Why America Is Moving Left

tru_m.a.c

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okay, fair question.... i'll have to say compared to the 90s... i saw a segment on tv that was talking about how rural america (mostly conservative) and urban america (mostly liberal) were moving apart in areas other than just politics, like the places we shop, hang around, interests, tastes in music.. although i will admit it wasn't compared to a particular time frame......

It's true that we are back to 1960s level of segregation and are worse off than apartheid south africa. That doesn't mean that we had a Garden of Eden harmony in the 90s. Much of the "shock and awe" comes from the children of segregationist who lived the last 5 decades with their heads stuck in the sand and are now forced to deal with the consequences of policies that they voted for or enacted.

Rural america and urban america have had separate identities since the 18th century. It's really nothing new. Each state has to deal with a delicate balance amongst its rural and urban populations. When you factor in the reality that immigrants/minorities follow the jobs, which are located in urban centers, it's only natural that you'll see competing cultures develop.

another reason i feel america is becoming increasingly polarized is the rise of the internet... the internet allows people to surround themselves with only the information they want to hear...

What do you think folks did when they only had newspapers?

i don't have data to back up either of my assertions (i freely admit this) and i am mostly relying on anecdotes to base my belief, but i truly feel the country is becoming more polarized... civil war era type polarized, eh i doubt it.. but certainly i feel like it is becoming more polarized than the 90s and 2000s.....

The money making 90s gave us a false sense of security like the roaring 20s.
 

Tate

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There are some parts of this article that I disagree with:



What's going on today is NOT left-wing militancy, and embracing it as such severely undermines the message of organizations such as the Black Panthers and organizations today continuing the fight for judicial and economic equality.

Yeah, theres actually a striking lack of militancy within BLM and other left wing groups, including the labor movement.

The idea that "America is Moving Left" gives the false impression that there were not/are not large populations in America aligned with the current platform. In my opinion, these paragraphs show the deliberate omission of black politics on the national stage - outside of calls to end racial inequality and police brutality.

Reagan - we were against that.
Vietnam - we were against that.
Lowering tax rates - we were against that.
Iraq war - we were against that.
School to prison pipeline - we were against that.
Drug war - we were against that.
Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere - we fought for that.

This article should be called "Why White America is finally catching up."

Of course the point against this is that white america isn't catching up here in a signifigant way, the demographic trends are just building upon the center left to far left base of America's population. The Reagan democrats aren't really coming back around so much as they're becoming less important
 

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AND...things really aren't THAT bad.

Thats what you have to just come out and say.

Dudes acting like we live in some 3rd world shyt here.

The definition of "struggling" in the USA is basically not having what the next guy has for leisure. I'm gonna catch heat for this, but I chalk this up to most of the people on HL not having passports.

Well yea.. things really aren't that bad :skip:
 

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It's true that we are back to 1960s level of segregation and are worse off than apartheid south africa. That doesn't mean that we had a Garden of Eden harmony in the 90s. Much of the "shock and awe" comes from the children of segregationist who lived the last 5 decades with their heads stuck in the sand and are now forced to deal with the consequences of policies that they voted for or enacted.

Rural america and urban america have had separate identities since the 18th century. It's really nothing new. Each state has to deal with a delicate balance amongst its rural and urban populations. When you factor in the reality that immigrants/minorities follow the jobs, which are located in urban centers, it's only natural that you'll see competing cultures develop.



What do you think folks did when they only had newspapers?



The money making 90s gave us a false sense of security like the roaring 20s.
i have no idea what you're getting at... i never said anything about a garden of eden harmony... the og post posited the idea that america is becoming more liberal... i disagreed, stating that america is becoming more polarized... something can be less than the garden of eden and still get worse

yes rural and urban america have competing economic agendas, but people move to different locations based on their politics and lifestyles... not only is the polarization between liberals and conservatives visible by looking at the different circles people choose to run in, you can also see it by the candidates that are getting elected... when obama first got elected there was a decent number of moderate republicans and blue dog democrats in congress and the senate... fast forward 7 years later and a lot of republicans have been voted/forced out as being labeled rinos (boehner, cantor) and a lot of blue dog democrats faced a similar fate (landrieu, Only Four of the 34 House Democrats Who Voted Against Obamacare Are Still in Congress)... this has led to a lot of polarization at the federal level...

newspapers? well when there were newspapers and nightly news programs were the predominant source of information there were a lot fewer news sources and we almost all had to depend on the same sources.... there are things people believe and feel that would never get much clout in a serious newspaper or news show, like obama being a secret muslim who was born in kenya.... most serious conservative and liberal newspapers and news shows would discount that notion... however there are plenty of websites, forums, chat rooms, etc, that take those ideas as serious and even argue they are accurate.... honestly, anything, and i mean ANYTHING, you want to believe there is a website or group somewhere on the internet that will confirm your beliefs are accurate... before the internet one would have a hard time connecting with these types of people and probably would keep loony ideas to themselves...
 

