FreedS[ohh]lave
Banned
True i dont think the Magic are out of the question either their gm isnt one of these play it safe gms worried about his job security
The Official 2014 NBA Draft Talk Thread
- Thread starter tremonthustler1
- Start date
True i dont think the Magic are out of the question either their gm isnt one of these play it safe gms worried about his job security
tremonthustler1
aka bx_representer
Possible.
I can't bank on trades. Afflalo + 4 + 1 for Jabari is a steep price though.
Embiid and Kyle Anderson would be a coup for Cleveland
Last edited:
tremonthustler1
aka bx_representer
I wouldn't say Hennigan is worried, but 2 years in, you wanna start seeing results. I also don't know how this affects Vucci Mane because he'd be neutralized as a PF.
FreedS[ohh]lave
Banned
Do u think the cavs are still a possiblity if they trade down?
tremonthustler1
aka bx_representer
for Embiid? Yes.
The parts they can add in a trade should keep fans happy til Embiid is healthy.
Stinky Diver
attitude as bad as his odor
Every time I hear Chad Ford, I remember the 2003 draft and his love for this scrub;
Maciej Lampe
Summary: Lampe could be the sleeper of the draft. He has most of the intagibles teams look for in a big guy. He won't have an immediate impact in the league, but at 18, he has time to develop. In two or three years, watch out.
He thought the Heat should have taken him over Wade.
Summary: Lampe could be the sleeper of the draft. He has most of the intagibles teams look for in a big guy. He won't have an immediate impact in the league, but at 18, he has time to develop. In two or three years, watch out.
He thought the Heat should have taken him over Wade.
Last edited:
You mean nba.com or something? It's not on NBA TV...check your guide. I don't think it ever has been.
tremonthustler1
aka bx_representer
So much exum hate. 
I also understand why the Sixers wouldn't want Embiid... you have two guys with injury histories, you're playing with fire. And who knows if they can play together.... though I'd love to see it.
MCW is a moderate prospect, simply by way of his physical gifts, skillset and age.
Hey @tremonthustler1 If you have a second round pick, are you taking Tavares, Kilmenko, Patric Young, or Jokic, Bryant, or Felicio? Feel free to rank or give a few answers.
I also understand why the Sixers wouldn't want Embiid... you have two guys with injury histories, you're playing with fire. And who knows if they can play together.... though I'd love to see it.
MCW is a moderate prospect, simply by way of his physical gifts, skillset and age.
Hey @tremonthustler1 If you have a second round pick, are you taking Tavares, Kilmenko, Patric Young, or Jokic, Bryant, or Felicio? Feel free to rank or give a few answers.
I think you guys are right about the Cavs. They are in a really great spot. All they have to do is take Jabari and they can sit back and let teams give up the farm for him if Embiid falls. Adding Embiid and another lottery pick would be a great haul. If not, you still end up with a great player in Jabari.
Even the Cavs can't screw this up.......right????
Even the Cavs can't screw this up.......right????
Every time I hear Chad Ford, I remember the 2003 draft and his love for this scrub;
Maciej Lampe
Summary: Lampe could be the sleeper of the draft. He has most of the intagibles teams look for in a big guy. He won't have an immediate impact in the league, but at 18, he has time to develop. In two or three years, watch out.
He thought the Heat should have taken him over Wade.
tremonthustler1
aka bx_representer
So much exum hate.
I also understand why the Sixers wouldn't want Embiid... you have two guys with injury histories, you're playing with fire. And who knows if they can play together.... though I'd love to see it.
MCW is a moderate prospect, simply by way of his physical gifts, skillset and age.
Hey @tremonthustler1 If you have a second round pick, are you taking Tavares, Kilmenko, Patric Young, or Jokic, Bryant, or Felicio? Feel free to rank or give a few answers.
I haven't given much love to the 2nd rounders.
Tavares is the most tantalizing prospect because he doesn't know what the hell he's doing, so if you pair him up with a big man coach that DOES, it's all good.
I still say Spencer Dinwiddie has no business in round 2 but if he falls, he's a major steal.
