just that the country sucks, and he wants to conform to an image of himself and that shytty country. In your example, is the body the Democratic party or America?

Yes, the body is the Democratic Party in my analogy, suffering incredible losses under his time as President. I'm not even sure if his political instincts are that great for himself, I'm reading his book and realizing he had to be pushed into some of the iconic Obamaisms. He's a skilled politician, but he inherited a pretty plum situation for him to win, having an identity that represented diversity and change in a time where the country was amenable to that. He's an above-average politician but I don't think he exhibited some god-tier skill.

But I totally agree, the country does suck.

Criticizing Obama the way they're doing it is like philosophers doing metaphysics: intellectual masturbation. I get it - Obama was president of a war hungry, a$$hole, capitalist, ruthless, libertarian, conservative, racist, Christian country. But people often assign him too much power and responsibility when the real culprits are congress, state legislators, and governors (or should I say the real culprits are the American people at large for electing them?). They can constitutionally change the country and give the president/the executive branch the middle finger. Are people just too shallow and can only consider one person as the cause of all bad things in this country? No wonder so many people love monotheistic religions. Simplifies all matters into one I guess.

I don't think it's masturbatory, I think it's looking at the actions and the consequences of the most powerful person in the world. Obama as a private citizen seems like a nice enough dude, seems like he loves his family and friends. But he was also the head of the most powerful bureaucracy on the planet with immense power at his fingertips, and made actual decisions that I view as mistakes. I very much agree that most people treat the President like an omniscient King who has total power to change the nation to their whims, but I don't think the corrective to that is to absolve them of the consequences of the actions actually under their control. Like, my problem with Obama isn't that he didn't end racism in America, it's that HAMP was designed to fukk over homeowners so the runways could be foamed for the Banks. My problem with Obama isn't that he didn't snap his fingers and close the wealth gap, it's that his DoJ balked at charging the criminals who destroyed the economy. Government is a chess board, and while the President is but one piece, they are the most powerful piece. I agree with the overall thrust of your comments though, critiques of individual actors should usually be accompanied by systemic critiques. That doesn't save Obama from History's judgment though.

 

[NkrumahWasRight Is Wrong]

So you're saying accept it like a bytch?


TBF, he didn't. Most of the New Deal legislation didn't include black people.

I have no hope

 

[NZA]

i wish barry would just go away. dude has nothing of substance to offer and he damages his own legacy the more he invites people to inspect it.