Let's not forget that LAD maybe the most lyrically influential album in Rap. Only thing close is Rakims stuff, KRS stuff, but I think BIG eclipsed them at this point in terms of straight being bit, referenced, quoted etc.
Wu-Tang Forever Appreciation Thread
- Thread starter Inspect Her Deck
- Start date
JayBaldacci
All Star
Track for track would be easy because LAD has the wackiest joints between the 2. Scary Hours equals 10 crack comandments.
Inspect Her Deck
Skins of all colours come together as brothers
MidnightMercenary
All Star
Assuming we start at Reunited and Somebody's Gotta Die
Somebody's Gotta Die x Reunited
Hypnotize x For Heavens Sake
Kick In the Door x Cash Still Rules/Scary Hours
fukk You Tonight x Visionz
Last Day x As High as Wu-Tang Get
I Love the Dough x Severe Punishment (very slightly tho)
What's Beef? x Older Gods
Mo Money Mo Problems x Maria
nikkas Bleed x A Better Tomorrow
I Got a Story to Tell x It's Yourz (another tough one)
For disc 1 6-4 Wu
Somebody's Gotta Die x Reunited
Hypnotize x For Heavens Sake
Kick In the Door x Cash Still Rules/Scary Hours
fukk You Tonight x Visionz
Last Day x As High as Wu-Tang Get
I Love the Dough x Severe Punishment (very slightly tho)
What's Beef? x Older Gods
Mo Money Mo Problems x Maria
nikkas Bleed x A Better Tomorrow
I Got a Story to Tell x It's Yourz (another tough one)
For disc 1 6-4 Wu
JayBaldacci
All Star
the best tracks are equal in quality, but wu-tang had more quanity of quality. and again the wackest joints are on LAD.
and you never answered my question to your "cohesive" argument. how can an album that's more far more uneven than IWW be more cohesive than WTF?
Wu-Tang Forever doesn't have a song as garbage as Another or Playa Hater
Playa Hater is a such a great song, one of my favorite flips ever
Kim went in on another and Big flowed his ass off
and I'm saying this as someone who's not a huge fan of Big
Inspect Her Deck
Skins of all colours come together as brothers
Reunited vs. Somebody's Gotta Die (close)
For Heaven's Sake vs Hypnotize
Cash Still Rules vs. Kick in the Door
Visionz vs. fukking You Tonight
As High as Wu-Tang Get vs. Last Day
Severe Punishment vs. I Love the Dough
Older Gods vs. What's Beef
Maria vs. Mo Money Mo Problems
A Better Tomorrow vs. nikkas Bleed
It's Yourz vs. I Got a Story to Tell (close)
Triumph vs. Notorious Thugs
Impossible vs. Miss U (close)
Little Ghetto Boys vs. Another
Deadly Melody vs. Going Back to Cali
The City vs. Ten Crack Commandments
The Projects vs. Playa Hater
Bells of War vs. Nasty Boy
The M.G.M. vs. Sky's the Limit (super close)
Dog shyt vs. The World is Filled
Duck Seazon vs. My Downfall
Hellz Wind Staff vs. Long Kiss Goodnight
Heaterz vs. You're Nobody
15 - 7 Wu-Tang wins
For Heaven's Sake vs Hypnotize
Cash Still Rules vs. Kick in the Door
Visionz vs. fukking You Tonight
As High as Wu-Tang Get vs. Last Day
Severe Punishment vs. I Love the Dough
Older Gods vs. What's Beef
Maria vs. Mo Money Mo Problems
A Better Tomorrow vs. nikkas Bleed
It's Yourz vs. I Got a Story to Tell (close)
Triumph vs. Notorious Thugs
Impossible vs. Miss U (close)
Little Ghetto Boys vs. Another
Deadly Melody vs. Going Back to Cali
The City vs. Ten Crack Commandments
The Projects vs. Playa Hater
Bells of War vs. Nasty Boy
The M.G.M. vs. Sky's the Limit (super close)
Dog shyt vs. The World is Filled
Duck Seazon vs. My Downfall
Hellz Wind Staff vs. Long Kiss Goodnight
Heaterz vs. You're Nobody
15 - 7 Wu-Tang wins
Album cohesiveness does not necessarily mean that a project's song content or style is monolithic.
