The Official Tao Te Ching Thread

[selam]

This little book has so much wisdom that I pick up as I go through different phases of my life.

Here's a good translation:

http://www.taoism.net/ttc/complete.htm

Check it out if you haven't. Post your favourite snippets if you have... and we can discuss interpretation.

 

[selam]

Thus the governance of the sage:
Empties their hearts
Fills their bellies
Weakens their ambitions
Strengthens their bones



I've tried to master a few crafts in my life and this passage touched my heart. In the few moments of complete clarity that I have had while attempting to accomplish something....My state can be summarized with these words.

 

[OsO]

i love taoism. love lao tzu. he has wisdom and quotes for days.



1. “The tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao.”

2. “Nature does not hurry, yet everything is accomplished.”

3. “Mastering others is strength. Mastering yourself is true power.”

4. “To see things in the seed, that is genius.”

5. “When the best leader’s work is done the people say: We did it ourselves.”

6. “When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.”

7. “To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders.”

8. “Do the difficult things while they are easy and do the great things while they are small. A journey of a thousand miles must begin with a single step.”

9. “Music in the soul can be heard by the universe.”

10. “At the center of your being you have the answer; you know who you are and you know what you want.”

 

[selam]

Chapter 7

Heaven and Earth are everlasting
The reason Heaven and Earth can last forever
Is that they do not exist for themselves
Thus they can last forever

Therefore the sages:
Place themselves last but end up in front
Are outside of themselves and yet survive
Is it not due to their selflessness?
That is how they can achieve their own goals


That's the entire chapter .

The thing is I can think about this chapter for the rest of my day... trying to figure out what he is really trying to say... and still not be sure.

 

[selam]

It helps to look at different translations. It makes it easier to understand the message instead of just the words...

What he was really trying to get across to the reader. Here's a link to another translation:

http://www.sacred-texts.com/tao/taote.htm

I'll add it to the original post.

 

[selam]

He seems to be implying that there is a higher power.

FOR this power, "Heaven" and "Earth" continue to exist.

They do not exist for themselves. They exist specifically for It.

Whatever he means by "Heaven" and "Earth",

We know that they are higher than human beings...

Maybe Heaven is the sky, the planets, and the rest of the universe.

Maybe Earth is the planet Earth....Mother Earth... The planet that is an actual living organism.

"The Gaia hypothesis -- first articulated by James Lovelock and Lynn Margulis in the 1970s -- holds that Earth's physical and biological processes are inextricably connected to form a self-regulating, essentially sentient, system."
- http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblo...organism-new-study-may-provide-the-proof.html

Human beings are a part of Earth, in the same way that a lung is a part of a human being.

He is saying that They, "Heaven" and "Earth" ONLY continue to exist forever,

BECAUSE they exist FOR the higher power. Whatever It is,

It this story so far: It > "Heaven"and "Earth" > human beings

Chapter 7

Heaven and Earth are everlasting
The reason Heaven and Earth can last forever
Is that they do not exist for themselves
Thus they can last forever

Therefore the sages:
Place themselves last but end up in front
Are outside of themselves and yet survive
Is it not due to their selflessness?
That is how they can achieve their own goals


That's the entire chapter .

The thing is I can think about this chapter for the rest of my day... trying to figure out what he is really trying to say... and still not be sure.

 

[NkrumahWasRight Is Wrong]

By far my favorite book. Read it every now and then and its so simple yet profound. Basically converted me to Taoism, although perhaps thats not accurate phraseology since I do not partake in many of the rituals but believe full in its philosophical tenets.

paraphrasing but "the more you speak of the tao, the less you understand the tao"

i tell that to people who ask about it after i give them a brief synopsis and they think im just trolling them

 

[NkrumahWasRight Is Wrong]

and just to expound a bit more on that point...this thread should be relatively short then

ill participate though despite that since i have such admiration for it

sidenote: im @ chuang's version of the tao but w/e

“Countless words
count less
than the silent balance
between yin and yang”

“Shape clay into a vessel;

It is the space within that makes it useful.
Cut doors and windows for a room;

It is the holes which make it useful.
Therefore benefit comes from what is there;
Usefulness from what is not there.”

“The hard and mighty lie beneath the ground
While the tender and weak dance on the breeze above.”

“Under heaven all can see beauty as beauty only because there is ugliness. All can know good as good only because there is evil.”

The Master's power is like this.
He lets all things come and go
effortlessly, without desire.
He never expects results;
thus he is never disappointed.
He is never disappointed;
thus his spirit never grows old.”

“When the student is ready the teacher will appear. When the student is truly ready... The teacher will Disappear.”

