Could Bootcamp have even been bigger than The Wu ?

[Danie84]

As a kid I always wondered how Duck Down ended up on a West Coast lable like Priority Records, when LOUD seemed like the perfect fit with WU, MOBB, 3 6 Mafia, and The Alkaholiks

 

[FunkDoc1112]

36 is a culmination of styles, using kung fu movies to market their music, with an entire brand new defining sound to match. shyt sounded like kung fu fights on wax. The while who is everyone aspect with a solo standout.

Tical is a drug head album with rockish type beats, and had wuropeans remixing the songs into techno/house hits. Meth being so popular had them branching out to pop rap with puff.

Return was an old school blaxploitation comedy esque old sound record that could fit with modern rap of the times west coast stuff in a way with catchy tunes. Odb was then marketed to the pop market while having the absolute rawest beats out. He collabed with dozens of rnb singers and rock stars.

Cuban linx uses mafia/street culture. This locked down streets snd the nyc white boys. Staple of street rap wnd kept their name good even when they were out the light so rae / ghost stayed working with top street rappers for decades.


Liquid swords is heady shyt for college kids. Marketed on college radio. Got the hipsters. Its dark and lyrical. It uses classic b movie to market off of: japanese style this time. Used the movie theme in full. Comic book cover art. legit MOVIE on wax and sampling a Classic ug movie and made it his own. . Gza was directing getting into the diy movie vibe of the eras 90s ug movies too. Singles were marketed on those films of the time like fresh.

Ironman was the soul album, marketed using soeed racet cartoons, anime / a combo of all the previous movie brandings, colorful language, clothes/gear… wu wear blew up same time. Marvel comics off branding. Deck was sposed to use spiderman at this time.

Wi tang forever 5% stuff on tour with rage, almost rock group type marketed. by then wu was on skateboards like the misfits and in skate vids, mtv specials and off it went. By then they dominated soundtracks that kept them out there even if the radio in nyc died.


99 it was vudeogames. 10 releases main. 10 ug wu on 20 diff labels. Each in different lane. Killarmy was military… bootcamps gimmivk.

Score / ost sets for big directors. West coast beez + Bobby digital album and film. They put the W on kung fu flicks and re released them all with new names. Belly movie / ost. Black and white movie / ost. Killer beez had hits in europe with la saga and had an entire euro only releases before any act in rap. Eventually that lead to a slew of score / ost side releases and they again dominated the underground market.

Rza basically… worked a deal with EVERY label so wu stayed being promoted.

always had tie ins for every album. On a whole diff level. Hed score. Then have a side ost. Then a solo album. Then a group album. Then a wu comp. Then another solo. And anothrr score. Then a european album / mixtape. Now he does jingles for ad campaigns and promotes all types of products and keeps wus music in commercials like its mtv in 90s.

Everything was carefully crafted to different markets/sub cultures. Even in doing kill bill ghost dog and afro samurai. Which is why i saw gunns wwf thing a mile away and knew some day someone would use that shyt even in 90s.


Bcc could barely hold one consistant sound with 4 diff groups for 4 albums.. It didnt pop like wu. They couldnt compete with wu sonically let alone business wise and rzas vision of sampling

Wu was a testament to the strength of marketing. On paper they should've been some super underground nikkas but RZA had a VISION

 

[GeeEffKay]

Of course not lol. Wu are once in a lifetime group. Like mentioned already they didnt have anything close to the star power, charisma and rap unique styles of Meth, ODB, Rae, Ghost, GZA, etc or the arguable GOAT producer like RZA to helm everything.

 

[Awesome Wells]

It was Ruck and Rock that changed the Boot Camp sound to move away from Da Beatminerz. Technically, it was they who initiated the experiment with other producers. They even sh!tted on the Minerz on Rap City, calling them the Sweetminerz.



You can basically say it was them who started using BCC with females singing on the hook, a style that began with Nocturnal.

This is what I've been telling people all thread.

They're the ones that started sh*tting on Dee and Walt. Buck said he didn't like how they were handling things, but that they were "their own men". Problem was, this was the beginning of the end for the whole crew. When Buck started working on his project with 9th Wonder, he said he feels like he should've stepped in when Ruck and Rock started causing all the friction in the crew. He said he was too chill about it back in the day.

 

[maxamusa]

As a kid I always wondered how Duck Down ended up on a West Coast lable like Priority Records, when LOUD seemed like the perfect fit with WU, MOBB, 3 6 Mafia, and The Alkaholiks

man LOUD really was a FORCE



imagine that shyt

 

[maxamusa]

I think Deck has a handful of verses that show he has a level of depth Starang never reached. Duel of the Iron Mic is an obvious one. Oddly enough, bombing atomically is not one for me. But he has an obscure verse on Cormega’s Industry remix that I think of. You had to have been there for that moment to understand it: Starang was a thing. A lot of us thought he had it.

did the DnD studios incident impact OGC's trajectory?

 

[Awesome Wells]

I think Deck has a handful of verses that show he has a level of depth Starang never reached. Duel of the Iron Mic is an obvious one. Oddly enough, bombing atomically is not one for me. But he has an obscure verse on Cormega’s Industry remix that I think of. You had to have been there for that moment to understand it: Starang was a thing. A lot of us thought he had it.

Facts.

I think a good example was Deck on "Cold World". I f*cked with a few of his features a lot. Never liked the "bomb atomically" sh*t, lol. Like ever.

