BREAKING: Deal to end government shutdown in reach. Democrats caving? Only asking for a PROMISE of a vote for ACA Tax credits.

[jadillac]

Many of them would rather starve and die under an oppressive backstabbing yt conman, than thrive under a colored president

 

[Strapped]

 

[num123]

What people are expecting is that the democratic party should be an opposition party. Being an opposition party doesn't mean adopting the framing of your opponent when it comes to certain issues to the point where you are more focused on trying to take voters from that party than empowering those who are your own base and appealing to the people who stayed home.

Look, people whose rights are used as a political bargaining chip ALWAYS show up, the issue is the whites who won't be negatively affected either way who choose to stay home. As you saw in New York, people had a choice to vote for a "lesser" evil in the forms of adams and cuomo. They didn't vote for either and instead voted for someone who actually made what they want the focus of his campaign(taxing the rich parasites and using those funds on things that would make it easier to afford living in the city like other mayors(including mayor Laguardia!) have done). The democrat response was to delay endorsement, join in on republican style bigotry, and double down on criticizing the candidate for not being sufficiently submissive to the demands of a foreign country. They spent 22 million because they had no actual policies besides "I'm not republican" and they lost.

People want POLICIES that will change their lives. Donald Trump understands a BASIC fact of politics: You should promise things and then deliver on them in a way that people can see. He promised to cut down immigration and what did he do? he started construction on a wall and gave ICE basically a blank check to do whatever they want. People who voted for him can point to the wall and they can point to the footage of people they hate being assaulted and arrested and say "he followed through". He promised law and order in "warzone" cities and there are camoflaged soldiers toting rifles in those cities. MAGAts are VERY satisfied with their vote because they can literally see the policies they voted for in action.

Obama said he'd expand healthcare coverage. He can always point to the ACA and say "I delivered on that. It's not perfect, but it's better than what was there before" Obama said he'd resolve the financial crisis and he can always point to General Motors and say "that company was on the verge of ruin. My policies saved it. He can point to the stimulus checks he signed and say "I put food on people's tables". As shytty as the chinese communist party is, they lifted over 800 million people out of poverty and created a sophisticated transportation system, home ownership is close to or over 80% and they have universal health care. People don't want to vote for the "lesser of two evils" they want to vote for someone who ACTUALLY represents their interests. What democrats have been doing is kicking the can down the road and allowing republicans to be a cudgel they can use to threaten the american people into voting for them only for them to do nothing that would actually help the majority of americans but would keep their donors happy.

I'm one of those people that emphasizes community organization and mutual aid because that shyt actually gets results. Look at how democrats behave when they lose elections. Do they donate their time and money to community legal aid? do they donate their time and money to food banks? do you see them joining in to help unions win lawsuits? do they donate time and money to make sure people have access to healthcare in their own communities? no of course not. Do they engage in actual community activism and boycotts? of course not. Those pussies run back to their gated community and write a book about how sad they feel about losing and then go around doing interviews and lectures about how they're a loser but they'll still "fight" and spam you with text messages and emails begging for more money. How the fukk do you get 1 billion dollars to run a campaign against a white supremacist and not only lose, but then also end up in DEBT?

I'm not a millionaire but I at least donate financially to local organizations and boost them whenever I can. What the fukk is Chuck Schumer or Hakeem jeffries doing other than trying to see who can suck billionaire and israeli dikk the hardest? Mexico is a country we've been told should be conservative considering how the majority of people are catholics and that they have a strong patriarchal machismo culture. How the fukk did they end up electing a jewish woman with a european last name who ran on a socialist platform? How did Brazil go from an incompetent fascist to a socialist? how did America's center of finance that was a victim of Islamic terrorism elect a Muslim who doesn't back down when he's called a socialist? BECAUSE OF THE POLICIES. Because he said "I'm not the lesser evil, I'm not evil at all" and despite the efforts of a 22 million dollar smear campaign, people got off their asses and voted for him because he was actually offering policies they wanted instead of fear mongering about conservative politicians. They voted for him because he literally ASKED them what they wanted instead of paying consultant firms to tell them some bullshyt and give them moronic talking points that reflect what the investors want and not what people want.

