Why do some people still call the JFK assassination a "Conspiracy Theory"

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

Oswald tried to kill a general and was plotting to kill nixon before he killed jfk. Lone white gunman isnt a stretch.


The conspiracy is why ruby killed him

yep...

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

You all gotta listen to this.

@ineedsleep212 @jayshiggs @storyteller ya'll listened to this?

whats crazy is that I remember hearing about this and hearing nothing else...

And its crazy that only two years ago did it come out that Oswald met with a KGB officer in Mexico City!

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

I believe in some of the layers, (Mob ties to the Kenddeys, Castro, Cuba, Chicago, all real) but I tend to think Oswalsd acted alone. It's easier to believe that the death of such a powerful, important person was due to some massive, multi-layered, transnational conspiracy, rather than a lone, disturbed person, who felt inadequate about himself murdered the President of the United States.

fair

 

[CASHAPP]

fair

Its possible that Oswald was the only trigger man that day AND it was conspiracy.

A lot of folks don't think about that tho.

The fight is always one vs the other

Did y’all hear about a theory that one of the Secret Service agents behind Kennedy accidentally killed him with a headshot when he was gathering his gun?

apparently that was a theory for decades but I never heard about it until recently. The ballistic expert who gave the theory even wrote a book about it years after Kennedy died and the Agent waited until the 90s to sue...making it look even more sus

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/philly/news/Shooting_holes_in_theory_that_a_Secret_Service_agent_killed_President_Kennedy.html%3foutputType=amp

What makes me also more suspicious is if he didn’t hit Kennedy then who did he hit?

When I say that what I mean is if you take your gun out in a situation like that you must have shot or attempted to shoot somewhere? Is there a record if him doing so

Then there is the chance he shot kennedy and got spooked and froze...

 

[Professor Emeritus]

I don't really know enough about this either way.


The Bobby Kennedy killing is the one that looks mad suspicious though. Damn near EVERYTHING about that one doesn't fit. And JFK was just another president doing the same shyt as the others, whereas Bobby was coming in to change the system.

His career:

His tenure is best known for its advocacy for the civil rights movement, the fight against organized crime and the Mafia, and involvement in U.S. foreign policy related to Cuba. After his brother's assassination, he remained in office in the Johnson Administration for several months. He left to run for the United States Senate from New York in 1964 and defeated Republican incumbent Kenneth Keating. In office, Kennedy opposed racial discrimination and U.S. involvement in the Vietnam War. He was an advocate for issues related to human rights and social justice and formed relationships with Martin Luther King Jr. and Cesar Chavez.

In 1968, Kennedy became a leading candidate for the Democratic nomination for the presidency by appealing to poor, African American, Hispanic, Catholic, and young voters. His main challenger in the race was Senator Eugene McCarthy. Shortly after winning the California primary around midnight on June 5, 1968, Kennedy was mortally wounded when shot with a pistol by Sirhan Sirhan, a 24-year-old Palestinian, allegedly in retaliation for his support of Israel following the 1967 Six-Day War. Kennedy died the following morning. Sirhan was arrested, tried, and convicted, though Kennedy's assassination, like his brother's, continues to be the subject of widespread analysis and numerous conspiracy theories.

He made some serious errors as AG during the early part of the civil rights movement but you could see him becoming more and more invested in it as time went on and practically everything good that JFK did in relation to civil rights was really Bobby's doing. By the time he was a senator he was damn near a fukking militant:

In June 1966, he visited apartheid-era South Africa accompanied by his wife, Ethel, and a few aides. The tour was greeted with international praise at a time when few politicians dared to entangle themselves in the politics of South Africa. He spoke out against the oppression of the native population, and was welcomed by the black population as though he were a visiting head of state. In an interview with Look magazine he said:

"At the University of Natal in Durban, I was told the church to which most of the white population belongs teaches apartheid as a moral necessity. A questioner declared that few churches allow black Africans to pray with the white because the Bible says that is the way it should be, because God created Negroes to serve. 'But suppose God is black', I replied. 'What if we go to Heaven and we, all our lives, have treated the Negro as an inferior, and God is there, and we look up and He is not white? What then is our response?' There was no answer. Only silence."

On January 28, 1967, Kennedy began a ten-day stay in Europe, meeting Harold Wilson in London and advising him to tell President Johnson about his belief that the ongoing Vietnam conflict was wrong. Upon returning to the U.S. in early February, he was confronted by the press who asked him if his conversations abroad had negatively impacted American foreign relations.


