The Official Cleveland Cavs Firesale Thread

[Professor Emeritus]

nobody gaf about the Cavs per se, but its just about how dysfunctional an organization has become two years after the greatest point in their history. not sure if there has been another team like this in recent history that wasnt totally disbanded.

Not sure what you mean by that, but whatever you mean it's certainly happened plenty of times recently.

If you mean wins/losses, then don't forget that Cleveland still a 30-21 team or whatever. Compare that to the 2012/13 Mavs (still had Dirk), or the 2007/08 Heat (still had Wade), the 2004/05 Lakers (still had Kobe), the 1992/93 Pistons (still had Isaiah).

If you mean just internal dysfunction and whatnot, then remember how the Shaq/Kobe Lakers were a damn mess BEFORE Shaq even left, with Kobe ratting out Shaq, Phil casting shade on Kobe, Kobe quitting for games cause he bitter, etc. The Kareem/Magic Lakers were a damn mess the year after their first championship. In more recent history, remember how the 2014 Indiana Pacers had been battling the Cavs for two straight years and were supposed to have next, then completely fell apart (PG13 catfish scandal, Hibbert gets selected to the All-Star team and then mentally implodes the same season, signing Bynum, trading away Granger, Lance Stephenson doing Lance Stephenson things), leading to articles like this one.

We've seen dysfunction like this before. It's just hitting people different now cause it the social media era so everyone talking bout everything a hundred times a day instead of just reading it in the morning papers.

 

[Illeye buckmatic]

even with that pick, with no Bron, Cavs wont be relevant for another 5 years minimum. that pick is going to be a good pick, I have no doubt about it because the first 8 is going to be pretty deep.... but none of those players you mentioned abouve could single-handedly change the fortunes of a bad team, not even Kyrie could as the #1 pick, Davis couldnt, and so on. whatever leverage Gilbert thinks he has, he better think again.

Nobody is expecting that pick to lead them to the playoffs. But it jumpstarts the rebuilding process. Why wait a whole year to become relevant again if it's already going to take several years?
And Bron definitely hasn't been playing hard lately

Leave Miami for Cleveland brehs.

He brought his hometown a ring by beating a 73 win team with a unanimous MVP and Miami was already. Smarten up:lmaonas:

 

[Serious]

all I know is last night was bad....
I was seeing bully bron get stopped by Capella like nothing...

Bron in his prime is running over someone like Capella, not getting rejected like an undersized guard with no basketball iq

 

[surv2syn]

Not sure what you mean by that, but whatever you mean it's certainly happened plenty of times recently.

If you mean wins/losses, then don't forget that Cleveland still a 30-21 team or whatever. Compare that to the 2012/13 Mavs (still had Dirk), or the 2007/08 Heat (still had Wade), the 2004/05 Lakers (still had Kobe), the 1992/93 Pistons (still had Isaiah).

If you mean just internal dysfunction and whatnot, then remember how the Shaq/Kobe Lakers were a damn mess BEFORE Shaq even left, with Kobe ratting out Shaq, Phil casting shade on Kobe, Kobe quitting for games cause he bitter, etc. The Kareem/Magic Lakers were a damn mess the year after their first championship. In more recent history, remember how the 2014 Indiana Pacers had been battling the Cavs for two straight years and were supposed to have next, then completely fell apart (PG13 catfish scandal, Hibbert gets selected to the All-Star team and then mentally implodes the same season, signing Bynum, trading away Granger, Lance Stephenson doing Lance Stephenson things), leading to articles like this one.

We've seen dysfunction like this before. It's just hitting people different now cause it the social media era so everyone talking bout everything a hundred times a day instead of just reading it in the morning papers.

good example

 

[Professor Emeritus]

it doesnt look like it. nothing that they would realistically do. Altman isnt ready to make any bold moves. He just wants to stay safe. There are a lot of good players but the Cavs really dont have anything of value to give up. they shouldve traded that BK pick early on. George Hill, Avery Bradley, DeAndre, Favors, Reke, Lou Will, etc....these guys can all help a little bit but not enough to make this team a real threat.

there is only one guy out there that they may have a slim chance to get that would realistically change their fortunes at this point and that's CJ McCollum. Just not sure the Blazers would do that deal if Love isnt involved. CJ has been linked to the Cavs for a while and probably wouldve been traded there for Kyrie if a 3-way deal couldve been worked out because the Blazers didnt want to pair Kyrie with Dame.

I have no idea why people talking about CJ McCollum.