I'm not sold on Klimenko. I think he's too light on his feet. Whenever these guys come in 7'1'' 220 or less, they tend to flame out or stay overseas and make a killing being the tallest guy in the room.
I'm very sold on Young as an energy big. I know Minny is looking at him at 40 (though I see them selling picks and stashing everywhere they go)
Felicio I wanna see in ACB play
but I'm talking TV, friend.
Every time I hear Chad Ford, I remember the 2003 draft and his love for this scrub;
Maciej Lampe
Summary: Lampe could be the sleeper of the draft. He has most of the intagibles teams look for in a big guy. He won't have an immediate impact in the league, but at 18, he has time to develop. In two or three years, watch out.
He thought the Heat should have taken him over Wade.
don't forget Pavel Podkolzin, Ford called him the sleeper of the 2004 draft and said his "upside was unmatched"...Podkolzin played in 6 NBA games for his career
...why do nikkas wait on Ford's word like he is that gospel?Nate Duncan of Basketball Insiders said he wouldn't take Wiggins before 5th, he still hasn't posted his big board yet tho
http://www.basketballinsiders.com/2014-nba-draft-andrew-wiggins-scouting-report/
2014 NBA Draft: Andrew Wiggins Scouting Report
Read more at http://www.basketballinsiders.com/2014-nba-draft-andrew-wiggins-scouting-report/#2EoQE6B65fvJopmC.99
Andrew Wiggins was anointed the presumptive number one pick in this draft the moment he reclassified into the high school class of 2013. At the time, he looked like the best wing prospect since LeBron James with his otherworldly athleticism. He measured at an enormous 6’8 with a 7’0 wingspan and reported 44-inch vertical leap off two feet. While Joel Embiid and perhaps Jabari Parker passed Wiggins on some draft boards during this college season, the center’s injury issues have again made Wiggins a favorite to be drafted in the top two. Despite what some might call a slightly disappointing freshman year at Kansas, no major draftniks that I am aware of him have him falling below the Milwaukee Bucks with the second pick.
Wiggins’ strengths have been well-chronicled by others, including his excellent wing defense, good motor and of course that athleticism. But despite those strengths I would not draft him before the fifth pick in this draft.
The main problem is Wiggins’ lack of upside as a scorer. While he is a fantastic leaper with great length, he does not often translate those physical gifts into finishing that befits them. One interesting study by Dean Demakis, conducted through January 31*, showed that Wiggins had dunked on only three of 44 finishes at the rim in the halfcourt. During the season, he really only had two or three spectacular dunks on an opposing defender. But more troubling than the relative paucity of dunks is how many layups he misses. Great finishers have a knack for it, possessing the ability to feel the defense and maneuver the ball and their body to avoid the block and still make the shot. Wiggins just does not have that feel right now, and he misses a ton of layups. The video below (also by Demakis) shows a number of Wiggins’ missed layups. It is truly disconcerting how many easy finishes he simply cannot convert. He shot 63 percent at the rim according to Hoop-Math.com, a disappointing figure for a player of his athleticism who gets out in transition as often as he does.
*Demakis does not have updated season-long numbers, but they might be a bit better as Wiggins finished the season strong. Also, it should be noted that I don’t necessarily agree with the author’s conclusion that Wiggins’ aggressiveness is a problem so much as it is simply lack of feel.
Another issue is his lack of off-the-dribble game. He doesn’t really create any separation with his dribble moves, possessing little shake and playing very upright. Again, he simply is not a natural when it comes to handling the ball—it often looks like he is just executing his moves in one place without getting anywhere. It is going to take a lot of work to make him a capable player out of the pick-and-roll from a handling and passing perspective. When Wiggins did make an effective drive, it was almost invariably to his right. He has two actual moves he can use regularly at this point: that straight line righty drive into a spin move back to his left and a step-back J going to his left.
Wiggins is excellent in transition, showing an ability to juke defenders with his long strides to avoid picking up charges and get to the basket before the defense gets set. But what a player does in the halfcourt possessions that make up the vast majority of the game in the NBA is far more relevant. Indeed, there is even some evidence that getting an inordinate amount of offense in transition is an indicator against NBA success relative to college because those points do not translate as well.