He also visited the Mississippi Delta as a member of the Senate committee reviewing the effectiveness of 'War on Poverty' programs, particularly that of the Economic Opportunity Act of 1964. Marian Wright Edelman described Kennedy as "deeply moved and outraged" by the sight of the starving children living in the economically abysmal climate, changing her impression of him from "tough, arrogant, and politically driven." Edelman noted further that the senator requested she call on Martin Luther King Jr. to bring the impoverished to Washington, D.C., to make them more visible, leading to the creation of the Poor People's Campaign.

Kennedy worked on the Senate Labor Committee at the time of the workers' rights activism of Cesar Chavez, Dolores Huerta, and the National Farm Workers Association (NFWA). At the request of labor leader Walter Reuther, who had previously marched with and provided money to Chavez, Kennedy flew out to Delano, California, to investigate the situation. Although little attention was paid to the first two committee hearings in March 1966 for legislation to include farm workers by an amendment of the National Labor Relations Act, Kennedy's attendance at the third hearing brought media coverage. Biographer Thomas wrote that Kennedy was moved after seeing the conditions of the workers, who he deemed were being taken advantage of. Chavez stressed to Kennedy that migrant workers needed to be recognized as human beings. Kennedy later engaged in an exchange with Kern County sheriff Leroy Galyen where he criticized the sheriff's deputies for taking photographs of "people on picket lines."

As a senator, he was popular among African Americans and other minorities including Native Americans and immigrant groups. He spoke forcefully in favor of what he called the "disaffected", the impoverished, and "the excluded", thereby aligning himself with leaders of the civil rights struggle and social justice campaigners, leading the Democratic party in pursuit of a more aggressive agenda to eliminate perceived discrimination on all levels. He supported desegregation busing, integration of all public facilities, the Voting Rights Act of 1965, and anti-poverty social programs to increase education, offer opportunities for employment, and provide health care for African Americans. Consistent with President Kennedy's Alliance for Progress, he also placed increasing emphasis on human rights as a central focus of U.S. foreign policy.

His campaign came out of nowhere - he ran AGAINST the incumbent LBJ (his own brother's VP) and completely against the will of the establishment, but a desire to end the war in Vietnam, fight against poverty, and carry on the battle for civil rights made him do it.

In 1968 President Johnson prepared to run for re-election. In January, faced with what was widely considered an unrealistic race against an incumbent president, Kennedy stated that he would not seek the presidency. After the Tet Offensive in Vietnam in early February 1968, he received a letter from writer Pete Hamill that said poor people kept pictures of President Kennedy on their walls and that Kennedy had an "obligation of staying true to whatever it was that put those pictures on those walls."

Kennedy traveled to Delano, California, to meet with civil rights activist César Chávez, who was on a 25-day hunger strike showing his commitment to nonviolence. It was on this visit to California that Kennedy decided he would challenge Johnson for the presidency.

Kennedy ran on a platform of racial and economic justice, non-aggression in foreign policy, decentralization of power, and social change. A crucial element of his campaign was an engagement with the young, whom he identified as being the future of a reinvigorated American society based on partnership and equality. His policy objectives did not sit well with the business community, where he was viewed as something of a fiscal liability, opposed as they were to the tax increases necessary to fund social programs. At one of his university speeches (Indiana University Medical School), he was asked, "Where are we going to get the money to pay for all these new programs you're proposing?" He replied to the medical students, about to enter lucrative careers, "From you."

He attended King's funeral, accompanied by Jacqueline and Ted Kennedy. He was described as being the "only white politician to hear only cheers and applause."

 

[Professor Emeritus]

Bobby Kennedy's killing was sus as fukk:

Kennedy scored a major victory when he won the California primary. He addressed his supporters shortly after midnight on June 5, 1968, in a ballroom at The Ambassador Hotel in Los Angeles, California. Leaving the ballroom, he went through the hotel kitchen after being told it was a shortcut to a press room. In a crowded kitchen passageway, Kennedy turned to his left and shook hands with hotel busboy Juan Romero just as Sirhan Sirhan, a 24-year-old Palestinian, opened fire with a .22-caliber revolver. Kennedy was hit three times, and five other people were wounded.

