Official War With Iran Thread

[CrimsonTider]

Why the hell not? Is the military here to serve us or are we here to serve the military?

What kind of incentive structure are we creating where a mad king can start a stupid war without consulting with Congress or trying to persuade the American people, and then have the stones to ask for funding?

Trump was elected, in part, because of the idiocy that let to the Iraq war. Why would we repeat that on an even stupider scale?

Y’all boys not trying to gain and retain power

 

[MAKAVELI25]

Y’all boys not trying to gain and retain power

What type of power are you talking about gaining here?

 

[88m3]

Iran will be stopped. They keep attacking countries they're not at war with and civilian targets.

They've now attacked Azerbaijan and Kurdistan. War Crimes.

 

[Outlaw]

Is what I’m saying about Zionism still just a conspiracy?

@Pull Up the Roots @wire28 @Loose

 

[Apollo Kid]

 

[Pull Up the Roots]

Is what I’m saying about Zionism still just a conspiracy?

@Pull Up the Roots @wire28 @Loose

Don't tag me with this bullshyt.

 

[Outlaw]

Don't tag me with this bullshyt.

You think Masse is lying?

 

[MAKAVELI25]

Is what I’m saying about Zionism still just a conspiracy?

@Pull Up the Roots @wire28 @Loose

You're removing too much agency from the US, who is the more powerful power with far more leverage. US Presidents have consistently not only resisted Israel's influence (especially Republican Presidents), but they have also directed Israel's actions.

Reagan, Eisenhower, and HW Bush were effectively able to give Israel ultimatums. Obama pushed the Iran Deal against the wishes of Israel, and Trump was able to force Netanyahu in to two ceasefires.

I'm not denying Israel influences the US's foreign policy, but so do many other states. The UAE's lobbying power in the US, for example, is very underdiscussed.

Israel should not receive full blame for the actions of a more powerful country on which it is reliant, the idiot President and his moron cabinet deserve most of the blame for what is going on here.

 

[Outlaw]

You're removing too much agency from the US, who is the more powerful power with far more leverage. US Presidents have consistently not only resisted Israel's influence (especially Republican Presidents), but they have also directed Israel's actions.

Reagan, Eisenhower, and HW Bush were effectively able to give Israel ultimatums. Obama pushed the Iran Deal against the wishes of Israel, and Trump was able to force Netanyahu in to two ceasefires.

I'm not denying Israel influences the US's foreign policy, but so do many other states. The UAE's lobbying power in the US, for example, is very underdiscussed.

Israel should not receive full blame for the actions of a more powerful country on which it is reliant, the idiot President and his moron cabinet deserve most of the blame for what is going on here.

I agree America is more powerful on paper but which makes the asymmetrical relationship we have towards the Zionist state so obvious.

So many of our politicans are Israel first, there aren’t any prominent officials in Israeli government that is America first.


For example Chuck Schumer said his number one job is too make sure democrats continue to support the Zionist state.

The inverse of that is never said in Israel.

Eisenhower was President before the Zionist really took hold in our government.

There was an attempt on Reagan’s life.

JFK got popped after standing up to the Zionist in regard to obtaining nuclear weapons.

HW Bush was shived from within and became a one term President.

All that aside what do you think America gets out of this war outside of doing the bidding of the Zionists?

 

[MAKAVELI25]

I agree America is more powerful on paper but which makes the asymmetrical relationship we have towards the Zionist state so obvious.

So many of our politicans are Israel first, there aren’t any prominent officials in Israeli government that is America first.


For example Chuck Schumer said his number one job is too make sure democrats continue to support the Zionist state.

The inverse of that is never said in Israel.

Eisenhower was President before the Zionist really took hold in our government.

There was an attempt on Reagan’s life.

JFK got popped after standing up to the Zionist in regard to obtaining nuclear weapons.

HW Bush was shived from within and became a one term President.

All that aside what do you think America gets out of this war outside of doing the bidding of the Zionists?

There are a number of Iran hawks who have wanted to bomb Iran for decades independent of Israel's influence. It goes back to the many embarrassments they feel that Iran has caused us, such as the hostage crisis, Iran Contra, etc. Someone like John Bolton strikes me as someone who would want to bomb Iran regardless, and if I remember correctly, Trump was upset at Netanyahu for not participating fully in the Solemani assassination.

I don't think you're an antisemite, but blaming this more on Israel than the US will inevitably breed more antisemitism. This is part of the pattern of the dumb wars that the US has fought over the decades (Vietnam, Iraq, etc.).

