Why is EPMDs influence on Hip Hop so slept on?
- Thread starter smokeurobinson
- Start date
Go ask Ray-J if it matters who got there first
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
Not really because all these breaks are collected.
That if you are in the fold of this.
You supposed to know the breaks and if they are off limits.
If you do choose to use the break.
You automatically are thought of as jack'n the break and doing so because you felt you new form was doper than the staple.
It has been the basis of the earliest conflicts and battles and we have a nonviolent prescient culture that says you are to be aware.
Regardless of how little or small the next man is.
Example:
Although conflict physically never arose.
Salt n pepa challenging originally Dougie fresh and slick Rick
Namely anything post Roxanne war.
you had to know the breaks who sampled them and be aware.
of when you could possibly be infringing upon someone else's contribution.
It is just part of the culture.
You are supposed to be up on shyt.
Art Barr
Taadow
The StarchBishop™️
Go ask Ray-J if it matters who got there first
Ray J don't wanna see me in these streets (again).
Taadow
The StarchBishop™️
You not listening to me, so i'm just gonna ask you this:
Do you think that everybody ever who sampled "More Bounce To The Ounce" did it only because of EPMD?
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
00000000000000000000000000000022
They did it out of ego.
As they ignored the culture and who already sew'd up the use of the sample and who it is attributed to.
It is a reason why Pac culturally for Cali love is frowned upon by purist.
As it is the break of knick knack patty whack, and a completely rushed production.
to revenue grab and capitalize on the sheer idea of Pac being free from jail.
So fukk the idea of the very break that created how Pac would draw on same song being of any importance.
Plus you are dissing the coast that created exactly how you got on as a rubrick. Plus digital is from queens, too. Not to mention pac is a ny'er. Pac was born there.
I mean we can go there.
It is a reason why on even:
Organized confusion, the bragging about the same break used later on how many emcees and how hard it was to clear was a big deal.
You supposed to know who used the break and what the verdict is on it.
The reason why how many emcees popped is because of how you previously could not record over the sample. From previously they allowed no one to use the sample. Which was an evolution of organized just getting permission to use the break and being on a large enough label to just sample it.
Let alone record an actual record over it.
Example:
Black moon and mega Banton both got props in their respective cultures genres for the same break. Which is because both cultures share grassroots beginnigns and intermingling.
Yet if someone in rnb tried to use the same break it would have failed then.
Case in point why miss Jones is frowned upon for using the jeru break.
Yet the much larger resourced mjb gets to use the same formula with larger resources to alter history devoid of what the culture is about.
Which Is why after the fact az was given a pass for the miss Jones feature in sugar hill and why his song was not taken as taboo with a rnb singer on the hook.
That black moon even scratched their own back by actually making the vinyl twelve with sound boy burial on the flipside to the twelve. As point of paying homage when typically a song out of genre sampled was not given such attention to detail.
Plus the whole crew pay it forward by even naming a record the same record on smif n wesson the same as mega's record.
Example;
Jayz interpolates and basically retreads common's retrospect for life. Yet this is ignored because dr dre supposedly produced it and know the MTV Viacom media can oversaturate and make common's important record about abortion with Lauren hill an after thought.
In some way though, Lauren hill is given homage over common by naming it lost ones. Yet no mention was made of just what this record is. When jay is also tongue in cheek dissing common by saying I used to wanna rhyme like common sense but I sold five mill blah blah blah. Yet when you need to rebolster your draw after getting served by nas.
Here you are using the underground to make a comeback but not paying to forward all the way for real though.
Art Barr
They did it out of ego.
As they ignored the culture and who already sew'd up the use of the sample and who it is attributed to.
It is a reason why Pac culturally for Cali love is frowned upon by purist.
As it is the break of knick knack patty whack, and a completely rushed production.
to revenue grab and capitalize on the sheer idea of Pac being free from jail.
So fukk the idea of the very break that created how Pac would draw on same song being of any importance.
Plus you are dissing the coast that created exactly how you got on as a rubrick. Plus digital is from queens, too. Not to mention pac is a ny'er. Pac was born there.
I mean we can go there.
It is a reason why on even:
Organized confusion, the bragging about the same break used later on how many emcees and how hard it was to clear was a big deal.
You supposed to know who used the break and what the verdict is on it.
The reason why how many emcees popped is because of how you previously could not record over the sample. From previously they allowed no one to use the sample. Which was an evolution of organized just getting permission to use the break and being on a large enough label to just sample it.
Let alone record an actual record over it.
Example:
Black moon and mega Banton both got props in their respective cultures genres for the same break. Which is because both cultures share grassroots beginnigns and intermingling.
Yet if someone in rnb tried to use the same break it would have failed then.
Case in point why miss Jones is frowned upon for using the jeru break.
Yet the much larger resourced mjb gets to use the same formula with larger resources to alter history devoid of what the culture is about.
Which Is why after the fact az was given a pass for the miss Jones feature in sugar hill and why his song was not taken as taboo with a rnb singer on the hook.
That black moon even scratched their own back by actually making the vinyl twelve with sound boy burial on the flipside to the twelve. As point of paying homage when typically a song out of genre sampled was not given such attention to detail.
Plus the whole crew pay it forward by even naming a record the same record on smif n wesson the same as mega's record.
Example;
Jayz interpolates and basically retreads common's retrospect for life. Yet this is ignored because dr dre supposedly produced it and know the MTV Viacom media can oversaturate and make common's important record about abortion with Lauren hill an after thought.
In some way though, Lauren hill is given homage over common by naming it lost ones. Yet no mention was made of just what this record is. When jay is also tongue in cheek dissing common by saying I used to wanna rhyme like common sense but I sold five mill blah blah blah. Yet when you need to rebolster your draw after getting served by nas.