It speaks to the sheer power of propaganda that it's considered "radical" and not "electable" for a politician to propose common sense policies. The power and omnipresence of propaganda telling people to not expect their elected officials to put forth policy that is popular and changes people's lives has created a gigantic rift between the reality that regular people live in, and the fantasy that these millionaires and aspiring millionaires that control the democratic party. It's not too much to ask for for a party to do more than write strongly worded letters and cave into nearly every republican demand. That's literally how politics USED to be done in this country and that's how people like FDR were able to create the welfare state that republicans began to dismantle and democrats are all too cool with helping them dismantle if they can use it as part of their campaign sloganeering.

All of this can be summed up in one clear sentence: The voters elect their representatives.

Nothing else matters. The people have the right to vote for who they want to represent them.

If the people want different representatives then they need to either vote for different people or just vote in general.

To expect people that do bullshyt but stay getting elected to office to change up is insanity.

The issue is and will always be the voter. Not the politician, not the party but the voter. People crying about politicians being in office for decades but will never blame their constituents for not getting them out. The people are their own problem and will be until they get their collective shyt together.

 

[Strapped]

 

[CrimsonTider]

The subsidies have been essential for people buying healthcare through Obamacare. In 2025, 24 million individuals obtained insurance through the ACA marketplace, and the Center on Budget and Policy reports that 93% of enrollees received tax credits that helped reduce their costs.
If Obamacare subsidies do expire, though, marketplace estimates say that premiums could double—or even triple— for those 22 million Americans who receive enhanced subsidies that make health premiums cheaper. According to health policy research group KFF 57% of ACA marketplace enrollees live in Republican congressional districts.

Older adults and seniors are particularly at risk of losing access to their healthcare, since the subsidies spurred a 50% reduction in the uninsured rate among Americans 50 to 64.

These people should’ve voted for the Dems in November 2024.

The subsidies were lost when they put Trump back in office because of the price of eggs are whatever the hell is happening in the Middle East

 

[Afro]

All of this can be summed up in one clear sentence:

You would have to ignore a lot of that post to just say it's the voter's fault.

Then again, that is how a lot of people think round here so your line of thinking tracks.

"Easy" answers. That is one reason why we will never have a real third party.

That is also a reason why we will play this dumbass game of hot potato politics until the heat death of the universe.

 

[Wiseborn]

Literally none of that matters as long as people get what they want RIGHT NOW. What whites want RIGHT NOW is to feel like america belongs to them and they're the "real" owners of the land they stole from natives and came to as immigrants to make sure that america didn't have similar demographics to brazil. They feel like they're being "replaced" by immigrants so when they turn on the TV and see a screaming brown woman with a baby being ripped from her arms they don't think "this is horrible" they think "good, finally someone is doing something about these invaders who are trying to outbreed us". They don't care if immigrants end up back anyway or if the ones at farms and big plants are off limits all they're seeing is people they feel threatened by being eliminated.

And you're right about the clean air act. Nobody can see what they fukking did. Now if it was a bill that involved a public works program and people can say "yeah my cousin got a job building a nuclear powerplant" "yeah I got a job working in customer service for a construction firm because of this government program" or "I noticed a lot more electric charging stations. Gas prices have gone down because they're competing now with EVs on the road. My auntie got one of those Chinese cars for 2k after trading in her old Nissan" then they'd be able to proudly boast that for re-election campaigns.