The problem here is not Israel, the problem is empire. The US's attempts to maintain hegemony have been detrimental to the world in much the same way the British Empire's attempts were, look at all the bullshyt the British did (Israel/Palestine, India/Pakistan) that still cause global instability to this day.

We are already aware of Israel's prerogatives, we are already aware that Netanyahu and his cabinet want regional hegemony and to destroy the chance of a Palestinian State. But as the more powerful country providing them resources, the onus is on us, not on them.

 

[mitter]

You're removing too much agency from the US, who is the more powerful power with far more leverage. US Presidents have consistently not only resisted Israel's influence (especially Republican Presidents), but they have also directed Israel's actions.

Reagan, Eisenhower, and HW Bush were effectively able to give Israel ultimatums. Obama pushed the Iran Deal against the wishes of Israel, and Trump was able to force Netanyahu in to two ceasefires.

I'm not denying Israel influences the US's foreign policy, but so do many other states. The UAE's lobbying power in the US, for example, is very underdiscussed.

Israel should not receive full blame for the actions of a more powerful country on which it is reliant, the idiot President and his moron cabinet deserve most of the blame for what is going on here.

The US just started a war that the UAE surely did not want in order to satisfy Israel. Could you imagine the reverse?

 

[Outlaw]

There are a number of Iran hawks who have wanted to bomb Iran for decades independent of Israel's influence. It goes back to the many embarrassments they feel that Iran has caused us, such as the hostage crisis, Iran Contra, etc. Someone like John Bolton strikes me as someone who would want to bomb Iran regardless, and if I remember correctly, Trump was upset at Netanyahu for not participating fully in the Solemani assassination.

I don't think you're an antisemite, but blaming this more on Israel than the US will inevitably breed more antisemitism. This is part of the pattern of the dumb wars that the US has fought over the decades (Vietnam, Iraq, etc.).

The problem here is not Israel, the problem is empire. The US's attempts to maintain hegemony have been detrimental to the world in much the same way the British Empire's attempts were, look at all the bullshyt the British did (Israel/Palestine, India/Pakistan) that still cause global instability to this day.

We are already aware of Israel's prerogatives, we are already aware that Netanyahu and his cabinet want regional hegemony and to destroy the chance of a Palestinian State. But as the more powerful country providing them resources, the onus is on us, not on them.

I’m not an antisemite. For most of my life I couldn’t tell the difference between a Jewish person and a white person.

I have no issue with Jews but the problem is the Zionist which aren’t exclusively Jews.

You’ve never wondered with there’s word for Jewish bigotry but there isn’t a word for bigotry towards any other ethnic group that’s in our common vernacular by the way?

I get what you’re saying but it I disagree on the basis that it takes cognitive dissonance to accept your premise.

If America was truly in control 99% of our federal politicians wouldn’t be Zionism first, they would work on ideological grounds that would benefit America and the American people.

There’s zero benefit in us engaging in the war on terror post 9/11, in fact it has made us weaker domestically and abroad.

This war in Iran is basically us committing seppuku at the altar of the Zionist state.


Until you can explain to me why there’s such an asymmetrical relationship between us and Israel then the Occam’s razor explanation is that they control us through bribery and blackmail.

 

[Outlaw]

The US just started a war that the UAE surely did not want in order to satisfy Israel. Could you imagine the reverse?

Could you imagine if a US Senator said I am here to ensure my party continues to support the UAE?



At least with the gulf states our country benefits from the relationship, with the Zionist state I don’t see how we benefit economically or militarily

 

[wire28]

Is what I’m saying about Zionism still just a conspiracy?

@Pull Up the Roots @wire28 @Loose

Brother, how deep does the rabbit hole go

Spoiler

 

[MAKAVELI25]

The US just started a war that the UAE surely did not want in order to satisfy Israel. Could you imagine the reverse?

You say in order to satisfy Israel as if Trump doesn't want to repeat the same nonsense in other countries. Was Israel the impetus behind the kidnapping of Maduro? Trump also wants to do the same thing in Cuba, is that also at Israel's behest? What about his territorial claims on Greenland and Panama?

We're dealing with a mad king who thinks regime change is a panacea solution, we can't say Israel is the sole cause of this when he wants to repeat the same thing in numerous countries.

Do I think that Israel was part of the impetus of the attack against Iran? Yes. But Trump also strong armed Israel in to a ceasefire after they bombed Qatar. And he also told the Houthis that he would stop bombing them as long as they did not attack US ships, meaning he didn't give a shyt if they attacked Israeli ships.

We're not dealing with someone here who is ideological about anything other than his own ego and power.