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i have no idea what you're getting at... i never said anything about a garden of eden harmony... the og post posited the idea that america is becoming more liberal... i disagreed, stating that america is becoming more polarized... something can be less than the garden of eden and still get worse
Be honest, did you read the article? I hate when people post in threads without reading the article. I used to highlight key points because cats are lazy, but I don't have the time to do that anymore. Let me help you:


It’s true that Americans have grown more conservative on some issues over the past few years. Support for gun control has dropped in the Obama era, even as the president and other Democrats have pursued it more aggressively. Republicans also enjoy a renewed advantage on combatting international terrorism, an issue whose salience has grown with the rise of the Islamic State. Still, in an era when government has grown more intrusive, African American activists have grown more confrontational, and long-standing assumptions about sexual orientation and gender identity have been toppled, most Americans are not yelling “stop,” as they began doing in the mid-1960s. The biggest reason: We’re not dealing with the same group of Americans.


On issue after issue, it is the young who are most pleased with the liberal policy shifts of the Obama era, and most eager for more. In 2014, Pew found that Americans under 30 were twice as likely as Americans 65 and older to say the police do a “poor” job of “treating racial, ethnic groups equally” and more than twice as likely to say the grand jury in Ferguson was wrong not to charge Darren Wilson in Michael Brown’s death. According to YouGov, more than one in three Americans 65 and older think being transgender is morally wrong. Among Americans under 30, the ratio is less than one in five. Millennials—Americans roughly 18 to 34 years old—are 21 percentage points less likely than those 65 and older to say that immigrants “burden” the United States and 25 points more likely to say they “strengthen” the country. Millennials are also 17 points more likely to have a favorable view of Muslims. It is largely because of them that the percentage of Americans who want government to “promote traditional values” is now lower than at any other time since Gallup began asking the question in 1993, and that the percentage calling themselves “socially liberal” now equals the percentage calling themselves “socially conservative” for the first time since Gallup began asking that question in 1999.

Millennials are also sustaining support for bigger government. The young may not have a high opinion of the institutions that represent them, but they nonetheless want those institutions to do more. According to a July Wall Street Journal/ABC poll, Americans over 35 were four points more likely to say the government is doing too much than to say it is doing too little. Millennials, meanwhile, by a margin of 23 points, think it’s doing too little. In 2011, Pew found that while the oldest Americans supported repealing health-care reform by 29 percentage points, Millennials favored expanding it by 17 points. They were also 25 points more likely than those 65 and older to approve of Occupy Wall Street and 36 points more favorable toward socialism, which they actuallypreferred to capitalism, 49 percent to 46 percent. As the Pew report put it, “Millennials, at least so far, hold ‘baked in’ support for a more activist government.”


This is even true among Republican Millennials. The press often depicts American politics as a battle pitting ever more liberal Democrats against ever more conservative Republicans. Among the young, however, that’s inaccurate. Young Democrats may be more liberal than their elders, but so are young Republicans. According to Pew, a clear majority of young Republicans say immigrants strengthen America, half say corporate profits are too high, and almost half say stricter environmental laws are worth the cost—answers that sharply distinguish them from older members of the GOP. Young Republicans are more likely to favor legalizing marijuana than the oldest Democrats, and almost as likely to support gay marriage. Asked how they categorize themselves ideologically, more than two-thirds of Republican Millennials call themselves either “liberal” or “mixed,” while fewer than one-third call themselves “conservative.” Among the oldest Republicans, that breakdown is almost exactly reversed.


In the face of such data, conservatives may wish to reassure themselves that Millennials will move right as they age. But a 2007 study in the American Sociological Review notes that the data “contradict commonly held assumptions that aging leads to conservatism.” The older Americans who are today more conservative than Millennials were more conservative in their youth, too. In 1984 and 1988, young voters backed Ronald Reagan and George H. W. Bush by large margins. Millennials are not liberal primarily because they are young. They are liberal because their formative political experiences were the Iraq War and the Great Recession, and because they make up the most secular, most racially diverse, least nationalistic generation in American history. And none of that is likely to change.
 