I connect to my perceived truth of these and so many other quotes and have probably applied or tried to apply more of these concepts than any other book/advice/teachings ive ever heard. I also believe that the belief that the basic tenet that Taoism is "going with the flow" is incredibly over-simplified and perceived inaccurately. True Taoism is about "inaction" which then gets inaccurately understood as laziness and lack of total action. Going with the flow and inaction in Taoism isn't about not acting, its about not acting in accordance to the Tao, which in my interpretation is acting out of pocket and trying to seize opportunities or go for things that aren't truly wise or follows the true pattern and forces one to over-exert themselves mentally, spiritually and physically in pursuits that will either render poor results short term, poor results long term, or profound discontent and peacefulness which could be achieved by becoming one with the Tao and being patient enough for the "right" moments

 

[selam]

We need to discuss it with better words so that that the words have meaning. If Lao Tzu lived today what words would he use to describe the Tao. To

say what he said in modern language.

Words are powerful. They can point to a thought, or a feeling... to a certain reality.

We can just be careful not to focus too much on the words, but the meaning behind them instead.

and just to expound a bit more on that point...this thread should be relatively short then

ill participate though despite that since i have such admiration for it

sidenote: im @ chuang's version of the tao but w/e

“Countless words
count less
than the silent balance
between yin and yang”

“Shape clay into a vessel;

It is the space within that makes it useful.
Cut doors and windows for a room;

It is the holes which make it useful.
Therefore benefit comes from what is there;
Usefulness from what is not there.”

“The hard and mighty lie beneath the ground
While the tender and weak dance on the breeze above.”

“Under heaven all can see beauty as beauty only because there is ugliness. All can know good as good only because there is evil.”

The Master's power is like this.
He lets all things come and go
effortlessly, without desire.
He never expects results;
thus he is never disappointed.
He is never disappointed;
thus his spirit never grows old.”

“When the student is ready the teacher will appear. When the student is truly ready... The teacher will Disappear.”

I connect to my perceived truth of these and so many other quotes and have probably applied or tried to apply more of these concepts than any other book/advice/teachings ive ever heard. I also believe that the belief that the basic tenet that Taoism is "going with the flow" is incredibly over-simplified and perceived inaccurately. True Taoism is about "inaction" which then gets inaccurately understood as laziness and lack of total action. Going with the flow and inaction in Taoism isn't about not acting, its about not acting in accordance to the Tao, which in my interpretation is acting out of pocket and trying to seize opportunities or go for things that aren't truly wise or follows the true pattern and forces one to over-exert themselves mentally, spiritually and physically in pursuits that will either render poor results short term, poor results long term, or profound discontent and peacefulness which could be achieved by becoming one with the Tao and being patient enough for the "right" moments

 

[NkrumahWasRight Is Wrong]

We need to discuss it with better words so that that the words have meaning. If Lao Tzu lived today what words would he use to describe the Tao. To

say what he said in modern language.

Words are powerful. They can point to a thought, or a feeling... to a certain reality.

We can just be careful not to focus too much on the words, but the meaning behind them instead.

Eh. I suppose. I dont think he would change anything though. The bolded was the whole point of the short stanzas in the first place. The more it is specifically tried to be explained the more it will deviate from the epistemic truth

 

[IronFist]

Tao 33


Knowing others is wisdom;
Knowing the self is enlightenment.
Mastering others requires force;
Mastering the self needs strength.
He who knows he has enough is rich.
Perseverance is a sign of willpower.
He who stays where he is endures.
To die but not to perish is to be eternally present.

 

[selam]

He is suggesting that the Wise Man,

places himself last at one thing,

in order to end up in front at something else.

With his physical self, he is serving the same It that "Heaven" and "Earth" serve with their physical bodies.

"What is good for It is good for Me" attitude.

This attitude and ability gives him the ability to survive.

He becomes an asset to It

The success of It is tied to his success and so he continues to succeed.

Chapter 7

Heaven and Earth are everlasting
The reason Heaven and Earth can last forever
Is that they do not exist for themselves
Thus they can last forever

Therefore the sages:
Place themselves last but end up in front
Are outside of themselves and yet survive
Is it not due to their selflessness?
That is how they can achieve their own goals


That's the entire chapter .

The thing is I can think about this chapter for the rest of my day... trying to figure out what he is really trying to say... and still not be sure.

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

Gonna check this out. This sounds pretty cool

 

[selam]

We're just doing it to communicate ideas...

But yes, conversation in general can lead to a misunderstanding... not just with the Tao.

Words can only be so good...They can't capture the real thing(feeling, image, idea, emotion).

They can't capture the Tao.

We use words that point AT the Tao.
Just like we use words to point AT a feeling

Eh. I suppose. I dont think he would change anything though. The bolded was the whole point of the short stanzas in the first place. The more it is specifically tried to be explained the more it will deviate from the epistemic truth

 

[selam]

I used to think this guy was a fraud back in the day for no real reason....

He knows what he is talking about.

Eckhart Tolle: