Barkley: LeBron can't crack my all-time top five

[Eternal Tecate]

5 time champion, 2 time finals MVP, regular season MVP, 15 time all-star, 11 time all-nba 1st team, 9 time all-defense 1st team, 2 time scoring champ, #4 on the all-time scoring list

I don't care about your opinion. I'm simply talking resume versus resume. Take the names out and you can't tell me those 5 dudes got a better resume RIGHT NOW than Bean.

Bird and Bron only got MVPs on Kobe. Kobe got them on everything else (titles, all-star, all-nba, all-defense, all-time scoring list). Kobe has Shaq beat on EVERTHING except Shaq has one more finals MVP. Kobe got Duncan on everything except one less MVP and finals MVP (more titles, all-star, all-nba, all-defense, all-time scoring). Kobe has Hakeem on EVERYTHING. There is literally nothing that he has on Kobe other than more Defensive Player of the Year awards.

Kobe's resume is sure fire TOP 10.

There's something you're missing here: Kobe has only been the best player on his team for 2 titles. Same as Hakeem, Lebron, and Wilt. Except those 3 have several other advantages over him.

All star selection and all D selections can when comparing him to these guys. Kobe doesn't get bonus points for being a media darling, that has nothing to do with basketball ability, sorry.

 

[Swagnificent]

There's something you're missing here: Kobe has only been the best player on his team for 2 titles. Same as Hakeem, Lebron, and Wilt. Except those 3 have several other advantages over him.

All star selection and all D selections can when comparing him to these guys. Kobe doesn't get bonus points for being a media darling, that has nothing to do with basketball ability, sorry.

Like I said I'm only comparing resumes. Your the one bringing your opinion into this about whether or not Kobe got those selections based on media rep or actual ability or whether he was a sidekick. Note that all-defensive selections are made by the coaches not media. All in all, the all-nba and all-defensive selections are important because they show that you were the best offensive and defensive player at your position for a decade. That is huge.

On Kobe's resume it says 5 time champ. Not 2 time champ as leader, 3 time champ as sidekick. That is just YOUR OPINION. I don't agree with that and most NBA experts like Barkley don't agree with you since he said Kobe got 5 to LeBron's 2. Not 2 as the leader. Stop infusing your opinions into an objective argument.

I showed you that resume for resume, Kobe is sure fire top 10. In fact, he has a good argument for #6 all-time.

 

[dunkman6]

5 time champion
2 time finals MVP
regular season MVP
#4 on the all-time scoring list
15 time all-star
11 time all-nba 1st team
9 time all-defense 1st team
2 time scoring champ

I don't care about your opinion. I'm simply talking resume versus resume. Take the names out and you can't tell me those 5 dudes got a better resume RIGHT NOW than Bean.

Bird and Bron only got MVPs on Kobe. Kobe got them on everything else (titles, all-star, all-nba, all-defense, all-time scoring list). Kobe has Shaq beat on EVERTHING except Shaq has one more finals MVP (more titles, all-star, all-nba, all-defensive, all-time scoring). Kobe got Duncan on everything except one less MVP and finals MVP (more titles, all-star, all-nba, all-defense, all-time scoring). Kobe has Hakeem on EVERYTHING. There is literally nothing that he has on Kobe other than more Defensive Player of the Year awards.

Kobe's resume is sure fire TOP 10.

So I guess everyone he mentioned are shytty defenders, aren't on the all time scoring list and weren't all stars?

But I'm talking to a brick wall. Won't even go over all that other stuff.

 

[Swagnificent]

So I guess everyone he mentioned are shytty defenders, aren't on the all time scoring list and weren't all stars?

But I'm talking to a brick wall. Won't even go over all that other stuff.

I'm simply pointing out that compared to everyone else mentioned, Kobe has more all-nba 1st team selections, more all-defense 1st team selections, and is higher on the all-time scoring list. Your acting like those accomplishments mean nothing. Those are important accomplishments and show why Kobe's resume is BETTER than 5 of the dudes he listed.

Kobe is tied with Jordan, Payton, and Garnett for the RECORD for all-defense 1st team selections. THAT IS HUGE.

Kobe is tied with Malone for the RECORD for all-nba 1st team selections. THAT IS HUGE.

Kobe is #4 all-time in scoring behind Kareem, Malone, and MJ. THAT IS HUGE.

Those are all incredible accomplishments on his resume next to those 5 rings that make his place in the top 10 all-time a lock to any objectively reasonable NBA fan. A hater can find ways to discount it and make arguments for others. But an objective fan can't because that resume speaks.

 

[dunkman6]

I'm simply pointing out that compared to everyone else mentioned, Kobe has more all-nba 1st team selections, more all-defense 1st team selections, and is higher on the all-time scoring list. Your acting like those accomplishments mean nothing. Those are important accomplishments and show why Kobe's resume is BETTER than 5 of the dudes he listed.

Kobe is tied with Jordan and Payton for the RECORD for all-defense 1st team selections. THAT IS HUGE.

Kobe is tied with Malone for the RECORD for all-nba 1st team selections. THAT IS HUGE.

Kobe is #4 all-time in scoring behind Kareem, Malone, and MJ. THAT IS HUGE.

Those are all incredible accomplishments on his resume next to those 5 rings that make his place in the top 10 all-time a lock to any objectively reasonable NBA fan. A hater can find ways to discount it and make arguments for others. But an objective fan can't because that resume speaks.

Only thing he has on them is longevity. Most of those selections came because he's Kobe. And points? How many more shots did it take him to get there. Oh wait no, it's his ''IQ'' for the game.

 

[Swagnificent]

Only thing he has on them is longevity. Most of those selections came because he's Kobe. And points? How many more shots did it take him to get there. Oh wait no, it's his ''IQ'' for the game.

You act like that is not a big deal. If only a couple of great years made you top 10 then shouldn't T-Mac be there? Grant Hill? Sustained excellence matters. Being on top is nice. But staying there for more than a decade should count for alot. Why else is Kareem so high on many people's lists?

Here's a little perspective for those that don't understand how great Kobe has been for so long. Kobe in 2001 at the age of 22 put up: 28.5 ppg, 5.9 rpg, 5.0 apg on 46.9% shooting. Kobe last year (12 years after his breakout season) at the age of 34 put up: 27.3 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 6.0 apg on 46.3% shooting.

That sort of sustained excellence for over a decade while all your peers (A.I., T-Mac, Vince, Pierce, Ray Allen, etc.) have fallen off shows how much of a once in a lifetime athlete he is. I'll be interested to see if Bron in 5 years when he's 34 can match what he is doing right now in his physical prime the way Kobe has been able to do as he as aged.

Only 3 players in NBA history have been able to sustain this type of excellence as long as Kobe has. Kareem, Malone, and Jordan. Two of those guys are unanimous top 10. And the other guy would've been if he wasn't ringless.

 

[dunkman6]

You act like that is not a big deal. If only a couple of great years made you top 10 then shouldn't T-Mac be there? Grant Hill? Sustained excellence matters. Being on top is nice. But staying there for more than a decade should count for alot. Why else is Kareem so high on many people's lists?

Here's a little perspective for those that don't understand how great Kobe has been for so long. Kobe in 2001 at the age of 22 put up: 28.5 ppg, 5.9 rpg, 5.0 apg on 46.9% shooting. Kobe last year (12 years after his breakout season) at the age of 34 put up: 27.3 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 6.0 apg on 46.3% shooting.

That sort of sustained excellence for over a decade while all your peers (A.I., T-Mac, Vince, Pierce, Ray Allen, etc.) have fallen off shows how much of a once in a lifetime athlete he is. I'll be interested to see if Bron in 5 years when he's 34 can match what he is doing right now in his physical prime the way Kobe has been able to do as he as aged.

Only 3 players in NBA history have been able to sustain this type of excellence as long as Kobe has. Kareem, Malone, and Jordan. Two of those guys are unanimous top 10. And the other guy would've been if he wasn't ringless.

he broke out 12 years ago and only has one mvp to show for it?


And I never said it wasn't a big deal. I was actually giving props.

 

[Eternal Tecate]

5 time champion

Didn't see that you bolded some. Here we go.

Bird-
Bird's peak from 84-86 in which he won 3 straight MVPs shyts on anything Kobe ever did. He was the clear best player on a top 3 team ever assembled in 86. Bird was better than Kobe at everything but man to man defense. He scored at the same volume with better efficiency, was a better rebounder, better passer, and better team defender. He was the best player on his team for every one of his rings. He has 3 Finals MVPs to Kobe's 1. He has 3 MVPs to Kobe's 1. He played in the most competitive era of all time. His titles came against the Showtime Lakers, not the poverty Magic and the past their prime Celtics. When he was drafted the Celtics went from a 20 something win team to a 60 something win team. Kobe's bulk accolades don't mean shyt when comparing him to Bird because Bird's peak play was so much higher and even in less years he accomplished more as a player. And no, I don't consider all star teams and all defensive teams an accomplishment worth noting when discussing the best players of all time.

Shaq-
Shaq also has 3 Finals MVPs and was clearly, by far, not even close, the best player on all of his Laker teams. Shaq's presence on both ends of the court shat on anything Kobe was capable of. He was one of the 3 most dominant offensive forces to ever step on the court. Kobe's impact never touched Shaq's, not when he played with him, not when he was chucking, and not when he was winning championships as the man.

Duncan-
4 titles and 3 Finals MVPs, and Tony Parker's MVP was a joke. In 02-03 he pulled a Hakeem and put a mediocre team on his back in route to a championship. He's one of the greatest defenders ever, and even last year his old ass showed that he can still turn it on when it mattered. His peak is far higher than anything Kobe reached.

Hakeem-
2 Finals MVPs with teams worse than anything Kobe had during the years he won a championship. A far, far, FAR greater defensive impact than Kobe could ever muster. He was top 3 all time at worst.

Lebron-
4 MVPs and counting, 2 Finals MVPs already, way higher peak, way higher offensive impact, way higher defensive impact, it's not eve close anymore that ship has sailed.

 

[nieman]

Didn't see that you bolded some. Here we go.

Bird-
Bird's peak from 84-86 in which he won 3 straight MVPs shyts on anything Kobe ever did. He was the clear best player on a top 3 team ever assembled in 86. Bird was better than Kobe at everything but man to man defense. He scored at the same volume with better efficiency, was a better rebounder, better passer, and better team defender. He was the best player on his team for every one of his rings. He has 3 Finals MVPs to Kobe's 1. He has 3 MVPs to Kobe's 1. He played in the most competitive era of all time. His titles came against the Showtime Lakers, not the poverty Magic and the past their prime Celtics. When he was drafted the Celtics went from a 20 something win team to a 60 something win team. Kobe's bulk accolades don't mean shyt when comparing him to Bird because Bird's peak play was so much higher and even in less years he accomplished more as a player. And no, I don't consider all star teams and all defensive teams an accomplishment worth noting when discussing the best players of all time.

Shaq-
Shaq also has 3 Finals MVPs and was clearly, by far, not even close, the best player on all of his Laker teams. Shaq's presence on both ends of the court shat on anything Kobe was capable of. He was one of the 3 most dominant offensive forces to ever step on the court. Kobe's impact never touched Shaq's, not when he played with him, not when he was chucking, and not when he was winning championships as the man.

Duncan-
4 titles and 3 Finals MVPs, and Tony Parker's MVP was a joke. In 02-03 he pulled a Hakeem and put a mediocre team on his back in route to a championship. He's one of the greatest defenders ever, and even last year his old ass showed that he can still turn it on when it mattered. His peak is far higher than anything Kobe reached.

Hakeem-
2 Finals MVPs with teams worse than anything Kobe had during the years he won a championship. A far, far, FAR greater defensive impact than Kobe could ever muster. He was top 3 all time at worst.

