Afrocentricity vs. Homosexuality: The Isis Papers

Blackking

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I think the moment it becomes evident that she's engaging in Freudian pseudo-analysis is the moment I question her credibility, regardless of whether or not she's also incorporating other thinkers.

The problem with Welsing is that to her, black masculinity is the PRIMARY target of white supremacy. Everything revolves around masculinity, it is the end all be all for her. I don't deny for a second that masculinity isn't a target of white supremacy. You see this with other races too, where Asian men are portrayed as either feminine or asexual, as a contrast to the masculine Occident. Again, Welsing's writing centralizes black masculinity. This to me is the wrong approach. Oppression is operating on many different levels on many different ways. Centralizing it like this dismisses anything that falls outside of her model, which is supposed to be predictable and easy to understand.

That she couches her pseudo-theories in an understanding of African-American history makes it (understandably) extremely attractive to some people. There's a very good reading of Welsing by Essex Hemphill where he states that "[h]er theory is very seductive, particularly for Black people oppressed for so long. It is very much like cocaine; a dose of her ideas momentarily provides one with a rush of empowerment, but after the high is gone the harsh realities of racism still remain, just as sexual diversity, as created by nature, still remains irrevocable, uncontrollable." (The Columbia Reader on Lesbians and Gay Men in Media, Society, and Politics - Google Books)
Well....

I'm going to go watch her speak tonight at the museum.. :sas1:

so I'll see if she hits her points the way you're claiming... maybe she's evolved----and expanded on her ideas about oppression.. :sas2:



and homosexuality indeed is created by nature... So are birth defects and disorders. Do you believe homosexuality is a disorder? Considering the fact that it's counter-evolutionary.... can it be considered 'normal'?
 

sun raw

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Who theories on race are better? Who theories should we be reading?

I'm not big on who the latest ones might be but there's always foundational stuff, like Frantz Fanon. Edward Said's "Orientalism" is a must-read, although it pertains to Western depictions and perceptions of the Middle East, Asia, and North Africa. Other names worth checking out:

-Kwame Anthony Appiah
-Gerald Early
-Patricia Hill Collins
-Manning Marable
-Richard Dyer, more specifically his book "White: Essays on Race and Culture"

They're all writing about different things, some that I agree with, some that I don't, at different times. It's always good to just read a bunch of different things, come to your own conclusion, know how to separate the good authors from the charlatans. There's a ton of stuff out there, obviously some is gonna get more attention than other.
 

sun raw

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Well....

I'm going to go watch her speak tonight at the museum.. :sas1:

so I'll see if she hits her points the way you're claiming... maybe she's evolved----and expanded on her ideas about oppression.. :sas2:



and homosexuality indeed is created by nature... So are birth defects and disorders. Do you believe homosexuality is a disorder? Considering the fact that it's counter-evolutionary.... can it be considered 'normal'?

She was in Hidden Colors and it didn't seem like her views had changed in the years between whenever the hell it was she wrote her most-known stuff and then. But hey, I'm open to being proved wrong. Hope her talk is a good one, though.

I think it's important to not consider "normal" in relation to evolution, especially since we as humans (who have, you know, self-awareness, sentience) are looking at things from a perspective very different from animals. "Normal" isn't a static thing.

Dolphins fukk each other in the blowholes, I don't know what evolutionary porpoise that serves.
 

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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My argument is the promotion of homosexuality, not what causes it because thats obvious and white people are the biggest promoters of homosexuality, around the world. .
Theres no evidence of this. There are gays in every culture of every color all fighting for their own autonomy.
When you teach homosexuality to elementary school children as an alternative to whats natural, thats promotion.
Telling kids about the complexities of human sexuality isn't "promotion"
When you tell another nation, we will not give you aid unless you promote homosexuality, thats promotion.
Thats NOT promoation jackass. The USA is well within its right to withhold aid for any reason it wants, especially when the recipients will jail people on the SUSPICION of gay rumors or even putting them to death. Thats not humane.
Thats the message you're sending. In Papa New Guinea homosexuality is seen as a problem, which is why its not promoted and is against the law
Well i'm glad I don't live in PNG. fukk 'em.