The location of Kennedy's wounds suggested that his assailant had stood behind him, but witnesses said that Sirhan stood facing west, about a yard away from Kennedy, as he moved through the pantry facing east.[4] This has led to the suggestion that a second gunman actually fired the fatal shot, a possibility supported by Chief Medical Examiner-Coroner for the County of Los Angeles Thomas Noguchi, who stated that the fatal shot was behind Kennedy's right ear and had been fired at a distance of approximately one inch.

Sirhan's .22-caliber Iver Johnson Cadet revolver contained eight rounds, which were all fired. Since the assassination took place in a tight, confined pantry, all bullets became embedded in the walls, the ceiling and the victims. Three bullets hit Kennedy; two stayed in his body and another tore through his arm. The five bullets that hit the other five victims stayed in their bodies, leaving a bullet that would have been lodged in the room itself. The LAPD found three bullet holes in the foam ceiling, and concluded that a bullet must have ricocheted through the ceiling before turning back and hitting a person. This explanation had a major flaw: there were two bullet holes in the door frame to the pantry. The LAPD does not acknowledge this, but the press took photos of the bullet holes showing police personnel pointing at them and measuring them. Martin Patrusky, a hotel waiter, remembered being told by officers that they had removed two bullets from the door frame. But the LAPD removed the door frame and the ceiling tiles and later incinerated them.[10] Robert Kennedy's son, Robert Kennedy Jr., later said that "There were too many bullets," and that "You can't fire 13 shots out of an eight-shot gun."

In 2007, analysis of an audio recording[12] of the shooting made that night by freelance reporter Stanislaw Pruszynski appeared to indicate, according to forensic expert Philip van Praag, that at least 13 shots were fired.[4] Van Praag also said the recording revealed at least two instances in which the time between shots was shorter than humanly possible and that different resonances indicated there was more than one gun.[13] According to Van Praag, the firing of more than eight shots was independently corroborated by forensic audio specialists Wes Dooley and Paul Pegas of Audio Engineering Associates, forensic audio and ballistics expert Eddy B. Brixen,[citation needed] and audio specialist Phil Spencer Whitehead of the Georgia Institute of Technology.

In 1975, a Los Angeles judge convened a panel of seven experts in forensics to examine ballistic evidence. They found that the three bullets that hit Kennedy were all fired from the same gun, but could not find a match between these bullets and Sirhan's revolver. They accused DeWayne Wolfer, the lead crime scene investigator who had testified at trial that a bullet taken from Kennedy's body was from Sirhan's revolver, of running a careless investigation. The forensic experts urged further investigation. An internal police document, which was later released, concluded that "Kennedy and Weisel bullets not fired from same gun" and "Kennedy bullet not fired from Sirhan's revolver."[16]

On November 26, 2011, Sirhan's defense attorneys William F. Pepper and Laurie Dusek filed a 62-page brief in federal court asserting that a bullet used as evidence to convict Sirhan was switched with another bullet at the crime scene. The brief claims that this was done because the bullet taken from Kennedy's neck did not match Sirhan's gun. Pepper and Dusek claim that the new evidence is sufficient to find Sirhan not guilty under the law.[17]

Thane Eugene Cesar has frequently been cited as the most likely candidate for a second gunman.[18] Cesar had been employed by Ace Guard Service to protect Kennedy at the Ambassador Hotel. This was not his full-time job; during the day he worked as a maintenance plumber at the Lockheed Aircraft plant in Burbank, a job that required security clearance from the Department of Defense. He worked there from 1966 until losing his job in 1971. Author Dan Moldea wrote that in 1973 Cesar began working at Hughes, a job he held for seven years and which Cesar said required the second-highest clearance level at the plant.[19]

When interviewed, Cesar stated that he did draw a gun at the scene of the shooting, but insisted the weapon was a Rohm .38, not a .22, the caliber of the bullets found in Kennedy. He also said he got knocked down after the first shot and was unable to fire his gun. The LAPD, which interviewed Cesar shortly after the shooting, did not regard him as a suspect and did not ask to see his gun.[20]

Cesar stated that he did own a .22-caliber Harrington & Richardson pistol, and he showed it to LAPD sergeant P. E. O'Steen on June 24, 1968.[21] But when the LAPD interviewed Cesar three years later, he claimed that he had sold the gun before the assassination to a man named Jim Yoder. William W. Turner tracked down Yoder in October 1972. Yoder still had the receipt for the H&R pistol, which was dated September 6, 1968, and bore Cesar's signature, indicating that Cesar had sold the pistol three months after Kennedy's assassination, contradicting his 1971 claim that he had sold the weapon months before it.[21]