He's a terrible defender and he needs a ton of shots. He does NOT solve the Cavs' problems at all.

#1 need: A big man who can defend the rim. Or any competent defender over 6'8" at all. It's embarassing how terrible they are in the middle on that end.

#2 need: Any three-and-D guard. Every single guard they have is either terrible on D or can't shoot threes. JR used to do both and now he can hardly do anything.

#3 need: Any point guard who can simply run the offense without giving up more points than he's worth on the other end.


There were plenty of ways to get those needs met. CJ McCollum is not one of them.

The Kyrie to Boston trade wasn't a "bad trade" per se in terms of assets, but it was a terrible trade for completing this year without any more moves. The two main assets from that trade (IT and the Nets pick) are both USELESS for winning a title this year, as I said at the time. If they could have turned around and flipped IT and the pick for the things they needed, they would have been fine. Their unwillingness to do that shows that they don't give a shyt about competing this season and are just banking on the auto-sellouts you get by having Lebron on your team. It's a shytty way to run a franchise.

If they really could have had PG13 and Eric Bledsoe for Irving, this would be a completely different team. They could have then traded some combination of Love/Shump/Frye for a rim protector and maybe even a guard, they could have actually competed. Imagine when Bucks fans were complaining that Middleton couldn't be the #2 scorer they needed and there was a logjam at guard. Say the Cavs give them Love and JR for Middleton, Delly, and Henson. Cavs would have been:

Bledsoe/Delly (and who knows with Rose)
Middleton/Wade/Korver
PG13/Green
Lebron/Frye
Henson/TT

THAT team would have at least been competent, beat Boston easily and made the Warriors sweat. If not those exact trades, something like that was within reach. And Gilbert pissed it away.

 

[surv2syn]

I have no idea why people talking about CJ McCollum.

He's a terrible defender and he needs a ton of shots. He does NOT solve the Cavs' problems at all.

my reference to CJ was to the only possible player at the moment that could help them. yes, he doesnt have the defense but they still need another legit scorer because we dont know if IT will get his bearings, right now he isnt replacing Kyrie's offense. again, my mention is for what they are in the realm of possibility of getting.

#1 need: A big man who can defend the rim. Or any competent defender over 6'8" at all. It's embarassing how terrible they are in the middle on that end.

this has always been true, but what is available? DJ? they arent giving up the BK pick so beyond that, pretty sure Clips arent interested. maybe get another team involved? I have thought about Dedmon, he could help and is on a good contract too.

#2 need: Any three-and-D guard. Every single guard they have is either terrible on D or can't shoot threes. JR used to do both and now he can hardly do anything.

again, whats available? please dont say George Hill. he isnt that good anymore and oft-injured. there is Bradley but man, can he stay healthy? can the Cavs even get him?

#3 need: Any point guard who can simply run the offense without giving up more points than he's worth on the other end.

this may be George Hill..but again, I question him. doubt they bring in someone like Tyreke at this point, though the couldve had him before Grizz got him. again, they have nothing the Grizz want except the BK pick. unless they want one of the Cavs picks after 2018.


There were plenty of ways to get those needs met. CJ McCollum is not one of them.

just not sure who else the Cavs can get because they offer nothing but bad contracts or old players. but hey, this is Altman's job. I think the easiest thing is to move Shump and Frye if possible for Baze and Dedmon. but those two players probably barely move the needle in this shytstorm....plus contracts dont match, so they would need to do some extra work to this happen, like you would need to trade TT somewhere in here to improve this team. Shump and Frye arent enough to draw flies. I dont want Baze contract either.

The Kyrie to Boston trade wasn't a "bad trade" per se in terms of assets, but it was a terrible trade for completing this year without any more moves. The two main assets from that trade (IT and the Nets pick) are both USELESS for winning a title this year, as I said at the time. If they could have turned around and flipped IT and the pick for the things they needed, they would have been fine. Their unwillingness to do that shows that they don't give a shyt about competing this season and are just banking on the auto-sellouts you get by having Lebron on your team. It's a shytty way to run a franchise.

