Are you really a feminist?

[user1]

Should men get equal custody of children? YES Should a man be able to hit a woman back who hit him? YES. Self defense.
Should a woman be able to imprison a man with evidence free accusations of rape?? No.

You meant equality in ALL situations right??

And as a man or women, if you get to the point you need to hit someone LEAVE. This isn't even gender, it's about being a damn adult. And men should get custody if he is fit. Just like the mother. Just because the law may not alway be pushed that way don't act like it's women's faults. Last time I checked the courts and judges were majority WHITE MEN. Lawyers as well. How is this black women's fault? These same men that are so mad are barking at the wrong tree.

 

[user1]

This basically. The rigid paradigm of what a man should be and what a woman should be. And outliers outside of those norms are freaks and whatnot. The thing is, gender roles don't really take individuals into account and this is the problem. If you don't fit that, you're fukked. And the irony is that feminism in this regard can actually benefit men, because they don't have to stick completely to a rigid role - they don't have to be uber masculine guys if they don't fit that paradigm. And likewise, women don't need to fit the rigid paradigm of womanhood that we associate with femininity.

Problem is with the advent of feminism, women are encouraged by other women to be who they want to be (exceptions being those feminists who cuss SAHMs for not pursuing careers). With men, we aren't really encouraged to do that because "it's gay" and it's "not masculine". I mean, I can remember always having a go at one of my little brothers because he was a really camp kid who liked musicals and girly shyt like that. When I got older I felt bad about it and realized that that's just how he was. He still likes most of that stuff now. And I bet upon reading that, the first thought is "he's gay".

I'm quite objective about this simply because it's useful to try and unite people in understanding and embracing the viewpoints of others (within reason). It's why I've been reading this thread to get a handle on not just feminism but how women on here feel about it in general.

As much as I know about feminism, this is what I always thought. Before it became b*stardized into the mumbo jumbo it is now. It's just distraction at this point.

Half way through I realized you were a guy. I think Cheers to you for at least attempting to listen. I feel like some men are just so mad and stuck in that confines of the alpha male and masculinity that their pain turns into venom. And usually women are the easiest targets. I grew up with only brothers so I saw first hand how men are told to man up, suck it up and don't be a girl. And lord forbid they get beat by a girl . Men are just as trapped as us. And to add to the fact the "manface" they wear in public around other men/or in mixed crowds vs how they act alone with you. It's mind boggling.

 

[marcuz]

We're not legally denied that but we are socially and I've already mentioned that's a small piece of the pie. Another piece is this rape apology culture. Instead of telling me, as a woman, don't drink too much, don't dress like this, don't flirt with him, don't dance on him, etc. How about teaching men not to rape?

because telling men not to rape wont stop rapist. just like tellin men not to murder, wont stop murderers. as a man, the best we can do is hold ourselves accountable for the situations we put ourselves in. if im out wearing all red in a crip area, its partially my fault when gangsters accost me.

but thats the type of accountability women shy away from. yall want to do what you want, when you want to do it, without any repercussions--and thats not equality, that's superiority

 

[Arishok]

Men dont rape. Rapists rape. If you resent that people try to help you avoid being targeted by criminals then you cant be too bright. I've only heard entitled white bytches make this argument.

No one says ill go where i want, when i want, tell people not to steal, tell people not to attack or kill.

I don't resent them, it's just dumb that people want to dictate what women wear and do then when they're raped, it's their (the woman) fault.

 

[Arishok]

because telling men not to rape wont stop rapist. just like tellin men not to mutder, wont stop murderers. as a man, the best we can do is hold ourselves accountable for the situations we put ourselves in. if im out wearing all red in a crip area, its partially my fault when gangsters accost me.

but thats the type of accountability women shy away from. yall want to do what you want, when you want to do it, without any repercussions--and thats not equality, that's superiority

This is exactly what I'm talking about. You KNOW you're in a crip area (in your example), I don't know when/where the fukk imma be raped. Then if a woman is raped, it's "what was she wearing, how much did she drink, etc."

 

[marcuz]

I don't resent them, it's just dumb that people want to dictate what women wear and do then when they're raped, it's their (the woman) fault.

you all are completely dishonest. pretending like rape is a part of male culture, when the truth is men govern rapist.

if you're raped, you will more than likely call men (cops), who will inprison said rapist. only for other men to torture said rapist once he's behind bars.

but if you let women tell it. we're all in it together to get away with sexually assaulting the black woman.

 

[Arishok]

you all are completely dishonest. pretending like rape is a part of male culture, when the truth is men govern rapist.

if you're raped, you will more than likely call men (cops), who will inprison said rapist. only for other men to torture said rapist once he's behind bars.

but if you let women tell it. we're all in it together to get away with sexually assaulting the black woman.

I was not making it seem like that, stop trying to turn this into a "we hate men and want to rule over them" thing

 

[PlainSight]

I don't resent them, it's just dumb that people want to dictate what women wear and do then when they're raped, it's their (the woman) fault.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. You KNOW you're in a crip area (in your example), I don't know when/where the fukk imma be raped. Then if a woman is raped, it's "what was she wearing, how much did she drink, etc."