Obama won because he offered people plans. Mccain said the fundamentals of the economy were sound, he forgot how many houses he owned, and his wife was literally a multibillionaire. He was completely out of touch with how people were feeling financially. Obama went in for the kill by offering people financial relief to increase spending, offering a withdrawal from Iraq, and promising to double efforts in finding Osama Bin Laden. What did he do? he negotiated a withdrawal from Iraq and did IN HIS FIRST TERM what George Bush failed to do in 8 years. He confirmed the death of bin laden and al qaeda was made irrelevant as an organization. He had plans and he delivered on those plans and as Biden said in the 2012 DNC "Osama Bin Laden is dead, and General Motors is alive"

Obama wasn't the lesser of two evils, that was hilary clinton and Joe Biden whom he beat and then hoed out by making them work for him. To act like that man wasn't a political genius is hilarious. He was criticized for a lack of political experience, and he laughed that shyt off because he knew that americans don't care about political experience, they care about who is validating their concerns and offering concrete examples of shyt that he'll do for them. Trump understood this which is why he beat all of his competitors in the republican party and defeated clinton in 2016. He came in basically confirming "yes the system is rigged, I ought to know because I've given money to both parties and they gave me what I want. Don't worry though, I'm on your side voters" and surprise surprise, that shyt worked especially because he also harnessed the racism in this country's DNA to promise white people that they'd be free to be their worst selves with no pushback--something he delivered on.

C'mon my guy you can't seriously think that the Government can give you a job. I mean they can if they set the parameters of how much you make at said job which is basically communism.


Besides the people who really need direct help from the government is political children Lets say The President asks Congress for Wind farm money and they put it in the budget first of all they'll have to do environmental impact studies then get buy in from the community source land possibly through emanent domian buy the time it's shovel ready will be years and the wild thing is the local Politician will be at the ribbon cutting taking credit. When the plant is operational people will forget that The president was the catalyst for the whole thing and certainly won't reward his successor. How do I know this because it happened under Biden



I was looking for the PBS story of a guy who got training and a job as an electrician for a Biden project that was killed by Trump (who he voted for)

 

[Scustin Bieburr]

All of this can be summed up in one clear sentence: The voters elect their representatives.

Nothing else matters. The people have the right to vote for who they want to represent them.

If the people want different representatives then they need to either vote for different people or just vote in general.

To expect people that do bullshyt but stay getting elected to office to change up is insanity.

The issue is and will always be the voter. Not the politician, not the party but the voter. People crying about politicians being in office for decades but will never blame their constituents for not getting them out. The people are their own problem and will be until they get their collective shyt together.

You are committed to your position so there's no point talking about this. You didnt even bother to use examples whilst ive given multiple in this thread explaining my point of view. If its easier to believe its completely on the electorate and youre willing to give a pass to politicians who won't propose meaningful policy while also attacking members of their own party who get motion from proposing policies that voters have said they want, I dont think anything will convince you otherwise.

C'mon my guy you can't seriously think that the Government can give you a job. I mean they can if they set the parameters of how much you make at said job which is basically communism.


Besides the people who really need direct help from the government is political children Lets say The President asks Congress for Wind farm money and they put it in the budget first of all they'll have to do environmental impact studies then get buy in from the community source land possibly through emanent domian buy the time it's shovel ready will be years and the wild thing is the local Politician will be at the ribbon cutting taking credit. When the plant is operational people will forget that The president was the catalyst for the whole thing and certainly won't reward his successor. How do I know this because it happened under Biden



I was looking for the PBS story of a guy who got training and a job as an electrician for a Biden project that was killed by Trump (who he voted for)

Holy shyt dude what the fukk are you actually saying. There was literally a government jobs program it was all part of the new deal. Look man, if you dont believe that major change is possible then it is what it is.

Feel free to believe that while you watch as Republicans successfully enact their radical agenda

https://www.project2025.observer/en

Then continue to believe the shyt that allows democrats to attack progressives who want to use proven and popular policies to change people's lives while they get to sit back and take pac money as they let Republicans do what they want.

If its easier for you to believe that progressive policies are unrealistic and have no precedence in American life, again I gave multiple examples including an election that just fukking happened where a guy proposed "free bus routes and grocery stores" and won then be at peace I guess.

For me the answer is very clear. People want policies that will change their lives for the better and the precedents(Lincoln, FDR, Bernie sanders whole political career in Vermont, Obama, Trump(evil version of this) isnt enough for you to believe this is not only possible but what gets people activated to go to the polls then I cant convince you otherwise.

I can only speak for myself and I can tell you it gives me absolutely no peace to believe that the democratic party as it exists is an effective party and is meeting the needs of people even when all opinion polls of them are abysmal and their progressive candidates have gotten positive attention while their "moderates" have horrible approval ratings. If it gives you peace to blame the voters then i guess this is you protecting your peace and I wont disrupt that process for you any longer.

 

[num123]

You are committed to your position so there's no point talking about this. You didnt even bother to use examples whilst ive given multiple in this thread explaining my point of view. If its easier to believe its completely on the electorate and youre willing to give a pass to politicians who won't propose meaningful policy while also attacking members of their own party who get motion from proposing policies that voters have said they want, I dont think anything will convince you otherwise.

How in the fukk is it not the responsibility of the voter to VOTE for good people? How is it not the responsibility of the voter to get people out if they are not doing things for the average person? How is it not the responsibility of the NON VOTER for the shyt that they are currently in?

These politicians are not appointed to office: they are elected and re-elected by the people in their district. You can not get around the fact that if you have a problem with the politician and they keep getting elected, then the problem is the people that are in their district.

It is complete insanity to not think that the public is responsible for ensuring they have proper representation, because that is the WHOLE fukkING POINT OF A REPRESENTATIVE DEMOCRACY! We don't fukking live in China or some other authoritarian hellhole, we live in a country where we choose our government and people are overall too stupid to take it seriously.

 

[num123]

You would have to ignore a lot of that post to just say it's the voter's fault.

Then again, that is how a lot of people think round here so your line of thinking tracks.

"Easy" answers. That is one reason why we will never have a real third party.

That is also a reason why we will play this dumbass game of hot potato politics until the heat death of the universe.

It is the voter's fault or more accurately it is the public's fault. People are the ones that vote in politicians. People are the ones that either re-elect or put someone else in to office. That is it, simple as that.

If you are one of the fukking people crying about Pelosi, Schumer, Jefferies, etc... then ask why in the fukk do the people in their district either keep voting them in or not voting at all? Always crying about term limits but if people actually took politics serious then they would never even need to talk about limits. If you think they are not doing their job, do you know what you do? VOTE THEM THE fukk OUT!.

Pelosi has been in government since 1987 and Schumer since 1975, more than enough time for people to fukking vote them out and never let them back into office but that never happened.

Do you want to know why we will never have a "real" third party? Because the fukking average American is an absolute idiot. Dimwitted, no agency, passive and just plain retarded when it comes to politics and frankly most things. You think people that either voted for or did not vote and allowed virulent racists that hate the poor to get into office are all of a sudden going to "see the light"? fukk out of here.

 

[jmegamar]

The people voted for the fukking Republicans, let's not move past that. What happened is on the voter so anything that follows is on them and the Republicans. Voting matters and the voters shyt the bed last election.

This. If you hated the big name Dems like Kamala, fine. People don’t want to go back to the fact that 90 million people chose not to vote and could have given Dems the House or Senate. That would have basically hamstrung like 50% of the bullshyt that had happened so far. Still fukk Schumer and Jeffries but damnit if you hate them that much vote them the fukk out. People gotta learn to do more than just yell into the ether online. Vote damnit.

 

[audemarzz]

Hopeless, its always been a fruitless effort.

 

[num123]

If you hated the big name Dems like Kamala, fine. People don’t want to go back to the fact that 90 million people chose not to vote and could have given Dems the House or Senate. That would have basically hamstrung like 50% of the bullshyt that had happened so far. Still fukk Schumer and Jeffries but damnit if you hate them that much vote them the fukk out. People gotta learn to do more than just yell into the ether online. Vote damnit.

I did not like Kamala at any point but she would of been infinitely better than Trump. Any establishment Democrat is infinitely better than the best Republican. You do not like the "centrist" or establishment Democrats? Then fukking vote them out in the primaries.

I don't like them but when it comes time to vote for someone different, all the people crying about them now don't show up to the primaries to vote them out. These people are staying in office with the low turnout but then people want to say voting does not matter, come the fukk on.

 

[Wiseborn]

You are committed to your position so there's no point talking about this. You didnt even bother to use examples whilst ive given multiple in this thread explaining my point of view. If its easier to believe its completely on the electorate and youre willing to give a pass to politicians who won't propose meaningful policy while also attacking members of their own party who get motion from proposing policies that voters have said they want, I dont think anything will convince you otherwise.


Holy shyt dude what the fukk are you actually saying. There was literally a government jobs program it was all part of the new deal. Look man, if you dont believe that major change is possible then it is what it is.

Feel free to believe that while you watch as Republicans successfully enact their radical agenda

https://www.project2025.observer/en

Then continue to believe the shyt that allows democrats to attack progressives who want to use proven and popular policies to change people's lives while they get to sit back and take pac money as they let Republicans do what they want.

If its easier for you to believe that progressive policies are unrealistic and have no precedence in American life, again I gave multiple examples including an election that just fukking happened where a guy proposed "free bus routes and grocery stores" and won then be at peace I guess.

For me the answer is very clear. People want policies that will change their lives for the better and the precedents(Lincoln, FDR, Bernie sanders whole political career in Vermont, Obama, Trump(evil version of this) isnt enough for you to believe this is not only possible but what gets people activated to go to the polls then I cant convince you otherwise.

I can only speak for myself and I can tell you it gives me absolutely no peace to believe that the democratic party as it exists is an effective party and is meeting the needs of people even when all opinion polls of them are abysmal and their progressive candidates have gotten positive attention while their "moderates" have horrible approval ratings. If it gives you peace to blame the voters then i guess this is you protecting your peace and I wont disrupt that process for you any longer.

No man for the most part the government's job is regulations. Sure there can be a massive public works project here and there but universal basic income is as likely as reparations


Crazy that full bothsiders and democrat skeptics kinda agree its fukk the Democrats because they can't enact socialist policies so as you said the Republicans win by default

 

[Wiseborn]

You are committed to your position so there's no point talking about this. You didnt even bother to use examples whilst ive given multiple in this thread explaining my point of view. If its easier to believe its completely on the electorate and youre willing to give a pass to politicians who won't propose meaningful policy while also attacking members of their own party who get motion from proposing policies that voters have said they want, I dont think anything will convince you otherwise.


Holy shyt dude what the fukk are you actually saying. There was literally a government jobs program it was all part of the new deal. Look man, if you dont believe that major change is possible then it is what it is.

Feel free to believe that while you watch as Republicans successfully enact their radical agenda

https://www.project2025.observer/en

Then continue to believe the shyt that allows democrats to attack progressives who want to use proven and popular policies to change people's lives while they get to sit back and take pac money as they let Republicans do what they want.

If its easier for you to believe that progressive policies are unrealistic and have no precedence in American life, again I gave multiple examples including an election that just fukking happened where a guy proposed "free bus routes and grocery stores" and won then be at peace I guess.

For me the answer is very clear. People want policies that will change their lives for the better and the precedents(Lincoln, FDR, Bernie sanders whole political career in Vermont, Obama, Trump(evil version of this) isnt enough for you to believe this is not only possible but what gets people activated to go to the polls then I cant convince you otherwise.

I can only speak for myself and I can tell you it gives me absolutely no peace to believe that the democratic party as it exists is an effective party and is meeting the needs of people even when all opinion polls of them are abysmal and their progressive candidates have gotten positive attention while their "moderates" have horrible approval ratings. If it gives you peace to blame the voters then i guess this is you protecting your peace and I wont disrupt that process for you any longer.

All add in a democracy #bothsides have to compromise meaning both democrats and republicans