Older thread '20 NYK Off-season Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.

ISO

Pass me the rock nikka
Joined
Mar 12, 2013
Messages
62,935
Reputation
9,006
Daps
200,117
Reppin
BX, NYC
Yes exactly. Trier is gonna be better when he goes to a better team. :manny:
He won’t be better (unless he works on his game and improves his defense and playmaking) he’ll be in a better situation where he can go get buckets which is what he does best

He won’t have bum ass nikkas like Frank Ntilikina and Kevin Knox on his team and ungrateful fans bytching about him
 

RickyGQ

No nikkas!
Supporter
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
17,532
Reputation
2,709
Daps
64,664
Reppin
NJ
Not sure what you're talking about. He's the exact same player.

On other teams they found "roles" to utilize him because they were much better teams it's that simple.

If we drafted Donovan Mitchell instead of your bum ass boy for instance Timmy would have been a 6th Man.
I’m almost positive the Knicks would have tried to make Mitchell a pg.
 

storyteller

Veteran
Joined
May 23, 2012
Messages
17,709
Reputation
5,897
Daps
67,259
Reppin
NYC
He won’t be better (unless he works on his game and improves his defense and playmaking) he’ll be in a better situation where he can go get buckets which is what he does best

He won’t have bum ass nikkas like Frank Ntilikina and Kevin Knox on his team and ungrateful fans bytching about him

That will literally mean he's better. His numbers will better, he'll look better, he'll be playing better basketball. Same thing happens if Frank replaces Lu Dortz...didn't you even acknowledge as much? Frank could play that role. This also won't change the fact that Trier was terrible this year.
 

ISO

Pass me the rock nikka
Joined
Mar 12, 2013
Messages
62,935
Reputation
9,006
Daps
200,117
Reppin
BX, NYC
That will literally mean he's better. His numbers will better, he'll look better, he'll be playing better basketball. Same thing happens if Frank replaces Lu Dortz...didn't you even acknowledge as much? Frank could play that role. This also won't change the fact that Trier was terrible this year.
Dort isn’t “good” either his offense is terrible his defense is good he can get away with that on that specific team that will be bounced this round or next.

Frank should be much better than Dort. Frank is a lottery pick and makes $6M.

That doesn’t mean better it means a player is in a better situation. For a player to be better they have to actually improve whether it’s a physical transformation or skill increase.

For example players like Victor Oladipo and Giannis those are examples of being better.

There’s nothing dramatically different about a THJ’s game. He plays with Doncic on the number one offense. He physically looks the same and he has the green light to take the same ridiculous deep threes from the wing.

If Allonzo lands on another team and cooks off the bench and that team happens to make the playoffs but Trier is still the same defensive player and is still a black hole isolation player he didn’t improve. He simply went to a better team with more talent fit a role and his weaknesses were hid.
 

storyteller

Veteran
Joined
May 23, 2012
Messages
17,709
Reputation
5,897
Daps
67,259
Reppin
NYC
Dort isn’t “good” either his offense is terrible his defense is good he can get away with that on that specific team that will be bounced this round or next.

Frank should be much better than Dort. Frank is a lottery pick and makes $6M.

If it's about production versus contract; Tim Hardaway should also be trash. He was in a much bigger role on the same bad teams and making a lot more money to be his worst self (literally). If you think Dort is trash like Frank, that's cool. I don't agree with either evaluation.

That doesn’t mean better it means a player is in a better situation. For a player to be better they have to actually improve whether it’s a physical transformation or skill increase.

For example players like Victor Oladipo and Giannis those are examples of being better.

There’s nothing dramatically different about a THJ’s game. He plays with Doncic on the number one offense. He physically looks the same and he has the green light to take the same ridiculous deep threes from the wing.

If Allonzo lands on another team and cooks off the bench and that team happens to make the playoffs but Trier is still the same defensive player and is still a black hole isolation player he didn’t improve. He simply went to a better team with more talent fit a role and his weaknesses were hid.

When I say better, I'm talking about impact on the court. A player can get better by improving on skills or they can get better by being moved into a different role or system. Trier, just by virtue of being on a team that can mask his weaknesses, will be a better player. Pair him with a three and D player and Trier will produce more than he did for us without a floor stretcher. He'll be a better player by being more productive. Whether you think Tim Hardaway is exactly the same player today as he was the day that he was traded or not...he's playing better basketball and producing just as much on lower usage and higher efficiency.

Putting players in better roles to maximize their skill sets is on management and on coaching. Whether you think Tim Hardaway is the exact same player or not...management and coaching played a role in why the ball he played for the Knicks was inefficient garbage. I think the flaws in management and coaching that made THJ look like trash and meant Trier didn't have a role also apply to every single player. We don't know what a bunch of these cats really can be, because we haven't seen them in ideal situations.

Trier will lookbetter regardless of skillset in the right situation. THJ looks better right now regardless of whether you think he improved or stayed the same because he's in the right situation. Frank and Knox haven't been in an ideal situation. Neither have Mitch or RJ for that matter, which bodes well for them if management this time around is better.
 

JMurder

SOHH Member since 01...
Joined
May 3, 2012
Messages
13,630
Reputation
1,110
Daps
20,411
Reppin
Bronx, NYC
I'm still trying to figure out how nikkas calling Frank a bad player and at the same time admitting he's elite on one end of the court. Y'all nikkas know what elite means?

:dwillhuh:

Also
A draft bust is a highly touted or highly selected draftee that does not meet expectations. This can be due to a variety of reasons, but the most often noted are injury or inability to perform at a professional level.
I don't think Frank was highly touted, nor do I think there were high expectations from him when he was drafted. He was picked specifically to run the triangle and play off ball offensively while being a great defender. If we go by this definition, I don't think he can be labeled a bust yet.
 

RickyGQ

No nikkas!
Supporter
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
17,532
Reputation
2,709
Daps
64,664
Reppin
NJ
I wouldn’t be opposed to that.

He’s already such a high usage player.

i think it only works in a situation like Denver where Jamaal Murray lines up as the pg but Jokic is really the pg of that team. Or at least where he can have a secondary ball handler who can set up other guys for spells while he can take short breaks.
 

ISO

Pass me the rock nikka
Joined
Mar 12, 2013
Messages
62,935
Reputation
9,006
Daps
200,117
Reppin
BX, NYC
I'm still trying to figure out how nikkas calling Frank a bad player and at the same time admitting he's elite on one end of the court. Y'all nikkas know what elite means?

:dwillhuh:

Also

I don't think Frank was highly touted, nor do I think there were high expectations from him when he was drafted. He was picked specifically to run the triangle and play off ball offensively while being a great defender. If we go by this definition, I don't think he can be labeled a bust yet.
Elite was generous he can't stay on the floor he fouls too much then maybe when he solves that we can call him elite.

Frank was a lottery pick and was called one of the best international players of his generation. It was people comparing him to Giannis and raving about all this untapped potential and talking about how his wingspan would be game changing. Don't do that. Even if he was selected to run the triangle he has struggled with the most basic aspects of being a point guard in the NBA. We didn't pick this guy to average 5 points and be a spot defender.
 

ISO

Pass me the rock nikka
Joined
Mar 12, 2013
Messages
62,935
Reputation
9,006
Daps
200,117
Reppin
BX, NYC
If it's about production versus contract; Tim Hardaway should also be trash. He was in a much bigger role on the same bad teams and making a lot more money to be his worst self (literally). If you think Dort is trash like Frank, that's cool. I don't agree with either evaluation.



When I say better, I'm talking about impact on the court. A player can get better by improving on skills or they can get better by being moved into a different role or system. Trier, just by virtue of being on a team that can mask his weaknesses, will be a better player. Pair him with a three and D player and Trier will produce more than he did for us without a floor stretcher. He'll be a better player by being more productive. Whether you think Tim Hardaway is exactly the same player today as he was the day that he was traded or not...he's playing better basketball and producing just as much on lower usage and higher efficiency.

Putting players in better roles to maximize their skill sets is on management and on coaching. Whether you think Tim Hardaway is the exact same player or not...management and coaching played a role in why the ball he played for the Knicks was inefficient garbage. I think the flaws in management and coaching that made THJ look like trash and meant Trier didn't have a role also apply to every single player. We don't know what a bunch of these cats really can be, because we haven't seen them in ideal situations.

Trier will lookbetter regardless of skillset in the right situation. THJ looks better right now regardless of whether you think he improved or stayed the same because he's in the right situation. Frank and Knox haven't been in an ideal situation. Neither have Mitch or RJ for that matter, which bodes well for them if management this time around is better.
We gonna have to disagree on that evaluation. To me being better means you actually improved your game not that you went to a much better team and played with better players lol that makes no sense to me. If THJ goes to Cleveland or Chicago next year he reverts to the same shyt he was on the Knicks. THJ does not look better to me I see the same chuck with lower usage surrounded by much better players. THJ had no choice but to take the role he had based on the talent deficit on our team and what he was paid.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top