Here you are using the underground to make a comeback but not paying to forward all the way for real though.
Art Barr
Last edited:
Taadow
The StarchBishop™️
Art...you not answering my question:
Do you think that everybody ever who sampled "More Bounce To The Ounce" did it strictly because of EPMD?
You don't think people would've sampled that song anyway, even if there was never no "U Gots 2 Chill"?
The War Report
NewNewYork
This is why NY is the goat when it comes to this Hip Hop shyt. The versatility. 
Hip Hop from Strong Island is pure quality.
Hip Hop from Strong Island is pure quality.
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
00000000000000000000000000000022
The point is u got 2 chill does exist and since it does.
That is the break for you gots to chill and you gon have to use another break or get called a biter.
Plus expose you not hip to the culture.
You just can not bite some shyt somebody in the culture already laid claim to after break beats were dead and the Roxanne wars were over.
There was a hardcore bboy revolution to usher out the old school way of thought. With that things were stringent about biting.
Biting is taboo and creates a corrosive element that allows draws to be stolen within our culture which is not allowed.
There are people who defiantly break the rules..
Yet that creates erosion and eventually if not addressed.
will lead to the destruction of that businesses' draw.
This has been known since arthouses tried to steal graf as well.
This is not a new principle.
Art Barr
The point is u got 2 chill does exist and since it does.
That is the break for you gots to chill and you gon have to use another break or get called a biter.
Plus expose you not hip to the culture.
You just can not bite some shyt somebody in the culture already laid claim to after break beats were dead and the Roxanne wars were over.
There was a hardcore bboy revolution to usher out the old school way of thought. With that things were stringent about biting.
Biting is taboo and creates a corrosive element that allows draws to be stolen within our culture which is not allowed.
There are people who defiantly break the rules..
Yet that creates erosion and eventually if not addressed.
will lead to the destruction of that businesses' draw.
This has been known since arthouses tried to steal graf as well.
This is not a new principle.
Art Barr
Taadow
The StarchBishop™️
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
When we get to the over use of breaks.
That starts to fall into the whole camaraderie arena those artist culturally all had with one another.
Which falls into social arenas and getting along with standard old issues that along the time line.
Those artist gained social understanding culturally of one another.
Or just a social hierarchy was understood from a beat battle perspective.
which does exist between producers, dj's even more than emcees as the whole let's battle shyt is simply sound clash at its roots. So, that is a parameter of hiphop.
where so much time has passed and socially some constructs exists from the culture to keep conflict from arising. So I know what you getting at, but exactly in timeline how thing arose and were changed for any similar production sampling between the greats given that era for that time there was no conflict.
Yet let's say if this was an era in time, on the timeline.
when rza was Raheem.
Let's say raheem did draw and had got big off a break changing history. so that he was popular by selling out and not later going through a purgatory period in sellout hiphop hell trials of death kid.
Where let's say Raheem is the guy, and he has a problem with a more grounded group culturally in rap like let's say powerrule.
As powerrule would approach you for stealing their basses and kicks FA real.
At that time a problem, would have arose and Raheem would have been dissed culturally.
Yet if we are talking about later on in timeline in the wake of hammer and vanilla ice and now you have the rza in his most culturally advanced form in every possible way as a bboy and a failure selling out where he was forced to cultural repair his draw whole heartedly.
Now, it is a different time and era and that is why rza is a cultural defining draw producer and in that it turns into socially what that era was and it was homage or cool.
It would matter in the timeline of how producer's were taking it socially and from whom/what/where the person voicing this was coming from.
Example;
Lord finesse & mac miller
The same is quite different because of the principles involved.
You, have finesse who never could do a feature with anyone in rap generally but pretty much the best all time in rap of which was in his crew, or just included for that time maybe two to six possible emcees. So it is not that large a pool in a non feature based but a newcomer. who is otherworldly dope gets a skill rewarded record deal era. So finesse never did work with anyone and always defended his real indie gets a deal draw in an Era where those were few and far between. That segueway'd into and out of the gangsta rap to the next drawing era that included hammer and vanilla ice. So in finesse you got a drawing artist. who takes a real place among the greats, who lived all these era's.
Plus would battle for any name rights centered around his glimmer of a hope style skill rewarded based record career. Which are only given out to era defining talents.
after an era that yielded the cream of the crop as far as natural culturally welled talent in the new school way of thought hard core bboy revolution.
So this is not just some guy.
This is finesse that when he finally did feature with krs. It was a career defining record for both in that era.
This is lord finesse who equally was as fine a producer and predates the glorious rise of the nineties producer era and is centrally instrumental to that rise.
As he WA in ditc and ditc's soul clap is the beginning redrawing era long term drawing records and instrumentals that showed and is the new genesis after hammer and vanilla ice rap could draw from an organic culture based perspective without tampering in a hof based manner by just sheer quality of record.
So again this is lord finesse.
So now comes along in the wake of the continuing and racist underground hiphopinfinity.com based era.
some white cat with no real cultural connection to hiphop and the Mecca for real to establish.
Where all finesse asks was a sampling credit and some social dysfunction occurred.
Finesse in a simple cultural way said I am not standing for it.
Especially since I paid for that actual use of the break and the same rules should apply in this with a cultural sellout meets hhi.com type guy. throwing the weight of this group around like finesse of all people should just be accepting of the disrespect is going to create the situation and conflict resolution it had.
So I know what you are or were alluding to but a different timeline and social camaraderie existed culturally there in that exact instance.
Art Barr
Taadow
The StarchBishop™️
No, you don't know what i'm alluding to.
I'll be more direct...do you consider The RZA a biter of Dr. Dre for sampling the same song Dre did?
...and try to awnser this in 50 words or less.