1. I read some statistic somewhere that most of the time a woman's rapist is not a stranger. I don't know how true that is but I'll do my research on that before I claim it to be undisputed.

2. I know quite a few women who have (sadly) been sexually assaulted and what they were wearing varied among them to the point that it doesn't factor in. Dressing a certain way won't guarantee that someone won't rape you, unfortunately. So that whole argument has always been moot IMO.

 

[marcuz]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. You KNOW you're in a crip area (in your example), I don't know when/where the fukk imma be raped. Then if a woman is raped, it's "what was she wearing, how much did she drink, etc."

if you're just walking down the street, and some man grabs you and pulls you into an alley; no one is going to question what you were wearing or what you had to drink.

but if you were at a party, getting drunk, flirting with everybody. then yes, people are going to rightfully question you. what, should your word be taken as gold? women also lie about rape, yanno.

plenty of black men have had their lives ruined because of false allegations.

 

[marcuz]

I was not making it seem like that, stop trying to turn this into a "we hate men and want to rule over them" thing

rape culture is bullshyt, thats all im saying. i've never heard men discuss rape like its normal. the overwelming majority of ALL men are against raping a woman.

 

[PlainSight]

As much as I know about feminism, this is what I always thought. Before it became b*stardized into the mumbo jumbo it is now. It's just distraction at this point.

Half way through I realized you were a guy. I think Cheers to you for at least attempting to listen. I feel like some men are just so mad and stuck in that confines of the alpha male and masculinity that their pain turns into venom. And usually women are the easiest targets. I grew up with only brothers so I saw first hand how men are told to man up, suck it up and don't be a girl. And lord forbid they get beat by a girl . Men are just as trapped as us. And to add to the fact the "manface" they wear in public around other men/or in mixed crowds vs how they act alone with you. It's mind boggling.

Yeah, I'm a guy. I don't think this is a subject for me to be hostile about or scared of. Maybe it's because I'm somewhat accommodating of people in general, or a level of apathy. I think with any ideology, particularly one like feminism, there's going to be different theories and strands that make it difficult to identify what exactly it's about anymore. Most of the feminists I've spoken to of late have described themselves as "3rd wave". The little I know about that is that they are more sex positive overall and are more focused on things like objectification and LBTGQ issues all under the same umbrella.

As I said, LBTGQ issues are a gigantic paper-cannon so I avoid the subject. I'm quite tolerant of homosexuals and transgender but it's safe to say those in my immediate environment are the complete opposite! Again, comes back to being more accommodating than normal.

And regarding masculinity, you're 100% right. It's hard for a lot of guys to maintain - we aren't always bricks and concrete! It's easy for me to be masculine these days, I'm more in touch with that side of myself - but I don't neglect other parts of my character and not only that but I also do not belittle my peers for not being the same.

 

[Arishok]

if you're just walking down the street, and some man grabs you and pulls you into an alley; no one is going to question what you were wearing or what you had to drink.

but if you were at a party, getting drunk, flirting with everybody. then yes, people are going to rightfully question you. what, should your word be taken as gold? women also lie about rape, yanno.

plenty of black men have had their lives ruined because of false allegations.

Yes I know women lie about rape and your scenarios are more "fantasy", most women whi are actually raped are raped by people they know.

This is why I don't like even be friendly/flirty in a party setting because it's "she was wearing a tight dress, had two shots, and was flirting with every guy, she asked for it"

 

[thirdeye]

My question is if women denounce feminism, what should we do instead? I never hear anything about that lol.

 

[PlainSight]

rape culture is bullshyt, thats all im saying. i've never heard men discuss rape like its normal. the overwelming majority of ALL men are against raping a woman.

I don't think that's the argument at hand - I think it's the immediate discrediting of the woman, even when she's been proven right, that influences the concept of there being a rape culture. At least, that's how I understand it. I'm not prepared to dismiss it outright. How many times has a woman been questioned after a sexual assault to the tune of "were you drunk? Were you wearing tight clothes?" etc etc. The insinuation that she was "asking for it" is perceived in an insidious way by a lot of women.

It is known that women lie about shyt like this, but it's hard to distinguish because a LOT of women have been sexually assaulted. I meet too many that it's happened to.

 

[marcuz]

Yes I know women lie about rape and your scenarios are more "fantasy", most women whi are actually raped are raped by people they know.

This is why I don't like even be friendly/flirty in a party setting because it's "she was wearing a tight dress, had two shots, and was flirting with every guy, she asked for it"

oh stop it with the cliches. how is my scenario a fantasy? it happened earlier this year and late last year. you're the one coming with some fake scenario. if you're raped and have evidence, get a rape kit and prosecute;simple as that.

instead, most rape victims dont even tell anyone. then you blame "Rape culture" instead of your own cowardice.