Some of the witnesses stated that they observed a woman in a polka-dot dress in various locations throughout the Ambassador Hotel before and after the assassination.[26] One witness, Kennedy campaign worker Sandra Serrano, reported that around 11:30 p.m. she was sitting outside on a stairway that led to the Embassy Ballroom when a woman and two men, one of whom Serrano later stated was Sirhan, walked past her up the stairs.[26] Serrano said that around 30 minutes later, she heard noises that sounded like the backfire of an automobile, then saw the woman and one of the men running from the scene.[26] She stated that the woman exclaimed, "We shot him, we shot him!"[26] According to Serrano, when she asked the woman to whom she referred, the woman said "Senator Kennedy."[26] A visibly frazzled Serrano related her account to NBC's Sander Vanocur soon after the shooting.[27]

Another witness, Evan Freed, also saw the girl in the polka-dot dress.[28] Another reported seeing a girl in a polka-dot dress with Sirhan at various times during the evening, including in the kitchen area where the assassination took place.[29][30] Serrano stated that before her encounter with the polka-dot dress girl, she heard a series of shots that sounded like a car backfiring.[31]

In 1974, retired LAPD officer Paul Sharaga told a newsman with KMPC in Los Angeles that as he was responding to the shooting in the hotel, an elderly couple reported to him that they saw a couple in their early 20s, one of whom was a woman in a polka-dot dress. The couple were smiling and shouting "We shot him... we killed Kennedy... we shot him... we killed him". Sharaga also stated that he filed official reports of the incident, but that they disappeared and were never investigated.[34][35]

Another conspiracy theory relates to a Manchurian candidate hypothesis, that Sirhan was psychologically programmed by persons unknown to commit the murder, that he was not aware of his actions at the time and that his mind was "wiped" in the aftermath by the conspirators so that he would have no memory of the event or of the people who "programmed" him.[23] This theory was supported by psychologist and hypnosis expert Dr. Eduard Simson-Kallas after 35 hours of work with Sirhan in San Quentin Prison in 1969.[24] Sirhan claimed then, and has continued to claim, to have no memory of the assassination or its aftermath. Sirhan’s lawyers in 2010 accused the CIA of hypnotizing Sirhan and making him “an involuntary participant.”[25]

 

[CSquare43]

I’m not a conspiracy theorist but there’s so many layers to it that it makes my head hurt. It could be be pretty close to the official story or more along the lines of the craziest scenarios.

the one that Fukks with me is that at the height of his Marine training he was not a crack shot. His last shooting scores barely qualified for the lowest tier for marines. I mean that means he was probably still a good shot compared to others in the military and regular people but look at what he did or supposedly did. 6 floors up, almost 300 feet away he hit the pres in the head/neck with 2/3 shots on a moving motorcade with a shytty rifle. He also had to time his shots fast, right when the motorcade got out from behind trees.

Having been to that spot, I was really surprised just how small the footprint where this all went down is. It sounds a lot farther than what it looks when you're standing up there in the window. It's not really that far, especially from the higher vantage point.

That said, I'm a full on 'something other than what the Warren report states is what happened' theorist...

 

[DonKnock]

You all gotta listen to this.

@ineedsleep212 @jayshiggs @storyteller ya'll listened to this?

this guy still talking on a hardwired landline in 2019

 

[Starman]

The term "conspiracy theory" is often used to make inconvenient ideas/questions appear irrational in the hopes that they'll go away.

 

[Ruby'sRevolver]

The term "conspiracy theory" is often used to make inconvenient ideas/questions appear irrational in the hopes that they'll go away.

 

[Ruby'sRevolver]

I highly recommend this book to anyone who is seriously interested in what really happened to JFK. This book is probably the closest we will get to the truth, IMO.

There are a lot of good docs to watch as well. First would be Mark Lane's 'Rush to Judgement' one of the very first conspiracy docs, Nigel Turner's 'The Men Who Killed Kennedy' a nine episode series, the last 3 episodes were banned from TV in 2003 you can still find them online, and a very good youtube series called 'Evidence of Revision' which is a 6-part series but only the first 3 are about the JFK assassination. Also I recommend watching Oliver Stone's film 'JFK' and the documentary that goes along with it called 'Beyond JFK: The Question of Conspiracy'.

That should be a good start for anyone looking into the JFK case.