Lebron-
4 MVPs and counting, 2 Finals MVPs already, way higher peak, way higher offensive impact, way higher defensive impact, it's not eve close anymore that ship has sailed.

I can't rank Lebron in Top 5 because of a few reasons. He has 4 MVPs, but who are his peers? Where is his competition in that regard? Durant, Melo, Kobe and Rose are the only other ones who are even lethal enough scorers (scorers period) to carry a team, Kobe damn near 2 decades in and is the only one of them that can impact a game in different ways. Melo will NEVER get MVP consideration and Rose was hurt. So Lebron is the best by a wide margin athleticism and explosiveness.

Secondly, for someone that's a "once in a generation" talent, where are his phenomenal stats and accomplishments? Where are the things we've never seen before? Where is his 25 & 10 rpg or apg for a full season? A week of averaging 45ppg, 10 3s in a game, a barrage of triple doubles, a 40-20-15 triple double...something spectacular, something unique. He's the biggest, fastest, strongest and one of the best passers but still putting up Tmac/Vince/Clyde numbers. He has what..5 more triple doubles than Grant Hill. That automatically drops him from Top 10...unless he wins 2more rings. That's just my opinion.

Lebron's ranking have always been about potential, not actual accomplishments.

 

[Methodical]

Bird, Magic, Hakeem, Shaq>>>>>>Lebron. Lebron got rings when he joined up with other superstars and I wouldnt put him in top 10. i would have more respect Lebron if he won the rings in his hometown in Ohio, Clev Cavs by himself

 

[Eternal Tecate]

I can't rank Lebron in Top 5 because of a few reasons. He has 4 MVPs, but who are his peers? Where is his competition in that regard? Durant, Melo, Kobe and Rose are the only other ones who are even lethal enough scorers (scorers period) to carry a team, Kobe damn near 2 decades in and is the only one of them that can impact a game in different ways. Melo will NEVER get MVP consideration and Rose was hurt. So Lebron is the best by a wide margin athleticism and explosiveness.

Secondly, for someone that's a "once in a generation" talent, where are his phenomenal stats and accomplishments? Where are the things we've never seen before? Where is his 25 & 10 rpg or apg for a full season? A week of averaging 45ppg, 10 3s in a game, a barrage of triple doubles, a 40-20-15 triple double...something spectacular, something unique. He's the biggest, fastest, strongest and one of the best passers but still putting up Tmac/Vince/Clyde numbers. He has what..5 more triple doubles than Grant Hill. That automatically drops him from Top 10...unless he wins 2more rings. That's just my opinion.

Lebron's ranking have always been about potential, not actual accomplishments.

No player in NBA history has done anything you've mentioned are you fukking retarded. By those standards no player is top 5 all time.

He has the 3rd highest career PPG of all time. He's led the league in PER 6 years in a row. 4 of the highest single season marks of all time. 4 of the top 11 single season winshares/48 marks. He puts up 30/7/7 seasons routinely. Nobody else has done that except Oscar Robinson when the pace of the game was much, much quicker. This is probably the dumbest argument against Lebron you could possibly make.

His peers are just fine what kind of shyt argument is that. This entire post can

 

[Eternal Tecate]

Bird, Magic, Hakeem, Shaq>>>>>>Lebron. Lebron got rings when he joined up with other superstars and I wouldnt put him in top 10. i would have more respect Lebron if he won the rings in his hometown in Ohio, Clev Cavs by himself

Bird and Magic both won with other hall of famers on their team. Hakeem won pretty much by himself. Shaq won one by himself and then 2 with Kobe after he came into his own.

 

[T.he I.nformant]

Last time I checked one was better than none soooooo...Eddy Curry >>> Charles Barkley

 

[Methodical]

Bird and Magic both won with other hall of famers on their team. Hakeem won pretty much by himself. Shaq won one by himself and then 2 with Kobe after he came into his own.

Different is that they got draft through by their teams while LeBron in his prime and gave up on his ownhometown and actually had chat with other superstars while in off season about why not join up on the same team and win in easy way...to me thats actually a

 

[Methodical]

thats a bytch move