The W and Iron Flag are both very underrated

[mitter]

I listened to these albums A LOT over the years. Both loaded with quality tracks, banging from end to end, nothing that needs to be skipped. I think they never got the appreciation they deserved simply because people had extremely high expectations. (The second round of Wu-Tang solos is underrated for similar reasons.)

The W

My main complaint was that there were too many songs with just 2-3 emcees. I wish there were more posse cuts with 4-5 or more of them on the mic. Also, I like "Gravel Pit," but it was not the strongest song on the album, and making it a single was perhaps not the best idea. But there were so many things I loved. The more experimental songs like "I Can't Go To Sleep" and "Jah World" worked well, the guest spots were really good (Nas absolutely killed it, and so did Redman. My favorite songs are "Chamber Music," "Hollow Bones," "Let My N----- Live" and the GZA interlude after "Conditioner."



Iron Flag

I loved this album even more than The W. It had more of the raw, Wu energy IMO. My favorite songs are "In The Hood," "Rules," "Uzi," "Y'all Been Warned," and "Babies."

 

[Mandizi]

"Uzi" and "Iron Flag" are my sh1t off the latter album. Both albums suffered from the lack of ODB appearances.

 

[BulletProof]

Agreed.

 

[Billy Ocean]

I agree with the W. Very, very dope album.

I'm not a fan of Iron Flag.

 

[mitter]

I agree with the W. Very, very dope album.

I'm not a fan of Iron Flag.

What made you not like Iron Flag?

 

[Funcrusher]

The W is 4.5/5 to me, Iron Flag on about the same level as 8 Diagrams. The song Iron Flag tho is out of this world.

 

[chunky_mcdaniels]

‘Something in the slum went rum pa pum pum’

 

[SonnyDecay]

Iron Flag wasnt all that but I still play In The Hood, Yall Been Warned, Radioactive. The W is mostly fire

 

[Heavy_Handz]

I didn’t like The W at all when it released. Too many weak beats. The RZA was mostly cooked at this point. I liked One Blood Under W, Let My nikkas Live & Redbull was cool but Gravel Pit was corny, Hollow Bones that beat was annoying and too basic, Protect Ya Neck (The Jump Off) beat was corny, Conditioner W/Snoop was wack, the joint with Busta was cool I guess. It just didn’t feel like a real Wu-Tang album. The quality of the beats they rhymed over were drastically inferior to previous Wu-Tang albums and it lacked the really gritty hardcore posse cut we were used to hearing them drop. Such a worse album than Wu-Tang Forever. In real time this signaled the end of an era. Supreme Clientele >>>>>>>>>>> The W.

 

[mitter]

I didn’t like The W at all when it released. Too many weak beats. The RZA was mostly cooked at this point. I liked One Blood Under W, Let My nikkas Live & Redbull was cool but Gravel Pit was corny, Hollow Bones that beat was annoying and too basic, Protect Ya Neck (The Jump Off) beat was corny, Conditioner W/Snoop was wack, the joint with Busta was cool I guess. It just didn’t feel like a real Wu-Tang album. The quality of the beats they rhymed over were drastically inferior to previous Wu-Tang albums and it lacked the really gritty hardcore posse cut we were used to hearing them drop. Such a worse album than Wu-Tang Forever. In real time this signaled the end of an era. Supreme Clientele >>>>>>>>>>> The W.

I can appreciate some of this criticism (though I don't understand the comment about the "Hollow Bones" beat, tbh).

I do think the beats from The W lacked the trademark Wu sound in some ways (and I think Iron Flag did a better job capturing that sound). "Gravel Pit," "The Monument," and "Do You Really" especially stand out as lacking the Wu sound.

Naming "Protect Ya Neck (The Jump Off)" after "Protect Ya Neck" was unfortunate and set it up to be criticized. I admit it didn't have the most amazing beat, but I didn't think it was wack to the point that it ruined the track, and it was easy enough to focus on the lyrics. I was just happy to get a cut with everyone (minus ODB, of course). I didn't like "Conditioner" at first, but it really grew on me. I ended up appreciating how Snoop meshed with ODB's weirdness, but I think Snoop was still somewhat out of place and the song would have been better with someone else on it. Overall, the album had too many guest spots for a 13-track album by a group featuring 9 (or 10) emcees. I thought Redman and Nas were both great and fit in really well on their respective tracks, but Snoop and Busta didn't add anything and were unnecessary. Also, two songs featuring Junior Reid were probably one too many.


What did you think of Iron Flag?

 

[Heavy_Handz]

I can appreciate some of this criticism (though I don't understand the comment about the "Hollow Bones" beat, tbh).

I do think the beats from The W lacked the trademark Wu sound in some ways (and I think Iron Flag did a better job capturing that sound). "Gravel Pit," "The Monument," and "Do You Really" especially stand out as lacking the Wu sound.

Naming "Protect Ya Neck (The Jump Off)" after "Protect Ya Neck" was unfortunate and set it up to be criticized. I admit it didn't have the most amazing beat, but I didn't think it was wack to the point that it ruined the track, and it was easy enough to focus on the lyrics. I was just happy to get a cut with everyone (minus ODB, of course). I didn't like "Conditioner" at first, but it really grew on me. I ended up appreciating how Snoop meshed with ODB's weirdness, but I think Snoop was still somewhat out of place and the song would have been better with someone else on it. Overall, the album had too many guest spots for a 13-track album by a group featuring 9 (or 10) emcees. I thought Redman and Nas were both great and fit in really well on their respective tracks, but Snoop and Busta didn't add anything and were unnecessary. Also, two songs featuring Junior Reid were probably one too many.


What did you think of Iron Flag?

I just thought Hollow Bones was just offbeat & it almost just sounded like a caracature of traditional RZA Wu sounding beats if I make sense. Iron Flag I absolutely disliked more than The W. I hated that Uzi (Pinky Ring) track that shyt was terrible. The beats at this point were getting unbearable to me. Y’all Been Warned was dope tho 8 Disgrams was the nail in the coffin.

 

[MJ Truth]

The W was the first CD I ever bought first day. I remember making my mom take me to the mall directly after a soccer game so I could cop that with the only $13 or so I had lol.

 

[DreadBrown]

I love The W because starks is one of my favourite rappers and he was in Supreme Clientele mode for all his verses

‘I can’t go to sleep’ is phenomenal

 

[boskey]

I love The W because starks is one of my favourite rappers and he was in Supreme Clientele mode for all his verses

‘I can’t go to sleep’ is phenomenal

FOR THOSE THAT MURDERED ME SHALL STAND BEFORE GOD

The W is a personal classic. Rza does not get enough credit for his production on that

 

[En Sabah Nur]

I know the majority did not like it, but 'Chrome Wheels' slaps
May not sound Wu, but it's most well aged production on Iron Flag to me along with Babies and Iron Flag

The W is an album that only sounds good in winter