Sam Seder and Paul Reickhoff debate over the progressive vs moderate democrat split

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

The Majority Report had a debate today over this starting between Sam Seder and Paul Reickhoff at 1:09:52 / 3:06:55




This is pretty remarkable and i KINDA gotta agree with Paul in various lines here. These guys dont understand red state politics and what it takes to get elected in the senate


@wire28 @Th3G3ntleman @ezrathegreat @Jello Biafra @humble forever @Dameon Farrow @Piff Perkins @Pressure @johnedwarduado @Armchair Militant @panopticon @Tres Leches @ADevilYouKhow @dtownreppin214 @DrDealgood @Red Shield

 

[DEAD7]

Sam lawse this one

 

[Unemployed GM]

Paul is a retard, but Sam can’t debate.

 

[King Kreole]

Paul Reickhoff gave one of the worst fukking "debate" performances I've ever seen in my entire life. He looks like he did a rail right before coming on, and his entire schtick was based on having absolutely zero evidence other than his white man gumption. He got visibly flustered and offended whenever Seder asked him for a single piece of polling or statistical evidence to support his position. He made absolutely no worthwhile points, and whenever the hint of a possibility of him making one presented itself, he shyt all over his dikk. He refused to engage with the basic factual timeline of the post-election Democratic infighting while ascribing total powerlessness to the establishment wing of the party, conveniently alleviating them of any responsibility for their actions, while ascribing total power to AOC and the progressive wing. He continually pretended as though every unregistered/independent voter belongs to the middle of the ideological spectrum when in fact Donald Trump expanded the Republican coalition, and I highly doubt the mass of people who didn't care for Romney or McCain but joined the party when Trump was in charge are ideological moderates, so it would stand to reason a similar dynamic is taking place on the left. Whenever Seder brought up a case of a moderate who heavily disavowed all these "extreme left, socialist" policies yet still lost, like McGrath, Reickhoff would break out the "No True Scotsman" fallacy. In one breath he's calling Pelosi a radical leftist who hurt Max Rose by proximity, in the other breath he's calling Pelosi a great bi-partisan dealmaker who has done a good job as Speaker unlike those dirty leftists like AOC. Just total nonsense.

Paul let Nas down.

 

[Pressure]

Glad to see my Slovenian creh is here with the Juelz early.

 

[King Kreole]

Glad to see my Slovenian creh is here with the Juelz early.

You know I had to get my shots in. Just another day in the posting mines.

 

[Pressure]

You know I had to get my shots in. Just another day in the posting mines.

I'm not sure how much antagonizing I'm in the mood for today.

Just going to say that leftist candidates need to be able to win over their demo in the primary before projecting what they could have done in a general.

 

[King Kreole]

I'm not sure how much antagonizing I'm in the mood for today.

Just going to say that leftist candidates need to be able to win over their demo in the primary before projecting what they could have done in a general.

I've already said Biden was the strongest Presidential candidate, and might have been the only one who could have won this election. My beef is with the downballot centrists dems trying to kneecap Progressives in this Dem Civil War on some "throw a stone and hide your hands" shyt. Ain't no one saying AOC could win the 2020 Presidential election, I doubt she could even win statewide in NY yet.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

Paul Reickhoff gave one of the worst fukking "debate" performances I've ever seen in my entire life. He looks like he did a rail right before coming on, and his entire schtick was based on having absolutely zero evidence other than his white man gumption. He got visibly flustered and offended whenever Seder asked him for a single piece of polling or statistical evidence to support his position. He made absolutely no worthwhile points, and whenever the hint of a possibility of him making one presented itself, he shyt all over his dikk. He refused to engage with the basic factual timeline of the post-election Democratic infighting while ascribing total powerlessness to the establishment wing of the party, conveniently alleviating them of any responsibility for their actions, while ascribing total power to AOC and the progressive wing. He continually pretended as though every unregistered/independent voter belongs to the middle of the ideological spectrum when in fact Donald Trump expanded the Republican coalition, and I highly doubt the mass of people who didn't care for Romney or McCain but joined the party when Trump was in charge are ideological moderates, so it would stand to reason a similar dynamic is taking place on the left. Whenever Seder brought up a case of a moderate who heavily disavowed all these "extreme left, socialist" policies yet still lost, like McGrath, Reickhoff would break out the "No True Scotsman" fallacy. In one breath he's calling Pelosi a radical leftist who hurt Max Rose by proximity, in the other breath he's calling Pelosi a great bi-partisan dealmaker who has done a good job as Speaker unlike those dirty leftists like AOC. Just total nonsense.

Paul let Nas down.

Have you lived in a red state?

I don't agree with Paul on much, but AOC and most of the majority report candidates they like wouldn't even get top 4 finishes in the South. A lot of progressive media doesn't understand the south at all.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

I've already said Biden was the strongest Presidential candidate, and might have been the only one who could have won this election. My beef is with the downballot centrists dems trying to kneecap Progressives in this Dem Civil War on some "throw a stone and hide your hands" shyt. Ain't no one saying AOC could win the 2020 Presidential election, I doubt she could even win statewide in NY yet.

most elected democrats ARE the most progressive options in their districts though. Thats my point.

Thats the problem comparing all these districts.

 

[King Kreole]

Have you lived in a red state?

I don't agree with Paul on much, but AOC and most of the majority report candidates they like wouldn't even get top 4 finishes in the South. A lot of progressive media doesn't understand the south at all.

Who is making the claim that AOC could become Governor of Mississippi? This idea that progressives are demanding all Democrats, especially red state Dems, run as socialists is a fiction made up by centrists. AOC's critique was that Democrats are shyt at digital, not that they're not all running on her policy set. Reickhoff was too up his own ass to even begin to engage with this.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

Who is making the claim that AOC could become Governor of Mississippi? This idea that progressives are demanding all Democrats, especially red state Dems, run as socialists is a fiction made up by centrists. AOC's critique was that Democrats are shyt at digital, not that they're not all running on her policy set. Reickhoff was too up his own ass to even begin to engage with this.

Drop the socialism shyt.

The problem is that as long as deep blue dems are sucking up the air in the room instead of playing their part then we CAN NOT expand our reach

 

[King Kreole]

most elected democrats ARE the most progressive options in their districts though. Thats my point.

Thats the problem comparing all these districts.

Ok then run a competent campaign on your policy set in your district and win. Don't run a shyt campaign and lose and then blame the ghost of Karl Marx.

 

[King Kreole]

Drop the socialism shyt.

The problem is that as long as deep blue dems are sucking up the air in the room instead of playing their part then we CAN NOT expand our reach

What does "drop the socialism shyt" mean? AOC and other progressives should resign? AOC and other progressives should drop the policy set they're winning on and become more conservative to placate Abigail Spanberger and Paul Reickhoff? When Obama was called a Marxist, should the Democrats have dropped him?

What does "playing their part" look like? Advocate voting for Joe Biden and offering to help centrist Dems with their digital strategy not even conditioned on adopting a progressive policy set? Raising hundreds of thousands of dollars for the Georgia runoffs without demanding Ossoff or Warnock adopt a progressive policy set? Or is playing their part resigning and disappearing because their mere existence makes centrists uncomfortable?

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

What does "drop the socialism shyt" mean? AOC and other progressives should resign? AOC and other progressives should drop the policy set they're winning on and become more conservative to placate Abigail Spanberger and Paul Reickhoff? When Obama was called a Marxist, should the Democrats have dropped him?

What does "playing their part" look like? Advocate voting for Joe Biden and offering to help centrist Dems with their digital strategy not even conditioned on adopting a progressive policy set? Raising hundreds of thousands of dollars for the Georgia runoffs without demanding Ossoff or Warnock adopt a progressive policy set? Or is playing their part resigning and disappearing because their mere existence makes centrists uncomfortable?

You really are bad at this.

No one is telling anyone to resign.

I'm saying that AOC should stop using the word socialism.

Its costing us votes in Florida and many immigrant communities...while they take welfare and other aid.

FRAMING is all that matters

Focus on POLICIES.