If they really could have had PG13 and Eric Bledsoe for Irving, this would be a completely different team. They could have then traded some combination of Love/Shump/Frye for a rim protector and maybe even a guard, they could have actually competed. Imagine when Bucks fans were complaining that Middleton couldn't be the #2 scorer they needed and there was a logjam at guard. Say the Cavs give them Love and JR for Middleton, Delly, and Henson. Cavs would have been:

Bledsoe/Delly (and who knows with Rose)
Middleton/Wade/Korver
PG13/Green
Lebron/Crowder
Henson/TT


THAT team would have at least been competent, beat Boston easily and made the Warriors sweat. If not those exact trades, something like that was within reach. And Gilbert pissed it away.

now this last bit I agree with everything you said, especially about Gilbert pissing it away. Griffin was capable. I believe it was confirmed by Melo that the deal was in place for him and PG both to be traded there on draft night...but even before Melo said that a couple of months ago, SAS had confirmed that they definitely had a deal for PG that was right there and Griffin left while this was in limbo and the deal didnt happen.

Middleton is one of the most underrated players in the league right now. The dude is a stud and a 2-way player.

the lineup you posted is great...but why is Crowder in there?

also, once Kyrie requested the trade, I think they clinched to Love even more. Before that they probably wouldve traded Love but then got hesitant.

the Cavs seems like they missed out on every player that was on the market. Butler and PG13 were there to be had, by not just the Cavs, but other teams as well. then Bledsoe became available. Avery Bradley probably was always available except they had to wait til he could be traded.

 

[Professor Emeritus]

now this last bit I agree with everything you said, especially about Gilbert pissing it away. Griffin was capable. I believe it was confirmed by Melo that the deal was in place for him and PG both to be traded there on draft night...but even before Melo said that a couple of months ago, SAS had confirmed that they definitely had a deal for PG that was right there and Griffin left while this was in limbo and the deal didnt happen.

Middleton is one of the most underrated players in the league right now. The dude is a stud and a 2-way player.

the lineup you posted is great...but why is Crowder in there?

also, once Kyrie requested the trade, I think they clinched to Love even more. Before that they probably wouldve traded Love but then got hesitant.

the Cavs seems like they missed out on every player that was on the market. Butler and PG13 were there to be had, by not just the Cavs, but other teams as well. then Bledsoe became available. Avery Bradley probably was always available except they had to wait til he could be traded.

Yeah, brain fade on Crowder in there, I guess that would be Frye.

 

[Malta]

even with that pick, with no Bron, Cavs wont be relevant for another 5 years minimum. that pick is going to be a good pick, I have no doubt about it because the first 8 is going to be pretty deep.... but none of those players you mentioned abouve could single-handedly change the fortunes of a bad team, not even Kyrie could as the #1 pick, Davis couldnt, and so on. whatever leverage Gilbert thinks he has, he better think again.

You can sell a fanbase on hope and the development of young players, trading that pick would be idiotic, considering LeBron will probably leave. There isn't a player on the trade market they could use the pick on to get a player good enough to push them past the Warriors, so why bother trading it? They may not be in position to draft one of the top 5 guys, but you can still get a very good player in this draft and maybe next year you can get Rj Barrett, Cam Reddish or Bol Bol to be your franchise player and you will already have another young player to pair him with.

I wouldn't trade that pick.

 

[surv2syn]

You can sell a fanbase on hope and the development of young players, trading that pick would be idiotic, considering LeBron will probably leave. There isn't a player on the trade market they could use the pick on to get a player good enough to push them past the Warriors, so why bother trading it? They may not be in position to draft one of the top 5 guys, but you can still get a very good player in this draft and maybe next year you can get Rj Barrett, Cam Reddish or Bol Bol to be your franchise player and you will already have another young player to pair him with.

I wouldn't trade that pick.

I wouldnt trade it at this point either, its too late. Also, Little is going to be better than Reddish.

 

[Trapperman Dave]

 

[Trapperman Dave]

Bron accomplished what he set out to do he gooch

 

[FAH1223]

 

[Sleepy Walker]

I wouldn't be mad Especially with our history of...ahem...getting lucky in the lottery

Da Gawd Stern isn't around so I don't know about us getting the hookup anymore.

 

[Illeye buckmatic]

Da Gawd Stern isn't around so I don't know about us getting the hookup anymore.

He trained silver well. We got this
#basketballreasons

 

[B...]

Gon sound Crazy but Lebron is really the problem.

He is a great player, but he is not a real leader. And he is too respected so nobody will check him in the organization.

Tyron Lue sitting there with his mouth half open looking like he asking himself random rhetortical questions in his head:
Do defense really win championships?
Will Bron go to the Clippers or Warriors?
Do Chris Paul actually have State Farm?
I wonder if this bish know her meatloaf be dry as fux?
Damn we down by 30?...How that happen?

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