Cohesiveness for a LP is the appropriate arrangement of tracks on an album.
Thanks to Puff Daddy's executive production, and BIG's lyrical skill there's a very overall cinematic feel to LAD.
Plus a dark irony. Ex. "Nobody till Somebody Kills You" Final track.
Even the 2 DJ Premier tracks are polished. so polished they were sampled later by r&b girl group SWV.
Primo's tracks for Gangstarr and Nas (Nas is Like) have more grit in the way they are engineered and mixed down.
The variety makes this one of the best LPs of All Time.
The raunchy "Nasty Boy" is followed up by the Inspirational "Sky is The Limit"
The Dark content of "What's Beef" transitions to an "interlude" of Biggie rapping over the first credited Gangster Rap song in history -'P.S.K' by Schooly D followed by The upbeat ,celbretory , sudtly lamenting "Mo Money, MO Problems"
Also I think too much is made out of album "cohesiveness" these days. At the end of the day people just want joints that resonate, regardless of the order tracks are arranged or even the theme/content.
ZEB WALTON
ayo! - BEZ
So make a lad thread breh
Dont fukk up the flow of the classic wu forever
Appreciate or walk
IMPOSSIBLE is one of the best songs of all time. One of the most memorable wu songs with rza and ugod dropping 2 monster verses and ghost dropping verse of the year. This song is as good as Any wu song in history.
LiL GHETTO BOY
rae and capp iver some sick rza beat. Keeping with the vibe. Capp brought it on this.
"Half the eastcoast sound just like rae"
DEADLY MELODY
eh. If someone dont like this i see why. I think the beats boring but people seem to like it but not I. The first weakpoint on the album imo
THE CITY
sinister beat with deck getting a solo on the album. His first solo song on official wu album. Great song with more verses that show hes the Non rza MVP of this album
PROJECTS
i used to not like this song that muvh but since i started making beats this is one of rzasnillest lil flips. Rae and meth are great on this. Ugod n rae hook is ill. I hate the ghostface verse. I cut it from my version.
BELLS OF WAR
one of the top 5 songs on album. Ugod drops a bomb on this track. Ugods wavk? Between this severe punishment triumph n impossible dude is a monster. Meth drops one of his best verses on the album. The lil skits in the beat make the song bigger than it already was with that awesome beat. Rza drops a sick verse. Again. Dude murdered this album with verses. Him ugod deck and ghost are in rare form. Masta killa adds hus piece that just intros the skits nthe classic tyson raekwon shyt lol.
"Cmon maaaaan. This nikka fukked up muthafukkin whitaker"
"Mikes gon forfeit.."
"He cut his eye...