But yeah, Starang was definitely a thing. I remember seeing him at The Muse live and other spots in the city, back then, freestyling and tearing shows up. Everybody I knew, especially in Brooklyn, wanted him to go solo. A lot of time has passed, and for people today it might sound wild, but dude was definitely one of those MC's a lot of us thought had next, back then.

 

[reserved_one]

This is a great thread….ive been a WU head for as long as I could remember but I was super late on BCC in general outside of Black Moon and Smif N Wessun’s first albums which were classics and Sean Price solo material.

Nocturnal is a 5 mic classic also and it’s been in heavy rotation as of late…even the compilation. Da Beatminerz laced the whole click with some hot fire…..they should’ve stuck with that sound imo.

WU on the other hand was just a different beast….7 out of the 9 members are legit all time greats (RZA with the production) and transcended hip hop.

 

[WIA20XX]

This is a great thread

I had my theories, but a lot of actual factuals was dropped in this joint.

Might be my most personally satisfying thread in the booth ever

 

[thelonious21]

Steele, Buckshot, Sean Price AND Starang are all way nicer than Deck.

Lies..

Only Sean P could fukk with them cats.


But the thing about Wu that made them stand out is that it was 9 of them nikkaz..

Off top it was like daaamn.. it was never seen before.. and they were all nice.

And the beats they used sounded NOTHING like what was out

 

[Pegasus Jackson]

One word that cements the difference between the two groups: Charisma

 

[Sean7]

Ruck and Rock had star power but For The People album was an all time fumble that they never recovered from.

100% what I was going to say... They were doing the duo albums and were on the come up (Smiff N Wessun, Black Moon and Heltah Skeltah) in the mid 90s and heads wanted that album to drop and they had a huge shot with that group album to make their claim in the game that they officially made it with a classic album together..... HUGE FUMBLE and they weren't the same after that as far as hype goes and music wise they were steady on the down sides a few albums here and there (OGC Mpire was coo, Magnum Force was dope and War Zone was a good album) but they never regained their footing they had after that album. I will always say that was their downturn and the hype was gone and heads were left wanting a lot more. Epic fumble, they had a huge shot.

Ruck and Rock had star power but For The People album was an all time fumble that they never recovered from.

 

[Big Boss]

36 is a culmination of styles, using kung fu movies to market their music, with an entire brand new defining sound to match. shyt sounded like kung fu fights on wax. The while who is everyone aspect with a solo standout.

Tical is a drug head album with rockish type beats, and had wuropeans remixing the songs into techno/house hits. Meth being so popular had them branching out to pop rap with puff.

Return was an old school blaxploitation comedy esque old sound record that could fit with modern rap of the times west coast stuff in a way with catchy tunes. Odb was then marketed to the pop market while having the absolute rawest beats out. He collabed with dozens of rnb singers and rock stars.

Cuban linx uses mafia/street culture. This locked down streets snd the nyc white boys. Staple of street rap wnd kept their name good even when they were out the light so rae / ghost stayed working with top street rappers for decades.


Liquid swords is heady shyt for college kids. Marketed on college radio. Got the hipsters. Its dark and lyrical. It uses classic b movie to market off of: japanese style this time. Used the movie theme in full. Comic book cover art. legit MOVIE on wax and sampling a Classic ug movie and made it his own. . Gza was directing getting into the diy movie vibe of the eras 90s ug movies too. Singles were marketed on those films of the time like fresh.

Ironman was the soul album, marketed using soeed racet cartoons, anime / a combo of all the previous movie brandings, colorful language, clothes/gear… wu wear blew up same time. Marvel comics off branding. Deck was sposed to use spiderman at this time.

Wi tang forever 5% stuff on tour with rage, almost rock group type marketed. by then wu was on skateboards like the misfits and in skate vids, mtv specials and off it went. By then they dominated soundtracks that kept them out there even if the radio in nyc died.


99 it was vudeogames. 10 releases main. 10 ug wu on 20 diff labels. Each in different lane. Killarmy was military… bootcamps gimmivk.

Score / ost sets for big directors. West coast beez + Bobby digital album and film. They put the W on kung fu flicks and re released them all with new names. Belly movie / ost. Black and white movie / ost. Killer beez had hits in europe with la saga and had an entire euro only releases before any act in rap. Eventually that lead to a slew of score / ost side releases and they again dominated the underground market.

Rza basically… worked a deal with EVERY label so wu stayed being promoted.

always had tie ins for every album. On a whole diff level. Hed score. Then have a side ost. Then a solo album. Then a group album. Then a wu comp. Then another solo. And anothrr score. Then a european album / mixtape. Now he does jingles for ad campaigns and promotes all types of products and keeps wus music in commercials like its mtv in 90s.

Everything was carefully crafted to different markets/sub cultures. Even in doing kill bill ghost dog and afro samurai. Which is why i saw gunns wwf thing a mile away and knew some day someone would use that shyt even in 90s.


Bcc could barely hold one consistant sound with 4 diff groups for 4 albums.. It didnt pop like wu. They couldnt compete with wu sonically let alone business wise and rzas vision of sampling

 

[Sean7]

All time album fumble and momentum killer

HUGE momentum killer, that was it... After that they were never the same.

 

[L $ C]

Let me guess, this is a havoc and prodege that you prefer

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