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Be honest, did you read the article? I hate when people post in threads without reading the article. I used to highlight key points because cats are lazy, but I don't have the time to do that anymore. Let me help you:
this is some eco-chamber shyt....the GOP ain't giving a fukk about democrats or the left.

Obama might have made the liberal's bellies feel warm, but theres a lot of people who want nothing to do with it and we're pretending like this doesn't exist.
 

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this is some eco-chamber shyt....the GOP ain't giving a fukk about democrats or the left.

Obama might have made the liberal's bellies feel warm, but theres a lot of people who want nothing to do with it and we're pretending like this doesn't exist.
That is not the point of the article. The entire point is about how politicians have to govern and how going forward it's going to be more center-left then the center-right. So the next Republican will be more to the left than Bush and the next Dem will be more to the left than Obama. I don't have the time to feed the article to you bit by bit with annotations. Half of the article is blaming Obama's failures for some of the shift to the left, but of course you speak without reading. You straight up saw a title and started talking.
 

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That is not the point of the article. The entire point is about how politicians have to govern and how going forward it's going to be more center-left then the center-right. So the next Republican will be more to the left than Bush and the next Dem will be more to the left than Obama. I don't have the time to feed the article to you bit by bit with annotations. Half of the article is blaming Obama's failures for some of the shift to the left, but of course you speak without reading. You straight up saw a title and started talking.
I read the article quickly...I didn't see that at all.

It just seems like massive projection and insular thinking

Just cause its a long article doesn't mean its any more legitimate or grounded in reality.

These are all think pieces and predictions at the end of the day, don't let that get away from you.
 

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i have no idea what you're getting at... i never said anything about a garden of eden harmony... the og post posited the idea that america is becoming more liberal... i disagreed, stating that america is becoming more polarized... something can be less than the garden of eden and still get worse

And I stated compared to what? You stated the 90s. In my post I said that only people who have no grasp of the 90s feel this way.

I made the "garden of eden" statement to mock the idea that one would compare 2015 to the 90s, as if things were sooo much better back then, that we now look at it as "better" and 2015 as "more polarized."

yes rural and urban america have competing economic agendas, but people move to different locations based on their politics and lifestyles... not only is the polarization between liberals and conservatives visible by looking at the different circles people choose to run in, you can also see it by the candidates that are getting elected... when obama first got elected there was a decent number of moderate republicans and blue dog democrats in congress and the senate... fast forward 7 years later and a lot of republicans have been voted/forced out as being labeled rinos (boehner, cantor) and a lot of blue dog democrats faced a similar fate (landrieu, Only Four of the 34 House Democrats Who Voted Against Obamacare Are Still in Congress)... this has led to a lot of polarization at the federal level...

As the article pointed out, this polarization at the federal level was evident in the 90s with the wave of Conservative Christians that were elected to combat Bill Clinton.

newspapers? well when there were newspapers and nightly news programs were the predominant source of information there were a lot fewer news sources and we almost all had to depend on the same sources.... there are things people believe and feel that would never get much clout in a serious newspaper or news show, like obama being a secret muslim who was born in kenya.... most serious conservative and liberal newspapers and news shows would discount that notion... however there are plenty of websites, forums, chat rooms, etc, that take those ideas as serious and even argue they are accurate.... honestly, anything, and i mean ANYTHING, you want to believe there is a website or group somewhere on the internet that will confirm your beliefs are accurate... before the internet one would have a hard time connecting with these types of people and probably would keep loony ideas to themselves...

So much is wrong about this response. When there were newspapers and nightly news programs, you still had to deal with misinformation around drug laws, minorities, and the civil rights movement. Nightly news programs didn't stop MLK or Malcolm from being labeled a criminal and mischief.

Per wiki, the first American newspaper was introduced in the 18th century. You really want to believe that trash articles began with the invention of the Internet? Need I remind you about the popular opinion on the native population, slavery, womens issues, immigration, and the red scare - just to name a few?

You really believe that before the internet it was hard for groups of racist white americans to congregate? I could've sworn we fought a war over this. An entire state was formed because of a weird man from upstate NY with a loony idea.

There is nothing that is happening now, that didn't happen in the past and at a worse level. Please stop with the hyperbole.
 

mc_brew

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wow, i didn't realize how controversial a simple post stating i think america is becoming more polarized as opposed to more liberal would be... now i'm throwing out hyperbole... lol... okay, we're all just holding hands and singing kumbaya... let me know when all these liberals on both sides of the aisle show up at the polls and start voting in more liberal candidates....
 
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