Shooting from the outside is an area in which Wiggins is more advanced, as he shot 35 percent from deep with may of the attempts of the difficult variety. Still, one would think his pretty shot would go in more often. While that can be projected (and I believe it will be an adequate weapon in time), there is also the very realistic possibility he does not become an elite shooter either. Certainly we have not seen enough to be confident of this result.
His trainers at P3 athletics are reportedly working with Wiggins to boost his dribble game by playing lower to the ground and improve his core strength to help with finishing at the rim. But it is indisputable that he does not possess those skills at the moment, and there is no guarantee they ever develop. Rudy Gay (a player whose upright, static off-the-dribble game he mimics at this point) never really got the shake despite his athletic gifts, and Thomas Robinson still struggles to finish at the rim in the pros. The possibility Wiggins never fixes these issues must be priced into his evaluation despite his youth.
Even if he does, most though not all observers would likely agree that his offensive ceiling is more Paul George than a true scoring wing superstar like Kevin Durant or Dwyane Wade. And “ceiling” is often a misinterpreted word. Many, without thinking of it, think of the ceiling as what the player is most likely to become if all goes according to plan in his development. But in reality, it is what happens if all goes as well as it possibly could. If Paul George is Wiggins’ best-case offensive scenario from a scouting perspective, it must be noted that the more likely outcome is somewhere well below that. In the lofty strata of the top two picks in the draft, a non-big should at least have the potential of becoming an offensive superstar. I believe his lack of natural scoring ability very likely precludes that.
Perhaps nothing is more terrifying for a talent evaluator than when his opinion so differs from conventional wisdom. And Wiggins does have the raw physical tools to make me potentially rue this evaluation someday. However, my scouting assessment is somewhat emboldened by analytics models, as I have not seen one which ranks him higher than 10th. Kevin Pelton’s draft rater has him as the 19th best prospect in the draft.
“A possible No. 1 pick, Wiggins didn’t perform like one during his lone NCAA season,” Pelton writes. “Wiggins is better than his projection because of his potential as an on-ball defender, but nothing in his stat line suggests likely superstardom. In particular, his projected usage rate (18.8 percent) is unspectacular for an NBA-bound wing, highlighting the improvement Wiggins needs to make handling the basketball.”
Pelton’s take agrees with my own scouting-driven analysis. The bit about his low projected usage rate in particular dovetails with my observation that he doesn’t have the knack for shot-creation at this point. It is possible that may come in time, but most great scorers had shown the ability by this point in their careers. Based on the entirety of his freshman season, Andrew Wiggins has yet to do so.
http://www.basketballinsiders.com/2014-nba-draft-andrew-wiggins-scouting-report/
2014 NBA Draft: Andrew Wiggins Scouting Report
Read more at http://www.basketballinsiders.com/2014-nba-draft-andrew-wiggins-scouting-report/#2EoQE6B65fvJopmC.99
Andrew Wiggins was anointed the presumptive number one pick in this draft the moment he reclassified into the high school class of 2013. At the time, he looked like the best wing prospect since LeBron James with his otherworldly athleticism. He measured at an enormous 6’8 with a 7’0 wingspan and reported 44-inch vertical leap off two feet. While Joel Embiid and perhaps Jabari Parker passed Wiggins on some draft boards during this college season, the center’s injury issues have again made Wiggins a favorite to be drafted in the top two. Despite what some might call a slightly disappointing freshman year at Kansas, no major draftniks that I am aware of him have him falling below the Milwaukee Bucks with the second pick.
Wiggins’ strengths have been well-chronicled by others, including his excellent wing defense, good motor and of course that athleticism. But despite those strengths I would not draft him before the fifth pick in this draft.
The main problem is Wiggins’ lack of upside as a scorer. While he is a fantastic leaper with great length, he does not often translate those physical gifts into finishing that befits them. One interesting study by Dean Demakis, conducted through January 31*, showed that Wiggins had dunked on only three of 44 finishes at the rim in the halfcourt. During the season, he really only had two or three spectacular dunks on an opposing defender. But more troubling than the relative paucity of dunks is how many layups he misses. Great finishers have a knack for it, possessing the ability to feel the defense and maneuver the ball and their body to avoid the block and still make the shot. Wiggins just does not have that feel right now, and he misses a ton of layups. The video below (also by Demakis) shows a number of Wiggins’ missed layups. It is truly disconcerting how many easy finishes he simply cannot convert. He shot 63 percent at the rim according to Hoop-Math.com, a disappointing figure for a player of his athleticism who gets out in transition as often as he does.