In sparring"
Ghost drops a verse that is showing how supreme cluentele was about to be classic
"Not gon fugure it out til the ear 2g" a classic prediction that rang so true
THE MGM
How couldnu not like this song and be a wu fan. Rae n ghost going back n forth doing the story thing about being at mgm over a classic true master sample flip. This shot is 5/5 and might be rae n ghosts duo peak
Dogshyt
Aite. Another song that isnt my favorite but is funny. Doesnt fit with albums vibe but dirt needed it cause he on like 5 travks. I miss not having diesel on this cause it woulda fit perfectly
The fisher price my first timbalands is classic tho
DUCK SEAZON
another songbthat i was never big on. The beat always bored me. Its like rza picked a beat where the rappers could just thyme on that was just toooo laid back. Great verses tho which is a shame. Rae rza meth drop bars upon bars. Rae goes in
HELLZ WIND STAFF
FT STREETLIFE. Street opens this shyt wit a gunshot to the face. One of the hardest and banger songs on the album. It was no joke. Most the clan spazzes on this. Classic wu song
HEATERZ
I think everyone knows heaterz os one of the hardest wu songs of all time. This is one of the hardest songs all time. Raekwon wrecks wit the flow and rhymes. Deck throws one of his best verses on this. His versenis wu forever in a 16. Dirt drops a sprinkle that only adds to the joint. Wit his gravle voice. Deck and ugod finish this strong. Crazy somg. Can go againt the best song on any cd
BLACK SHAMPOO
i want to like this song cause i like the beat but its just too much. Uey tried. I understand but it just shouldnt have been on album. Maybe a uye solo song on a album that was in that vibe but not here
THE SECOND COMING
album ends with this really. I live the rnb shyt rza did. He was sposed to do a compioation of rnb wu called blunted soul before bobby digi took his soul. If it woulda sounded like this it wouoda been dope. I see this like EYE on madvillain. A cool rnb shyt that ends the album which was very socially concious. This song really has the lyrics down. It fits so perfect. Perfect ending..
How old are you.m..nikka.mm..im old ..m so im askin.
“I used the bus as an analogy,” he says. “I said, ‘I want all of y'all to get on this bus. And be passengers. And I’m the driver. And nobody can ask me where we going. I’m taking us to No. 1. Give me five years, and I promise that I’ll get us there.’ ” – RZA
The above quote said by RZA is in reference to what is commonly known as the ‘Five Year Plan’, whereby at the end of the 5th year of the Wu-Tang Clan forming, they’d be on top of the world.
Ever the visionary, RZA would proceed to command control of some of the finest albums to grace the genre of hip-hop. From 1993-1996, we’d be blessed with 36 Chambers, Tical, Return to the 36 Chambers, Only Built 4 Cuban Linx, Liquid Swords and Ironman.
At least three of those albums to this day are considered genuine contenders for G.O.A.T. The rest have a respectable amount of critical acclaim as well. So by the time 1997 rolled around, fans were at an all-time high level of anticipation for the group’s second LP as a collective.
The sales numbers of Wu-Tang Forever would point towards an immeasurable level of success. After all, it remains their highest selling album in their discography, going 4x platinum. It even sold 612,000 in its first week.
Despite largely positive reviews from critics, many of the fans had a bone to pick with an unfamiliar sounding album. The Wu aesthetic was so heavily sculpted off the gutter and lo-fi sounds of 36 Chambers, and even though later solo albums would sound more densely layered and polished, it never relinquished that rawness. However, with Forever, the production was even more polished, and even more clean, and it detached itself from much of that early Wu-Tang sound. This marked a new chapter sonically-speaking in the Wu-Tang chronology.
The aforementioned sound change, in addition to it being a double disc LP (renowned for never living up to expectations), led to what some people perceived to be the beginning of the Wu-Tang dynasty’s fall-off, in spite of the sale numbers saying otherwise.
In my opinion, this album is almost as good as 36 Chambers, and it’s the greatest double disc LP to ever exist. I’m not here to say why it’s the GOAT double LP, that’s not the purpose of this thread. Instead, I want to explain why this album should be regarded as one of the absolute best in a ridiculous run of classics between 1993-1997.
1. different =/= worse
The misconception is that because this album sounds different, it’s worse. That couldn’t be further from the truth. Forever marked a change in Wu sound, and preference wise I can see the argument for 36 Chambers' superiority. BUT, for all intents and purposes, Forever is better produced from a technical aspect. Most importantly, it holds up so well today, and the way soul samples are manipulated here (rather than the distortion of 36) would go on to influence the likes of Kanye West and Just Blaze. In order to hear the influence, listen to the track ‘For Heaven’s Sake’.
