Zapp Brannigan
Captain of the Nimbus
And Cain still throws better combinations and kicks. If JDS were better at this kind of offense, it would have revealed itself during their last two fights.
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The Infamous
Superstar
Proof breh. You're making a statement with little evidence. Cain does throw better kicks, but that's because JDS rarely throws them. Cain's kicks are okay, they're far from game changers though, unlike JDS's striking.
JDS has the best offensive striking in the HW division. As evidenced by the gifs I posted. He's hurt his opponent in every UFC fight [except for the second Cain fight]. He's done this to fighters with elite chins. Let's go through some of them, JDS has either dropped [sometimes repeatedly] or finished the likes of Nelson [best chin in MMA], Werdum [amazing chin], Hunt [one of the best chins in MMA], Carwin [great chin, never finished by strikes], and Cain himself [good chin, with amazing recovery]. I highly highly doubt Cain does the same [with strikes] to the aforementioned fighters.
Did Cain out-strike JDS in the second and third fight? Yes. But, that's because he has the threat of a TD and he does a really good job mixing up his grappling [clinch and TDs] with his striking. He always keeps JDS on his heels and never allows him to unload. If they had a striking only match, JDS wins 7-8 times out of 10. I can guarantee you that JDS will at the bare minimum, drop Cain if that were to happen.
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The Infamous
Superstar
Did you see what happened when Cain gave JDS room to work his striking? He got KO'd. If Cain were to with the same gameplan as the first fight, he would likely get dropped by JDS.
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Zapp Brannigan
Captain of the Nimbus
Proof? Did you see their last fight? It's obvious that it wasn't Cain's takedowns that were doing the job. And do you really think that Cain's KO/TKO record doesn't indicate that his strikes don't hurt people? I don't need to post a bunch of gifs that show him outstriking people that he's head and shoulders above because the proof is in the last fight that they had, and the one before that. Cain's finished everyone that he's beaten also, and your doubts about Cain doing the same to aforementioned fighters is based entirely off of speculation. And considering that JDS couldn't handle the pressure that Cain brought in their fights on the stand-up level, I'm pretty sure that JDS would lose a striking match with Cain at this point. With that said, part of being a great MMA striker is being able to both defend a takedown while getting good offense going. No use in speculating how they'd do in a sport that isn't MMA at this point.
JDS landed some pretty meaningful shots to no avail against Cain. More and more JDS's early win is looking more and more like a lucky punch. At least it would if he weren't a striking specialist to begin with.
So basically what you're trying to argue is that despite not being able to handle Cain's pressure, Cain's combinations, Cain's power, Cain's speed, not being able to get an offense going without sacrificing takedown defense, not being able to get any striking defense going, and not being able to ever really shake Cain with his more meaningful shots early on, that JDS is the better striker.
The Infamous
Superstar
It was the threat of a takedown that was helping Cain out-strike JDS. As a result, JDS would keep his hands low and sacrifice his striking defense in the process. JDS has dropped and finished better strikers than Cain, there's no debating. We're talking about striking and his striking is not head and shoulders above some of the strikers JDS has beaten. Cain has only dropped one good striker, and a good portion of his finishes are due to ground and pound. Do you even watch the fights or you just like to talk out of your ass breh.
In a strictly striking battle, Cain wouldn't have his biggest weapon [his grappling], thus his striking wouldn't be close to as effective. Most knowledgeable fans can make an educated prediction that JDS would out-strike Cain in a striking only fight. It's clear as day breh.
Lucky punch? Get outta here with that BS. I guess JDS's career is full of lucky punches. With that type of luck, dude should play the lottery.
Cain's pressure? I agree. Cain's power? No, he's handled Cain's best punches and kept coming back. I think that's pretty well. Cain's speed? His striking speed? Not really, he couldn't handle the speed of his transitions between grappling to clinching to striking. JDS dropped Cain with an elbow in their 3rd fight, I would consider that very meaningful.
The Infamous
Superstar
Cain got dropped and almost finished twice by Cheick fukking Kongo, JDS would murder Kongo in less than a minute. Cain had to use his wrestling to beat him [Kongo]. It doesn't help his cause when he gets out-striked by a mediocre striker in Kongo.
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The Infamous
Superstar
Overall, JDS has shown better striking than Cain in his UFC career. On the other hand, Cain has shown more effective striking in his fights with JDS. But, looking purely at striking, JDS has the upper-hand.
The Infamous
Superstar
Like for example, look at Gus/Jones. Gus managed to out-grapple Jones [not by much though], but does that mean he's the better wrestler? No.
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The Infamous
Superstar
Another example is GSP, he's managed to out-strike better strikers than himself [Alves, Condit, etc.], but would I say GSP has the better pure striking? No. GSP is similar to Cain in the sense that he does a great job of transitioning his grappling to striking and vice versa, he mixes everything up very well.
Your still at it
Breh give it up. Cain out boxed JDS. Plain and simple. You keep mentioning GSP and his opponents but what you fail to mention is JDS TDD is miles ahead of Condit/Alves and Cain doesn't spam TD at the rate GSP does. JDS was stuffing the majority of Cain's TD early. Why couldn't he get his boxing going? JDS displayed poor flat footwork which is why Cain was easily able to back him against the cage and unload. His gameplan was poor. No circling or forcing Cain to cut off the cage. Compare that to Gil/Sanchez. Anytime Sanchez thought of coming forward with a TD/Strikes Gil lit his ass up with combos. All JDS was able to do was throw wild looping power shots which Cain easily slipped and ripped
The Infamous
Superstar
Your still at it
Alves coming into the GSP fight was known for his outstanding TDD, nice try breh. GSP doesn't spam TDs, what fights have you been watching? He goes for the TD and more times than not, he easily gets them.
JDS couldn't get his boxing going because he couldn't deal with Cain's constant pressure, the threat of getting taken down and clinch work. I'm agreeing with a good portion of what you said, but I'm looking at overall career striking, not just 1-2 fights.
His lack of any gameplan was confusing as hell. His lack of circling was also confusing. It was like at times, JDS allowed himself to get cornered against the cage.
At bolded, I think that JDS knew he had a small window of opportunity to do something huge and his solution was to look for looping and telegraphed strikes. Was it a smart thing to do? No, but he did it anyway
Most fights JDS has looked a lot better in terms of striking. He just looked lost out there, he had that 'deer in headlights' look. Later in the fight, he was fighting on will and heart, when that happens in fighting, technique is usually non-existant.
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The Infamous
Superstar
Who else keeps their hands down and at times, almost allows themselves to get cornered against the octagon? Anderson Silva. It's not a very smart thing to do, but it helps tremendously with TDD.
Alves coming into the GSP fight was known for his outstanding TDD, nice try breh. GSP doesn't spam TDs, what fights have you been watching? He goes for the TD and more times than not, he easily gets them.
JDS couldn't get his boxing going because he couldn't deal with Cain's constant pressure, the threat of getting taken down and clinch work. I'm agreeing with a good portion of what you said, but I'm looking at overall career striking, not just 1-2 fights.
His lack of any gameplan was confusing as hell. His lack of circling was also confusing. It was like at times, JDS allowed himself to get cornered against the cage.
At bolded, I think that JDS knew he had a small window of opportunity to do something huge and his solution was to look for looping and telegraphed strikes. Was it a smart thing to do? No, but he did it anyway
GSP for the past four years has been attempting TD in the tens. The only fight where he didnt spam was against Shields
pez
All Star
Would have, could have, should have. He had 9 and a half rounds to land the right punch and couldn't. Cain is simply the superior fighter in every aspect.
Someone mentioned that Cain had a cracked jaw. I guessed that if Cain did get his jaw cracked, it was likely in the opening seconds. Those were the best shots JDS had of Cain, Stephen.
So UnThotful
Superstar
another thing with JDS, those short elbows were landing good. he needed more of those instead of hitting the home run shot