*Demakis does not have updated season-long numbers, but they might be a bit better as Wiggins finished the season strong. Also, it should be noted that I don’t necessarily agree with the author’s conclusion that Wiggins’ aggressiveness is a problem so much as it is simply lack of feel.
Another issue is his lack of off-the-dribble game. He doesn’t really create any separation with his dribble moves, possessing little shake and playing very upright. Again, he simply is not a natural when it comes to handling the ball—it often looks like he is just executing his moves in one place without getting anywhere. It is going to take a lot of work to make him a capable player out of the pick-and-roll from a handling and passing perspective. When Wiggins did make an effective drive, it was almost invariably to his right. He has two actual moves he can use regularly at this point: that straight line righty drive into a spin move back to his left and a step-back J going to his left.
Wiggins is excellent in transition, showing an ability to juke defenders with his long strides to avoid picking up charges and get to the basket before the defense gets set. But what a player does in the halfcourt possessions that make up the vast majority of the game in the NBA is far more relevant. Indeed, there is even some evidence that getting an inordinate amount of offense in transition is an indicator against NBA success relative to college because those points do not translate as well.
Shooting from the outside is an area in which Wiggins is more advanced, as he shot 35 percent from deep with may of the attempts of the difficult variety. Still, one would think his pretty shot would go in more often. While that can be projected (and I believe it will be an adequate weapon in time), there is also the very realistic possibility he does not become an elite shooter either. Certainly we have not seen enough to be confident of this result.
His trainers at P3 athletics are reportedly working with Wiggins to boost his dribble game by playing lower to the ground and improve his core strength to help with finishing at the rim. But it is indisputable that he does not possess those skills at the moment, and there is no guarantee they ever develop. Rudy Gay (a player whose upright, static off-the-dribble game he mimics at this point) never really got the shake despite his athletic gifts, and Thomas Robinson still struggles to finish at the rim in the pros. The possibility Wiggins never fixes these issues must be priced into his evaluation despite his youth.
Even if he does, most though not all observers would likely agree that his offensive ceiling is more Paul George than a true scoring wing superstar like Kevin Durant or Dwyane Wade. And “ceiling” is often a misinterpreted word. Many, without thinking of it, think of the ceiling as what the player is most likely to become if all goes according to plan in his development. But in reality, it is what happens if all goes as well as it possibly could. If Paul George is Wiggins’ best-case offensive scenario from a scouting perspective, it must be noted that the more likely outcome is somewhere well below that. In the lofty strata of the top two picks in the draft, a non-big should at least have the potential of becoming an offensive superstar. I believe his lack of natural scoring ability very likely precludes that.
Perhaps nothing is more terrifying for a talent evaluator than when his opinion so differs from conventional wisdom. And Wiggins does have the raw physical tools to make me potentially rue this evaluation someday. However, my scouting assessment is somewhat emboldened by analytics models, as I have not seen one which ranks him higher than 10th. Kevin Pelton’s draft rater has him as the 19th best prospect in the draft.
“A possible No. 1 pick, Wiggins didn’t perform like one during his lone NCAA season,” Pelton writes. “Wiggins is better than his projection because of his potential as an on-ball defender, but nothing in his stat line suggests likely superstardom. In particular, his projected usage rate (18.8 percent) is unspectacular for an NBA-bound wing, highlighting the improvement Wiggins needs to make handling the basketball.”
Pelton’s take agrees with my own scouting-driven analysis. The bit about his low projected usage rate in particular dovetails with my observation that he doesn’t have the knack for shot-creation at this point. It is possible that may come in time, but most great scorers had shown the ability by this point in their careers. Based on the entirety of his freshman season, Andrew Wiggins has yet to do so.