2. the rapping is exceptional
So much so that most rappers' primes are considered to manifest themselves in the lyrics of this double LP. Inspectah Deck had life-changing verses on the album. Ghost was REALLY beginning to gain his abstract and stream-of-consciousness identity. Raekwon maintained his mid-90’s lyrical rampage. RZA was arguably the most improved rapper. Perhaps the greatest thing to emerge from this album was the prominence of U-God and Masta Killa on the mic, who showed they had more to offer than the ‘once in a blue moon’ cameo performances.
3. hardly any filler
A double disc LP is often accused of having a lot of filler tracks. I believe this album to have only ONE track that could be considered filler, and that’s ‘Black Shampoo’, and also the Tekitha singing track if you want to count that. For an album that has 27 tracks, that is outrageously efficient.
Here’s how I’d rank the tracks personally:
TIER 1: Reunited, For Heaven's Sake, A Better Tomorrow, Triumph, The City, Bells of War, The M.G.M., Heaterz
TIER 2: As High as Wu-Tang Get, Severe Punishment, Older Gods, It's Yourz, Impossible, Deadly Melody, The Projects, Hellz Wind Staff
TIER 3: Cash Still Rules/Scary Hours, Visionz, Little Ghetto Boys, Duck Seazon
TIER 4: Maria, Dog shyt
TIER 5: Black Shampoo
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QUESTIONS
- What do you think of the album?
- Where does it rank as a double disc LP?
- Where does it rank as a Wu-Tang Clan album (group)?
- If you could make the album into one disc, what would it look like?
- How would you tier the tracks?
- Favourite verse on the album?
- Rate the album out of 10.
Newportbox
All Star
LAD's influence wasn't a positive one IMO. That try to be all things to all people spam method of making albums was terrible.
ZEB WALTON
ayo! - BEZ
QUESTIONS
- What do you think of the album?ABSOLUTE CLASSIC. ONE OF THE PUREST AND DEEPEST ALBUMA IN HIP HOP HISTORY.
- Where does it rank as a double disc LP?AMONG THE GREATEST OF ALL TIME. PERSONALLY WTF LAD AND DI ARE MY TOP 3 2x Albuks of all time
- Where does it rank as a Wu-Tang Clan album (group)?#1
- If you could make the album into one disc, what would it look like?
- How would you tier the tracks?best of best are heaterz impossible mgm bells of war reunited and a better tomorrow. Rest tier 2 except those i mentioned in my review would be tier 3 ie deadly melody dog shyt blck shampoo visions
- Favourite verse on the album? Rza on impossible
- Rate the album out of 10. whole thing, 9/10. My 80 min version 11/10
As for the 80 minute version. I have an 80 minute mix that i spiced up that takes out the gap fukkups between tracks and fits as many bangers as possible. I made some of the skits at the end of aongs tracks cause sometikes they cool to listen to. Also started little ghetto boy as the beat starts and have the usual intro tagged at end of impossible. If anyone would like it @ me . I will upload it tomorrow. Its 80:03 long and i didnt shorten anything except second comings instrumental end to make it fit. I added fades and ahit so it all sounds how i imagine rza wouod have it.
01 wu revolution kung fu intro
02 reunited
03 for heavens sake
04 scary hourz
05 as high as wu tabg get
06!severe punishment
07 older gods
08 maria
09 a better tomorrow intro
10 a better tomorrow
11 its yourz
12 disk 2 intro
13 triumph
14 impossible
15 little ghetto boy
16 interlude
17 the city
18 projects
19 bells of war
20 the mgm
21 hellz wind staff
22 heaterz
23 the second coming
Tell me that isnt a 5 mic album. I will upload it tomorrow 320kb mp3 ( sorry thats the highest bit rate i got the album at )
Where does AEOM rank, after all these years? At the time it was released the Source or someone said it went up in flames..
It has some decent production, but lyrically unmemorable outside of a couple tracks. And he got outdid on the features.