You are a white boy pretending to be black, promoting homosexuality, and thats a problem.
And you're an Asian pretending to be Mexican.

Its the internet and I can play this game too.

The influence of Greek/Roman culture still exist in European culture, unfortunately

And yet I see no need to hate gays as much as you do.

I also note how your argument does not address female same sex relationships.
 

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Well....

I'm going to go watch her speak tonight at the museum.. :sas1:

so I'll see if she hits her points the way you're claiming... maybe she's evolved----and expanded on her ideas about oppression.. :sas2:



and homosexuality indeed is created by nature... So are birth defects and disorders. Do you believe homosexuality is a disorder? Considering the fact that it's counter-evolutionary.... can it be considered 'normal'?
Evolution doesn't progress towards normality and evidenced by the sheer hand-waving you're doing here with respect to these complex issues, I take it that you don't even understand what evolution is, much less modern biology.
 

Blackking

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Evolution doesn't progress towards normality and evidenced by the sheer hand-waving you're doing here with respect to these complex issues, I take it that you don't even understand what evolution is, much less modern biology.
:patrice:Why are you trying to come at me for? Do you need me to explain some things to you?


most people understand what evolution is... You're not even able to back your points .. you're hoping from one tired defense to the next.
Dissing a persons understanding of "modern" biology is an old trick for people without real points. ... you don't need to be a biologist to understand this shyt.

Sex isn't separated from evolution.... it's the most important thing because without it two members of a species can't combine genes to reproduce... creating more genetic variation.... increasing the chance for changes over time. I don't know what the term "handwaving" means but I'm going to assume that it's a homosexual term that fakkits like you tend to throw around. What I do know is that I didn't imply that evolution is geared towards normality... I said that the normal behavior and catalyst and one instigator of evolution is Obviously sexual intercourse ----- intercourse that homosexuality has zero place in.

By normal, - people who aren't fakkits and who aren't ignorant, should assume that I meant evolutionary fitness - basically 'normal' is a species acting in a way to increase chances of reproduction and survival.... biologically, homosexuality has Zero place.

You speak on "Modern" Biology for a reason. Most men who love the taste of another man.... and a few atheist use that term in a certain way. The reason those groups use that term is because they choose to incorrectly downplay reproduction and 'community' in the evolutionary process.......... Human beings developed family and religious structure (and kept hold of that longer than ANYthing else) for a reason and most cultures shy away from gayness---- because of our 'fitness' and survival. Entire populations evolve......... not individuals - so community and sexual normality are important.
The way humans are and they way we have been is ...............

....Human nature........ the abnormalities are birth defects and we shouldn't be ashamed to call homosexuality a birth defect simply because the number of gays have increased or because they can also function in society . The gays are respected because they pushed in the media and on the streets so much that they have literally changed science...... randomly it's no longer considered a mental illness.

We diss the lady in this thread because she adopted ideas from people like Freud... well in the 18th 19th and 20th centuries the people whose ideas we still hold to.... are the ones that called gay a disorder.........and the people who we throw out all their ideas (like Freud) are the ones that changed the views on homosexuality..... So we simply accepted whats convenient. The vote was split in the American Psychiatric Association (The most respected of the group voted to keep it as a disorder, FYI) - so that Gay media push is what really changed the ideas that they teach in school now. In the statements from the APA -- they named the push from the Gay community as the reason for the change. No science or anything legit was used to make the change. They said because gays seem happy and adjusted then they most be 'normal'--- which basically means media > Science.

But really you don't care about all that. You're entire point is that if you aren't marching in gay parades then you must be homophobic and want to kill gays like they do in remote nations.
 
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